General Digimon Topic

You get a Mega! And you get a Mega! EVERYONE GETS A MEGA!

I think it was explicitly stated in Tamers.

Tamers and Savers. In Savers'', everyone got the Super Mode, too.

Actually, a tiny slew of characters didn't get a Mega option. The two bridge bunnies and the old man who gave Marcus his digivice. Likewise, only 5 of them got Burst Mode(the main 4 and Marcus' dad).

It did it the most, though. Tamers came a bit closer, with only two with currently alive Digimon that didn't go Mega. Leomon was killed, so... no chance to do so. Andromon nor Antylamon went Mega. In fact, many of the random Digimon went Mega before some Tamers', oddly enough.

Every enemy monster barring Mephistomon and Baromon(whom Toei Animation seems to have hard a hard on for) was weak in the that Tamers movie.

Anyway, Zeromaru was hardly "overpowered", initially. A slow defensive model with the ability to temporarily boost attack power at the expense of lifespan extensively trained to master fighting techniques most wild monsters would never come close to on their own(training, hard work, mastery-I miss the days when those were the tenets of Digimon instead of emotion induced transformation sequences). He was outmatched by a superior defensive type in Tortomon and the much faster Kuwagamon, monsters of his own level only defeated through superior strategy. Even the super special AreoV-Dramon was stated outright to be over matched by its higher leveled adversaries without outsmarting them.

His last two forms you could say, but considering one could only be reached with energy lent from 20 odd monsters and the other required an upgrade artifact that needed at least three tamers to activate(making it both rare in universe, where one human where one human in the Digimon World was supposed to the sign of a disaster, let alone three, as well as out of universe, where only two v-pets could link up) I don't see what makes them any worse than say, Omegamon.

• On another note, since we talked about the origins of monsters, it's kind of surprising Rosemon is probably the most used of all the monsters created in V-Tamer. I guess that should have been foreshadowing to the ridiculous attempts at Fanservice that would come later. Nowadays she seems tame...restrained...compared to Lilithmon, Sanzomon, Venusmon, Mervamon...

I kind of dislike how Digimon has been slowly veering into Monster Girl fetishes with its female mon designs. They've always been somewhat scantily clad, but it got pretty blatant with Kazemon in Frontier (which is creepy when you consider that she's technically a human in middle school), and really blatant with Mervamon in Xros Wars. I'm not normally one for censorship but Fusion kind of made the right decision to not show cameltoe shots to children. :/

Because kids shouldn't see a hint of a vulva, but being assimilated from the inside out is totally okay?

I still don't get why sex is worse than violence.

Digimon's violence has generally been fairly abstract in that none of the wounds inflicted appear all too realistic. At the very worst you just get Bloodless Carnage, and many of the monsters its inflicted on aren't even remotely human, which makes it even less realistic. Plus the dubs have been known to add in a Hit Flash or cut out certain scenes which are more violent (for example, editing out some of the scenes of Ken abusing Wormmon.)

I don't really mind female Digimon being attractive, but it's just gotten more and more blatant in recent series. Angewomon was attractive, certainly, but it wasn't so in-your-face about it.

If I have an issue, it's that it's always women who this happens to. "Oh, we don't have that nudity taboo." is usually an excuse for sexual depictions of women. "Violence good, nudity bad!" is usually uttered when a violent show decides to strip a strong woman of all her gear for titillation, while leaving the dudes fully clothed.

When it truly is more even, if Digimon was more even for example, if there were a bunch of pretty boy monsters in trunks and some vague feature to reminds us "yeah, he's a monster", but it rarely ever is and Digimon is no exception. About the only thing we got is Lucemon, whose modeled after a prepubescent.

I could type a whole lot about the subject, but I won't because I made a mistake. Daemon's the most used monster to debut in V-Tamer, Rosemon's actually started from a video game I keep forgetting about. The topic we should instead be on is the irony that Daemon debuted before Seraphimon. Of course, the original Daemon was supposed to be a mutant, not a fallen angel. That's another thing, I make mistakes sometimes but the Digimon reference book seemed to take a lot of liberties with the V-tamer monsters, sometimes missing the point entirely.

edited 29th Apr '15 6:45:40 AM by IndirectActiveTransport

They really have ratcheted up the fanservice in recent incarnations of the franchise. That said, Angewomon was fairly fanservice-y, too (both in terms of her outfit and her Cat Fight with LadyDevimon), so they've always been doing it to some degree.

What I want to see is what some of the really heavily-armored Digimon look like. We've never seen Magnamons or Imperialdramon Fight Mode's faces and for all we know, LordKnightmon is just an empty suit of armor.

edited 27th Apr '15 9:07:17 AM by Ghostninja109

It's sort of to be expected with Lilithmon.

And then her first Digifused form came in... and thus, the joke fell flat.

My guess? It's probably to appeal to the nostalgic twentysomethings who've been following since the beginning.

She still did a better job of it than LadyDevimon. LadyDevimon didn't really...do it for me.

Dem, Laylamon was turned into a flail-swinging flat-chested small girl. XD

Gotta agree with you on that, IAT. Nudity taboo is one thing (but still overblown IMO, as there are far worse things than a naked body), but asymmetrical treatment of it due to gender is inexcusable.

Still, cultural values in this field are, well, odd, and quite inconsistent anyway.

Aw bugger. :(

She's not even the most fanservicey Demon Lord; Belle Starrmon/Beelstarrmon is a thing after all...

How can she not be when she's named after the great progenitor of succubi? :S

Lilithmon is one of the more blatant examples. On her own, she may not draw the attention of Venusmon or Mervamon, but the Olympus XII are based on...the Olympus XII. It would have been fair to make Apollo, representation of young men, look as such, Mercury(Meruki?) look like a rugged overpaid doctor or charming rogue thief, but all the same, you knew 5-6 women were going to be in it anyway.

The Seven great demon lords purposefully threw out Ashmedai/Asmodeus for Lilith. Lilith didn't represent "lust", but prostitution^note Lilith was a kind of animal listed among various birds, the demon whore is a Voodoo Shark stolen from someone else.. Ashmedia was something most would be terrified to have sex that terrorized people till they gave it to him, and doesn't that make more sense? The other demon lords don't all look the part either but they didn't go as far to make the gluttony monster a refrigerator, the sloth monster reclining chair. That would have been kind of cool, but only one of them getting that treatment shows it was only done because they wanted "fan service".

edited 27th Apr '15 1:38:18 PM by IndirectActiveTransport

Wasn't Lilith, in noncanonical Judaic mythology, a woman created as an equal to Adam, rather than derived from, to begin with? Then some demonic stuff and the like.

Didn't know that was a thing until now. Seems like they just made Bayonetta a Digimon.

edited 27th Apr '15 2:58:43 PM by wanderlustwarrior

Adam always had two wives, or rather, the creation of humans is told twice, two different ways, one right after the other, in the bible, which can be interpreted as having two wives (or any number of ways, really)

Lilith was some kind of animal whose specifics have been lost to time. The Sumerians had Lilitu, the prostitute, the Babylonians and Mandeans had a race of demons called Liliths(which the Jews were aware of-given the Lilith King Bagdana's mention on their incantation bowls), and somehow, someway, all of those became one entity during Europe's middle ages.

Short answer, yes.

Lilith was also said to be a demoness governing all the bad aspects of the night. In extra biblical Jewish tradition, she had a Good Counterpart, a female angel personifying the good aspects of the night. That angel's name? Lailah or Layla!

Well, Lilith and Layla are related in that sense. I can see why they chose that name. Even if it's rather ironic.

@Dem: That's only when Lilithmon is forcefully digifused with Blastmon. That said, I think all of the forced Digifuses in Season 2 were... kind of lame, to be honest. I mean, they did lead up to it with the Darkness Loader being made in Season 1, so it was clearly noted it could happen, but it feels like an excuse to quickly make up some new form. I mean, it made sense, fight fire with fire and all. It happens in many seasons.

However, Neo Myotismon is the exception to me. But only because he could forcefully digifuse with other Digimon that were connected to another Loader. Albeit, this seemed like a really special thing... and then Wisemon, who is part of Mikey's team, could be used by Nene's loader(albeit, she did join the Fusion Fighters specifically, but it still didn't make much sense). What made Neo Myotismon special didn't even matter at that point. It was just a thing that could happen anyway.

I think one issue is they made it look like outside of Double Fusion at best, you could only digifuse with those in your own Fusion Loader. So maybe it was just a bad impression at once. Still, I do feel like Wisemon should be in Nene's Loader now. Either way, though, I can't wait for the next new episode. Or them to play Season 2 more. Weird that they just went back to Season 1...

As far as violence goes, Digimon is actually pretty high on the scale. Sure bloodless carnage and careful zooming are there to avoid going into the gore category, but the deaths themselves are consistently brutal (well, frontier would count if not for it's enormous plot armor)...

Adventure has plenty of examples

02 little less in general, but with some extreme spikes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ww51W3OP1TQ

Tamers has some extreme zooming out action because it's the rule, not the exception

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJgPlJnXzsY

With Savers it only really started when kurata got involved

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmko19MH8r0

And in Xros Wars, it's kinda random

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=By2qs4WRms8

Especially since unlike in many series supposedly for older people, the protagonists themselves are not restrained from actually killing. Nor are humans excluded either, like osamu's death or all those drivers in battle of adventurers, or even kurata (even if techically they Never Found the Body).

edited 29th Apr '15 5:37:02 AM by lgcruz