Trope Pantheon Story thread

Okay, now that I am back, let's see the whole mess with yanderes.

• On the whole rape thing, I am not saying they can't, but that doesn't mean they have. In fact, Yuno was almost gang-raped by Tsubaki's cult (who herself was a Sex Slave) and both Kotonoha and Sekai can end up getting raped by same guy. Really, only ones I can think of who really have (tried) to rape someone are Tsukuyomi, Kaixa in the novel and I think Mana.
• Speaking of which, I think Kotonoha and Sekai are really meant to be from good endings from the VN... while having tropes relating to the bad endings. I don't know.
• Nu... honestly, I have no clue what is Nu's deal now. In CP Extend, she is ranting how Ragna "rejected" her and wants to kill everything, but in CF, she is back wanting to merge with Ragna.
• As faso mentioned, there are also Kamen Rider Kaixa (who is more of Chaotic Ass) and Inugami (passive-agressive hatred for everything, but not outright evil)
• Yandere-chan... is hard to really pinpoint. The basics with her is that she is insane sociopath, but also an Empty Shell. She doesn't have any real emotions aside of her love for Senpai (or to be more specific, her love to be able to love Senpai) and anger for those who would try to take him away from her. You only have to get rid of those who would actually confess to him and that's it. And how you want to do it is up to you. You can potentially play the whole game without spilling any blood.

The issue with Kotonoha and Sekai is even more complex. The main selling point of their series is in fact the yandere bad endings. Thus we have an explanation as to why all the adaptations (manga and anime) end up taking the path of bad endings in some form.

Is Diva from Blood Plus in here? If so, then she is a good candidate for the YS, and is like Tsukuyomi in certain regards.

Question being when did the infection begin, given Ms Deathwing spawn's Slasher Smile gaze upon Shu before he was even born.

edited 12th May '16 11:42:37 AM by magnum12

Whenever whirl decides to do something then yeah, she will ascend at some point.

About Mana, you all have to remember that she was corrupted by The Virus and when she died (a second time) she more or less returned to her old self. It would seem like she still has the virus here but she is much more stable.

@ YHVH: His true nature? That He's genuinely evil by human standards and His godhood is a position, not something inherent to His being.

OK, in the Reformation in Law, the first part is that secret coming out to some. YHVH doesn't want anyone to know it, since it means that His position of "Overdeity of Law" can be taken away. So He gets help. The first part ends with both sides using this as a means of starting a civil war. Second part are people picking sides and the brawl. Third part is the meat of the conflict, where the finest warriors of both sides do battle. Fourth part is an epic battle between the two leaders in this civil war, and the epilogue are both the recovery of the victors/losers and the other four alignments considering what this change will mean for them. Especially Lucifer

Nothing on any page seems to refer Diva as a yandere and where Tsukuyomi tried to rape someone, Diva actually managed to. And then she killed the person. And started impersonating them. That is like Everyone Has Standards levels of what. It was also a Stalker with a Test Tube scenario, as she wanted to get pregnant.

edited 12th May '16 11:26:11 PM by TPPR10

So I was thinking of this Litchi and Pantheon Civil War think, and I'm wondering if the focus should of been about those Karma Houdini and Easily Forgiven good guys and whether or not they should have been punish.

@Magnum If it helps, Mana was infected since she was 5 years old (Or 3 i can't really remember that well)

Funny you compare her to D-Wing as they both were essentially corrupted. Hell, the source of corruption for both came from space (Mana was infected by a meteorite while The Old Gods came from space as well)

Man, i think i'll have to watch Guilty Crown only because i think the only one that watched it was Toony (And the guy that ascended them). Dis gon b gud

Well, she herself has potential to end up that way. Maybe she will be sorry, or survive with her good heart intact, but people will think that she's Easily Forgiven and being a Karma Houdini that her time of helping Relius goes unpunished.

This is why I prefer to build things up until Central Fiction ended.

Still, I wonder if you can elaborate what you mean about the focus being the Karma Houdini good guys? That kind of depends, because the definition can be very weird. Hell, Kokonoe can be considered as such, and she's the one enforcing the 'justice'. To wit: She's hellishly amoral and would use anyone like a pawn as long as it suits her and screw everything else, like her treatment to Lambda, or her ignorance of Litchi, and previously in CP, being murderous to Bullet the moment she gets close to whatever little secret she has. By standards, if the good guys win, she will be a Karma Houdini. But hey, she opposes what the fandom see as evil, Terumi, instead of furthering his plan, all is forgiven and it's okay, she'll not be a Karma Houdini, but The Woobie who's Crazy Awesome!

... Yeah, I know it's fucked up. I observed that the fandom really values those who Will Not Be a Victim, and those who are victims of anything... target to be considered weak, useless, bash-worthy.

edited 14th May '16 4:40:14 AM by ChrisX

Ok, for example, Sasuke Uchiha from Natuto. Many fans believe he got off way too easily despite being a massive jerk to Naruto and Sakura. I feel I need to explain it more. But it deals with good guys that fans think don't deserve forgiveness or need to do way mire things to Warren it.

Good job in pointing out Sasuke. He definitely seems fit to become a victim or a hunted one.

Sasuke pretty much spends at least 12 years (possibly a minimum of 14 years depending on when Naruto and Hinata got married) trying to atone for what he's done by the end of the manga, so he deserves it.

Idea: Civil War becomes a catalyst for the formation of Way To the Dawn.

edited 14th May '16 8:27:51 PM by magnum12

Diva legit raped someone, she can't have the high ground just because it was a Stalker with a Test Tube or she's a chick.

Can we do more with the GUAE and GUAG when they've been refurbished?

The big problem with that is those "atoning" was never shown. So some fans don't buy it.

This would be the opposite of characters like Cure Beat and Passion who did do bad things but showed genuine remorse for their actions and were shown atoning by being Precure and help people.

edited 14th May '16 8:35:19 PM by WhirlRX

Question: Seeing that the civil war focus on people who have made polarizing choices or affected the world in some way, i'm curious to know which side would Medivh choose

Dont know.

Medivh could be one of those guys who discover the alternate dimension where the avatar of 'expectation' reside. This is a guy who opened the portal for the Burning Legion after all.

So he could be a key character for the story. The thing is, what would be the reason for his involvement? I guess atonement right?

Putting my foot down here; why is the Reformation of Law already out there? Specifically, why is there an ending when we haven't even made a starter chapter? And since when did we say Madoka is going to be the hero of it? I thought we had enough of them hogging the spotlight!

If you have an idea for how it ends, save it for your own sandbox, don't proclaim it all "official" until we say its official. You don't reveal the goddamn ending as the first thing!

Slow yourself.

His involvement might be rather minor, but a rather crucial one, nonetheless. If you ask for a reason, rather than atonement, Medivh would probably prefer it to not let history repeat again, as of atonement, he has done it in Mt. Hyjal. In here, it is probably because he saw the ongoing Morality Civil War sounds more like a petty war based on pride rather than true unity. It's like how Azeroth ended up post Mt. Hyjal, with Alliance-Horde once again spiraling into war.

Fun way to say it for Medivh: "Enough is ENOUGH!! I have HAD IT with these MOTHERFUCKIN' War-With-Each-Other-Because-Of-Silly-Things on this MOTHERFUCKIN' EXISTENCE!!" (Yes, 'existence', not just the Pantheon)

He won't say it like that, promise. He's not Samuel L Jackson

Also I would like to have one thing changed from the original MCW: Rather than Bang eventually going for 'the audience' side AKA the old 'Camp B/Anti' group, I want him to be with team Alucard-Captain America. Basically, it gets Bang to see how in the alternate world, he's basically a celebrity, a Memetic Badass given the worship he so deserved, but at cost of many people that do not follow his ideals, including Litchi and Carl (see below). I think Bang would be absolutely crushed that his 'justice' is perverted like that, but it could be a crux of a possible Character Development.

Also I confirm another possible victim: Carl Clover. In CF, well... he ended up deducing that he's just like Relius and then starts adopting his mannerisms... all in the name of saving his sister. This won't sit well to the 'Camp B/Anti' Group, and basically target him as well, with this ultimatum: "You will FORGET about your sister, you will MOVE ON, consider her dead beyond reach and do good deeds like how Bang has taught you, and if you insist that you still want to save your sister or still think the world is just revolving to your sister, then we will punish you for being selfish and uncaring for the innocents for not tapping onto the power of goodness in you... WE WILL FUCKING KILL YOU"

Yeah, of course Carl will absolutely refuse, but that's kinda how they work: Fight for the common justice and 'freedom', throw away your personal feelings and emotions and desires for that great goal, and if you don't, you're a despicable person.

I'd like to hear input from what you think the more 'moral' good guys will think. Supes, Cap, Madoka, the Kamen Riders, etc. Ya think?

edited 15th May '16 10:58:25 PM by ChrisX

The heroic Kamen Riders (and by extension, most Toku heroes) would probably wanted to stop the conflict between two heroic factions, then they must join forces with them to fight a real threat behind this civil war. To be honest, this is what I think so far when it comes to this.

Probably, after all, the heroic Kamen Riders are fighting for the sake of human freedom. Don't you think?

edited 16th May '16 12:04:16 AM by n3xus

However, they will receive pressure from the mass. They are, after all, the champions of justice and most of the other time freedom. The mass and Camp B would probably expect them to honor justice and punish the violators. If they are told to do that kind of 'forcing' so people will follow to the ways of justice... how will they response? Something like...

"Aren't you champions of justice and freedom? They are violating those codes with their actions! Punish them, or more people will violate freedom and justice!"

I was hoping for the Riders calling out that their brand of 'justice' and 'freedom' are completely misguided, it sounded more like 'forcing others to convert to their beliefs that they thought superior, sounds more like antithesis of freedom.', but I don't know if it would sound proper. Somewhere along the line "You call THIS to be justice!? No, this is not justice at all, it's just some people forcing their mindsets and ideals to others! Stop sugarcoating your pushed ideals with sweet words like 'justice'!"

Or maybe this would fit better if this goes to the 'Pro' group, the guys who are protecting the targets because they believe in freedom and think the 'Anti' group and their hunt goes too far.

edited 16th May '16 12:00:10 AM by ChrisX

Okay sorry for Double Post, but this is for the edit Nexus had. Also, for convenience's sake, I'm gonna say Pro Team to be Camp A, Anti Team to be Camp B. Just like the old times.

Freedom of mankind, yes. However, Camp B is trying to curb 'freedom to do selfish things that could be disastrous for mankind.' In the case of Carl, they are trying to curb his freedom to save his sister, because they KNOW it will lead to disaster, that is, him turning out to have the same mindset of Relius, so they think that rather than the disaster to come, they will curb and limit Carl's actions, and if necessary, brainwash him to forget about his sister. And here, we talk about someone who will stop at absolutely nothing to reach that goal of saving his sister. Even if the only available road is to be evil. Camp B believes that if people get stubborn, they will interfere and do a 'reformatting for 'the greater good'', they will guide people to walk the righteous path to always oppose evil.

Would that also be opposed by Kamen Rider? They are after all trying to prevent great evils by making sure these people do not freely cross the line and focus on what is important.

This can also be a food for thought if Faso comes. Thing is, we know Jaina Proudmoore is always on the side of peace like a Disney Princess, but I was thinking that it would be good if she is featured in the alternate worlds... as an example of someone who suffers from the whole 'world ruled by expectation'. In that world, the group meets a post-Theramore Jaina, that is, the grumpy Jaina. But she's found to be already captured and then tortured, because in the world's law 'There are more important things to do than swearing vengeance on the Horde, like preventing the world to be ravaged by the Burning Legion, but how DARE you get blinded by your emotions and grief and then going anti-Horde! YOU ARE A SELFISH CRIMINAL THAT MUST BE PUNISHED!'. I'm not sure if this is going to make people actually pity that racist!Jaina, I don't like that version either, but I might make her look pity-worthy (though I know you don't care about her, so I'm not trying to make you care).

That said I'm not sure if I'd take the current Jaina to Alucard's team, and the reaction of that world... Not sure, worship her for doing as the audience expects? Or still hunt her down, because I think she still has her detractors because "Boo boo at pacifism." (On the other hand, I did include Bang in Alucard's team, he's probably the antithesis of that, along with Cap and maybe Alucard. Everyone in that world worships the ground they walk on.)

This is basically to show that ideals like justice, freedom and peace look good in paper... but sometimes, people like to go overboard to push those ideals, to the point they might even look bad at trying to push such ideals, and make people re-think whether it's worth pursuing such ideals if it means brainwashing the whole society.

edited 16th May '16 1:37:21 AM by ChrisX

Where is Robin Hood when you most need him. No seriously. In relation to Kamen Rider, in Kamen Rider Ghost, the ghost of Robin Hood talks to Takeru about people's sense of justice:

Note that Takeru, an All-Loving Hero who has actually gone out of his way of thinking that there are some good in monsters who in overall try to cause assimilation to mankind, is trying to mediate between Makoto, who previously was so determent on reviving his sister that he would almost kill his old friend (Takeru) for it, who then Took a Level in Kindness after she was revived thanks to Takeru's selfishness and now tries to fight to protect the world he, his sister and his friends live in, and Alain, one of of the villains who believes in his father's Well-Intentioned Extremist ideals to create an utopia (what to humans looks like an dystopia, as he comes to realize). And Alain is borderline yandere for Makoto, as he believes that he betrayed him for going soft. When a freaking outlaw has better understanding on people's ideologies and how different they can be and that even if they don't match, they aren't wrong on believing what they want, you know you have your head up your ass.

edited 16th May '16 5:46:08 AM by TPPR10

Man, I got to start watching Ghost. I stop at three.