Note: If a newly launched trope was already given a No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only designation while it was being drafted on the Trope Launch Pad, additions to the proper index do not need to go through this thread. Instead, simply ask the mods to add the trope via this thread
.
This is the thread to report tropes with problematic Real Life sections.
Common problems include:
- Conversation on the Main Page
- Flame Bait
- Squicky content
- Impossible in Real Life
Real Life sections on the wiki are kept as long as they don't become a problem. If you find an article with such problems, report it here. Please note that the purpose of this thread is to clean up and maintain real life sections, not raze them. Cutting should be treated as a last resort, so please only suggest cutting RL sections or a subset thereof you think the examples in question are completely unsalvageable.
If historical RL examples are not causing any problems, consider whether it would be better to propose a No Recent Examples, Please! (via this forum thread) for RL instead of NRLEP. If RL examples are causing problems only for certain subjects, consider whether a Limited Real Life Examples Only restriction would be preferable to NRLEP.
If you think a trope should be No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only, then this thread is the place to discuss it. However, please check Keep Real Life Examples first to see if it has already been brought up in the past. If not, state the reasons and add it to the crowner.
Before adding to the crowner:
- The trope should be proposed in the thread, along with reasons for why a crowner is necessary instead of a cleanup.
- There must be support from others in thread.
- Any objections should be addressed.
- Allow a minimum of 24 hours for discussion.
When adding to the crowner:
- Be sure to add the trope name, a link to where the discussion started, the reasons for crownering, whether the restriction being proposed is NRLEP or LRLEO (and in the latter case, which subject(s) the restriction would be for), and the date added.
- Announce in thread that you are adding the item.
- An ATT advert should be made as well (batch items together if more than one trope goes up in a day).
In order for a crowner to pass:
- Must have been up for a minimum of a week
- There must be a 2:1 ratio
- If the vote is exactly 2:1 or +/- 1 vote from that, give it a couple extra days to see if any more votes come in
- Once passed, tropes must be indexed on the appropriate NRLEP index
- Should the vote fail, the trope should be indexed on KRLE page
Sex Tropes, Rape and Sexual Harassment Tropes, and Morality Tropes are banned from having RL sections so tropes under those indexes don't need crowner vote.
Crowner entries that have already been called will have "(CLOSED)" appended to them — and are no longer open for discussion.
After bringing up a trope for discussion, please wait at least a day for feedback before adding it to the crowner.
NRLEP tag:
%%https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13350380440A15238800
LRLEO tag:
%%The following restrictions apply: [list restriction(s) here]
%%https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13350380440A15238800
Notes:
- This thread is not for general discussion regarding policies for Real Life sections or crowners. Please take those conversations to this Wiki Talk thread.
- Do not try to overturn previous No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only decisions without a convincing argument.
- As mentioned here, the consensus is that NRLEP warnings in trope page descriptions can use bold text so that they stand out.
- The [[noreallife]] tag doesn't currently work. This is a deprecated tag that was introduced many years ago — originally, it would have displayed a NRLEP warning banner when you edited the page. However, there's been some staff conversation (Feb 2024) about what a new technical solution might look like, so we'd advise against deleting these from pages, at least until we have a decision as to whether it'll be fixed or replaced.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 8th 2024 at 10:49:13 AM
Lost in Space
The argument goes that we are the audience of our own lives, and so count as an audience for trope purposes. There's a valid philosophical argument there, but it's not one that we intend to have vis-a-vis this particular topic, which is whether we permit Real Life examples for certain tropes.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
"We allow Real Life examples because they can be illustrative and entertaining."
...is there anything more illustrative of the whole wham concept (i.e. shocking, twist, change of status quo) as, say, 9/11 or the JFK assassination was for Americans?
"However, when they turn into Flame Bait, when they crowd out the fictional examples, when they make value judgments about real people — this is where we have to draw the line."
Were the real life examples doing any of the above?
Moe moe killing machine
Nominated Fat Bastard. It is a villain trope, and therefore it definitely has to go.
"Suffer a vicious person and you will fear vice. Suffer a virtuous one and you will soon loathe virtue itself." Tony Duvert
Lost in Space
@kipz 61: "Shocking twist" requires that there be a narrative for the twist to hang off of. Real Life has shocking things happen all the time but there is no narrative. I mean, for an individual person, getting unexpectedly laid off, or being in a car crash, or discovering that you have cancer might be shocking, but there's no author plotting the course of your life and no audience watching you from behind a screen. Narrative tropes cannot exist in Real Life, period, ever.
edited 6th Dec '12 6:34:58 AM by Fighteer
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
"In distress", my ass.
Calling Fridge Horror - 3rd Dec '12 at 07:36:15 PM, 6:1 (21)
All your safe space are belong to Trump
At the very least, "Most rapists." is a lousy example.
Oppression anywhere is a threat to democracy everywhere.
...Racists, not rapists.
Ah, I see. Still Zero Context, though. Also inaccurate — a lot of racial prejudice takes the form of "all X are lazy/stupid/dirty/primitive/poor" instead of violence or hatred.
edited 6th Dec '12 4:01:03 PM by ArcadesSabboth
Oppression anywhere is a threat to democracy everywhere.
Not precisely the topic here, but the section on Sex Tropes in No Real Life Examples Please has a lot of "explanations" that needlessly insult people, e.g "We do not need to hear how dirty your mind is, troper!"
Can we give some better reasons there?
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
As Troper Tales proved, those reasons are pretty much the literal truth.
Lost in Space
Yep. Those are exactly the reasons why they are NRLEP. Sad, but true.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Calling Fat Bastard (uncontested) and Irrational Hatred (14:1)
edited 8th Dec '12 11:18:46 AM by EarlOfSandvich
I now go by Graf von Tirol.
Thread maintainer: please use Mon / 00 / 0000 or some other instantly recognisable format for crowner update dates. Many of us are not from the USA.
No, the other one.
Other than that I prefer a decremental (YYYY-MM-DD, ISO standard) or if necessary an incremental format (DD/MM/YYYY), I don't see what's wrong with "[Added 5th Dec '12 at 09:40:50 PM]", as the top one has.
Check out my fanfiction!
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
I think they were referring to the thread title, not the items in the crowner.
No, the other one.
Fair enough. I don't see it as an important date for non-thread maintainers, so I didn't consider it.
Check out my fanfiction!
I've noticed that Ms. Fanservice doesn't seem to be NRLEP, and it's "Other" page is all Real Life. Do people think it should be NRLEP, or is it fine the way it is? Or it should be "no specific real life examples" since the supermodel and stewardess examples don't seem problematic at all.
edited 13th Dec '12 8:31:00 AM by ArcadesSabboth
Oppression anywhere is a threat to democracy everywhere.
Fanservice is by definition deliberate. So the actress or similar examples need to be flushed down the drain.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
No, the other one.
Are you saying they don't deliberately provide fanservice?
Check out my fanfiction!
No, the other one.
I think the Sexy Stewardess example does say something about it, or at least the purpose and how that trope was born, but the rest aren't really exemplary. Still, I don't see that as a reason to disallow Real Life examples. Remove or rewrite those ones, sure, but not a permanent purge.
Check out my fanfiction!
Sexy Stewardess has a huge Wall of Text saying why they aren't made for sexy. It would be Fetish Fuel at any rate.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Lost in Space
That Wall of Text belongs in Analysis — holy crap.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Crown Description:
Vote up to either forbid all real life examples (No Real Life Examples Please) or forbid real life examples for specific subjects (Limited Real Life Examples Only); vote down to Keep Real Life Examples. To add a trope to a No Real Life Examples Please index or the Limited Real Life Examples Only index, its crowner option must meet the following criteria:- Stable 2:1 ratio needed for NRLEP or LRLEO
- Must have been up for a minimum of a week
- If the vote is exactly 2:1 or +/- 1 vote from that, give it a couple of extra days to see if more votes come in.
People are arguing now whether or not Real Life is objectively known to be scripted and to have an audience which is external to reality? Seriously?
If this imaginary audience is external to all reality (aka Real Life) then how do you know it's there, huh?
Performances, advertisements, speeches, propaganda, jokes, folksongs, articles of clothing, and other human works are works. They have authors and audiences. This is not the same thing as a group of angels sitting outside the entire universe watching us all with popcorn.
Oppression anywhere is a threat to democracy everywhere.