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Rename: Xen Syndrome

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Prfnoff Since: Jan, 2001
#1: Oct 5th 2010 at 7:16:44 AM

This really isn't a good trope name; it's verbally clunky, opaque in meaning and not a pre-existing term.

Suggested rename title: Late Game Doldrums

Deboss I see the Awesomeness. from Awesomeville Texas Since: Aug, 2009
I see the Awesomeness.
Shale Mighty pirate! from Int'l House of Mojo Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
Mighty pirate!
#3: Oct 5th 2010 at 8:21:15 AM

dol·drums (dldrmz, dôl-, dl-) pl.n. (used with a sing. or pl. verb) a. A period of stagnation or slump. b. A period of depression or unhappy listlessness.

Madrugada Zzzzzzzzzz Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: In season
Zzzzzzzzzz
#4: Oct 5th 2010 at 8:31:51 AM

Phoned In The Ending. or Phoned In The Last Levels

...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
Stratadrake Dragon Writer Since: Oct, 2009
Dragon Writer
#5: Oct 5th 2010 at 8:33:44 AM

Doldrums: A proud resident of the English dictionary for nearly 200 years.

An Ear Worm is like a Rickroll: It is never going to give you up.
DRCEQ Since: Oct, 2009
#6: Oct 5th 2010 at 8:38:31 AM

The word doldrum was first coined by the seafaring explorers. The areas between the Tropics and the Equator don't have very strong winds, so explorers often found themselves slowing down significantly to the point of making very little travel while heading through them. Usually, they were at the mercy of where the water currents took them, since they had no wind to pull the sails.

Deboss I see the Awesomeness. from Awesomeville Texas Since: Aug, 2009
DRCEQ Since: Oct, 2009
#8: Oct 5th 2010 at 9:57:53 AM

Phoned In The Last Levels since this is EXCLUSIVELY a video game trope.

Madrugada Zzzzzzzzzz Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: In season
Zzzzzzzzzz
#9: Oct 5th 2010 at 10:04:24 AM

That works, too.

...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#10: Oct 5th 2010 at 11:11:54 AM

I like Phoned In The Last Level. Keep it singular so that it can be pluralized with {{ }}.

edited 5th Oct '10 11:12:23 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
JackMackerel from SOME OBSCURE MEDIA Since: Jul, 2010
#11: Oct 5th 2010 at 11:16:05 AM

Bad Last Levels. I'm surprised the last rename attempt fell through, because I've seen several people come in and state Xen wasn't bad.

edited 5th Oct '10 11:18:00 AM by JackMackerel

Half-Life: Dual Nature, a crossover story of reasonably sized proportions.
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#12: Oct 5th 2010 at 11:20:07 AM

When I played Half Life, I never knew that the Xen level was supposed to be a Scrappy Level, so I just played it and dealt with it. The jumping puzzles were annoying as fuck, though.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
JackMackerel from SOME OBSCURE MEDIA Since: Jul, 2010
#13: Oct 5th 2010 at 11:43:51 AM

The only problem I ever had with the jumping puzzles was the Gonarch tossing me into the hole in the middle of her island.

Half-Life: Dual Nature, a crossover story of reasonably sized proportions.
Comonad This bacon is awesome from 19th Jan '38 3:14:07 AM Since: Jan, 2001
This bacon is awesome
#14: Oct 5th 2010 at 11:51:52 AM

105 wicks, 1209 inbound links. Those are fairly big, so there needs to be a better reason than that the name seems clunky.

edited 5th Oct '10 11:52:34 AM by Comonad

Torment liveblog is still hiatusing. You can vandalize my contributor page if you want something to do.
Madrugada Zzzzzzzzzz Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: In season
Zzzzzzzzzz
#15: Oct 5th 2010 at 12:16:26 PM

Making the current name a redirect will preserve those inbounds. It's a bad name for several reasons:

  • If you haven't played that particular game, "Xen" means nothing.
  • Whether that namer level is even an example appears to be subjective.
  • "Syndrome" adds no context at all — "syndrome" simply means "a group of characteristics or symptoms that commonly occur together." For someone who does know the Xen levels, the syndrome could easily be "lots of jumping and unbalanced gameplay" not "levels late in the game that are noticeably worse to play than earlier levels because they were rushed during development." In fact one of the subpoints under the Xen entry itself makes this assumption:
    The Half-Life expansion, Blue Shift, averts this in a long Xen level that features far less jumping puzzles and many more, much larger areas than its predecessor. The areas are also accented with more set peices like waterfalls and new rock structures, giving it much more detail.

edited 5th Oct '10 12:18:37 PM by Madrugada

...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
DragonQuestZ The Other Troper from Somewhere in California Since: Jan, 2001
The Other Troper
#16: Oct 5th 2010 at 2:51:11 PM

I also vote for Phoned In The Last Levels.

I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
EternalSeptember Since: Sep, 2010
#17: Oct 5th 2010 at 2:58:29 PM

^^ Actually, the first bullet point said "Xen from Half-Life is the Trope Namer. With annoying jumping puzzles..." So in this particular case, bad jumping puzzles and unbalanced gameplay are claimed to be the reason why it is an example of Xen Syndrome.

This example is as correct as saying that "Assassins Creed 2 averts Xen Syndrome by having as much stealth late in the game as in the beginning." ( AC 1 is noted for the lack of them)

Even if the inbounds would keep leading to the page, there were at least a thousand gamers who read the current title and probably some of them keep spreading it on forums. You know very well that we need more than your hypothetical misunderstandings to change it.

I agree that the syndrome part is a redundant, bad title element, I always shoot these down in the YKTTW, and I would agre to removing it from a longer title, but not if it means making up a completely new one.

edited 5th Oct '10 3:00:19 PM by EternalSeptember

Roxor Only Sane Fox from Land Down Under Since: Jan, 2001
Only Sane Fox
#18: Oct 5th 2010 at 5:54:52 PM

How about just Rushed Last Levels?

Accidental mistakes are forgivable, intentional ones are not.
Madrugada Zzzzzzzzzz Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: In season
Zzzzzzzzzz
#19: Oct 5th 2010 at 6:14:23 PM

That sounds like a timer speeds up or that the later levels hurry the player somehow.

...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
Treblain Not An Avatar Since: Nov, 2012
Not An Avatar
#20: Oct 5th 2010 at 7:30:59 PM

Endgame Quality Drop?

We're not just men of science, we're men of TROPE!
Comonad This bacon is awesome from 19th Jan '38 3:14:07 AM Since: Jan, 2001
This bacon is awesome
#21: Oct 5th 2010 at 7:32:45 PM

If I understand correctly, inbound link count is more a measure of how the name is doing than something we need to worry about damaging. If we could just dismiss inbound links like that, they wouldn't be listed as the first reason not to rename a trope on the guideline page. The idea is that if the name can spread that much, it's doing its job. So an argument that the name is bad and shouldn't work needs to be able to counteract the evidence that it's working.

That means arguments like the name being clunky and "syndrome" being a bad name element aren't good enough reasons to change a healthy name, even though I don't think anyone disagrees that they're true.

The argument that people might think it means something else about Xen would work, but there needs to be evidence that it's actually happening to a significant degree and causing enough misuse.

Torment liveblog is still hiatusing. You can vandalize my contributor page if you want something to do.
Elle Since: Jan, 2001
#22: Oct 5th 2010 at 8:12:48 PM

Just a suggestion and may be too punny, but: Final Level Xen (Zen? Xen? Get it?)

Camacan from Australiatown Since: Jan, 2001
Evilest_Tim A real American hero Since: Nov, 2009
A real American hero
#25: Oct 6th 2010 at 12:38:43 AM

I never knew that the Xen level was supposed to be a Scrappy Level, so I just played it and dealt with it. The jumping puzzles were annoying as fuck, though.

I'm surprised everyone remembers those and not that weird-ass puzzle where you had to open the claw-things on top of the mushroom-things and then free the shiny 2D diamonds so they can fly to the claws and get you a teleporter. Which can only be solved at the point you're just wandering around the room hitting the 'use' key at random.

Xen's about as classic an example as the infamous Volcano from Far Cry (in the latter case, even the devs admitted everyone who hadn't given up when the Trigens first appeared gave up there), and if we're going by links = good title (as we do for utterly opaque titles like Cowboy BeBop at His Computer or the various Japanese-language trope names), I can't really see how there's a good case for renaming rather than installing a redirect.

edited 6th Oct '10 12:39:09 AM by Evilest_Tim

It is shameful for a demon to be working, but one needs gold even in Hell these days.

SingleProposition: XenSyndrome
20th Apr '10 12:00:00 AM

Crown Description:

Do we rename Xen Syndrome?

Arguments in favor:
  • Non-indicative, example-named trope: The name derives from one specific level of one specific videogame, and means nothing to anyone else.
    • "X Syndrome" is a discredited naming convention; most snowclones fail the One Mario Limit.
  • Subjective Trope; even if you do know the reference, you may or may not consider it an example.

Arguments against
  • High number of outside referrals.
  • No evidence of misuse presented.

Stats
  • 111 wicks and 1300+ referrals as of December 2010.

Total posts: 62
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