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Serac Since: Mar, 2016
21st Oct, 2020 08:55:24 AM

The entry as it is now on Historical Hero Upgrade:

  • Mahatma Gandhi's almost certainly time this. The messy nature of Indian independence and it's pretty filled status afterwards has resulted in glossing over his more unsavory aspects. The man himself seems to have held some pretty racist views such as chiding black people for trying to get independent status like Indians, his misogynist attitudes to the point of beating his wife for not cleaning the latrines despite her ill health and his luddism towards technology which pushed the industrialization of India back decades and dismantled much of the industry needed while simply letting himself benefit from those same things.

I agree that it has some pretty awful grammar, but I thought that commenting entire examples out was only for if they're zero-context, not for grammar problems. If an example is poorly written, you can rewrite it yourself or delete it for dragging down the overall quality of the article.

Also, I have to question the value of having an entire folder for general examples that seems to amount to "every famous historical figure ever receives this treatment".

Edited by Serac
BoltDMC Since: May, 2020
21st Oct, 2020 09:30:58 AM

It’s not zero content, but it’s very unclear what the writer means in some cases. It’s also not clear that any of the information it lists is even correct. I even did some digging earlier to try and verify the information. Other than Gandhi being (likely) racist in his earlier days in South Africa, I haven’t been able to confirm any of the other issues. I haven’t been able to corroborate the issues behind shabby treatment of his wife, or for Luddite tendencies hurting the Indian economy (in fact I’ve encountered articles that say this isn’t the case).

The entry needs not just a rewrite, but a serious fact check. I’m fine with the entry being reworked and fact-vetted, but I don’t know enough of the facts here to do such a rewrite. I’m thinking there’s no call to have an article with bogus English and unverified accusations up and visible.

The Trope itself is a potential magnet for subjective complaining, and it’s pretty surprising it’s in as good a shape as it is now. Could be a lot worse.

I definitely encourage anyone with good knowledge on the subject to make the needed fixes. I’m unfortunately not knowledgable enough to do this.

Edited by BoltDMC
WarJay77 (Troper Knight)
21st Oct, 2020 09:50:48 AM

If anything, I'd remove it and bring it to the English Thread.

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
wingedcatgirl MOD (Holding A Herring)
21st Oct, 2020 10:01:05 AM

"This particular historical figure frequently gets a Historical Hero Upgrade" is not an example, and that entire folder should be burned with fire. y'know as opposed to burning with oreos

And the page has two quotes, because of course it does.

Edited by wingedcatgirl Trouble Cube continues to be a general-purpose forum for those who desire such a thing.
BoltDMC Since: May, 2020
21st Oct, 2020 10:21:03 AM

Taking the entry to the English Thread might help with wording, true enough. Unfortunately, it won't verify the content accuracy, which is an important issue here as well — and I don't know the subject matter well enough.

I'd rather just re-suppress the entry and leave it at that if I can. But again, that's Edit War territory.

WarJay77 (Troper Knight)
21st Oct, 2020 10:46:27 AM

There is also a fact checking thread

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
BoltDMC Since: May, 2020
21st Oct, 2020 11:18:15 AM

Thanks everyone. I'll try the Fact Checking Thread first. Hopefully, I'll get some answers afterwards. I can probably fix the English in the entry myself — I'll just have to make up whatever seems reasonable as a lead-in rather than try and puzzle out what the original Troper was trying to say.

Is it all right to suppress the entry while it's being worked on? Again, I don't want to Edit War. I plan to leave a note and link about it, if I get an okay from here.

BoltDMC Since: May, 2020
21st Oct, 2020 11:22:21 AM

^^^ Wingedcatgirl, should this trope be reported to the Trope Repair Shop or someplace similar? I've never done something like this — but if that's the way to handle it, is it okay if I cite your objections? I'm not knowledgeable enough here.

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