During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Showtime!
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to Baletak and Teelia
I'm confused...Slade doesn't even speak in the film?
@MGD Holmes explicitly said he did not believe any of them were complicit in the murders.
@Lighty There was a point when a woman got coaxed into the carriage. It might have been Slade, though Spivy was usually the one riding in the carriage.
Edited by futuremoviewriter on Jun 13th 2020 at 7:34:50 AM
Yes to the D&D trio, cautious nay to Slade for now.
That's not answering my question.
What does he do and what does he not do? Summarize it because I'm questioning the EP now.
Future: Holmes says he believes it, but doesn't press it as it doesn't matter at this point and acknowledges that only they know for sure (followed by them giving each other uncomfortable glances). None of them confirm or deny whether Slade was acting alone or instructed, beyond claiming the Queen wasn't involved. Its deliberately left ambigious.
Lighty: No, not a single confirmed line (one of them says "get in" to coax Mary into the carriage but its not confirmed which one). He also only visibly reacts very briefly towards the end when he runs Foxborough with his rapier whilst trying to escape Holmes.
Edited by MGD107 on Jun 13th 2020 at 7:46:11 AM
Showtime!
The wifi here sucks
Starting to sound like a Perfect Blue minus the Mind Screw covering everything in the work. Leaning no for pretty well the same reason I threw it in for Me-Mania.
That really should have been in the EP. No to Slade.
@Lighty Probably gonna have to agree with MGD saying he does not speak. It seemed a little unclear to me personally though who said the line.
I did technically say it. I pretty much said they had little to no lines.
Edited by futuremoviewriter on Jun 13th 2020 at 7:41:38 AM
Showtime!
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
having only one line wouldn't be much better, imho
Future. That is very, very, very important information you left out of the EP while claiming he was an easy yes.
Thank you, Library, that is also very true.
Edited by Lightysnake on Jun 13th 2020 at 7:40:37 AM
I switch to abstain then on Slade. Nipping it in the bud.
My issue is that if not for MGD, we'd likely be upvoting this.
The Draftsman of Doom
No to Slade.
Again, I did say at least one of them spoke.
Edited by futuremoviewriter on Jun 13th 2020 at 7:55:53 AM
I'm saying no to Slade...Future? You have a record of skipping over or misinterpreting crucial information when it comes to effortposts. I don't want to enforce this but it'd be better for you and the thread as a whole if you had these posts properly vetted by a secondary poster. Frankly put, this recurring issue badly damages our faith in an accurate proposal from you and I don't want people to have to be skeptical simply on the grounds that "X proposed this." Saying "sorry" can only bring you so far from a recurring hiccup.
Edited by Scraggle on Jun 13th 2020 at 8:57:52 AM
The Dragon
Do quotes also go in the drafts if they get enough upvotes?
The wifi here sucks
@Scraggle At the least, I was vetting the FS ones with Bullman. I have been messaging often with MGD too and I can run things by both of them moving forward if they do not mind. Anything to ease everyone’s minds.
Edited by futuremoviewriter on Jun 13th 2020 at 8:06:10 AM
Walker, Damien and D&D trio
![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
Massacre and Slade
to Baletak and Teelia, and Y'nene. to William Slade
Um, having seen Murder By Decree I'm honestly not sure about Slade. The film deliberately leaves it ambiguous exactly how much of the killings was Slade's own plan and how much was him following orders from his superiors to avoid a scandal (the only assurance we get is the Queen didn't know).
Likewise the film leaves a lot of Slade's inner workings ambiguous (to my recollection the guy doesn't even speak once in the entire film, and only shows any real reactions at the end). Its difficult to gage if he's a psycho or just following orders.
Also I agree its not the same as doing the killings yourself, but allowing a maniac to rampage just so you can exploit them to take over is still pretty bad.
As much as I'd like him to count I'm going to have to go for![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]")
to William Slade.