Avengers Endgame spoiler thread

Can the Gauntlet bring people back to life in the comics?

This song needs more love.

Well Thanos did bring back Nebula but she was kind of corpse husk though I think that was on purpose.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."

To put it bluntly, simply wearing a fully completed Infinity Gauntlet in the comics made you Omniscient. Killing half the universe was one of the first things Thanos does with the Gauntlet, and it only scaled up from there. It's a plot point that Thanos was now more powerful than Death herself.

Thanos literally became the universe itself at one point.

Edited by chasemaddigan on May 30th 2019 at 1:41:02 PM

There is no Kree blood left and Ao S has made pretty clear that for one, it has limitations (for example, it doesn't work on Kree - most likely it only works on humans) and two, it has its limitations. The stones are so powerful, I doubt that Kree blood would work in this case.

Can Carol cut a vein and bleed on Tony?

It's not just the blood, it is some sort of stuff you can make out of the blood. I am not even sure of Shield still has the formula.

It's not like there's a shortage of Kree in the universe.

I mean, if there are Kree left, then there's Kree blood left. Go drain Yon-Rogg or something. Also: Season 5 of AOS had Kasius bring back both Yo-Yo and another character to life after killing them, so the Kree must know exactly how to do it.

Find some Kree and kill the shit out of them and take their blood!

...

And then the Kree declare war on C-53 and leave oceans of human blood everywhere.

Using the gauntlet outright maimed Hulk, left him crippled even after the battle was over so his Healing Factor wasn't able to reverse the effect. Even Thanos seemed to struggle a bit to handle the power (it's hard to say how well he fared physically after doing the Snap, since he was already injured). So it should be obvious it's more than just muscle density but using it would shatter your nervous system. All things considered it's really more surprising that Tony wasn't reduced to paste, but just a few superficial burns so he could say goodbye.

I do like that the Gauntlet is so dangerous to its own user. That's not a thing in the comics, but it was a plot point in the first Guardians film that the Power Gem will f*cking wreck your body. The Infinity Gauntlet does that times six.

I don't often give Markus and McFeely props for paying attention to other MCU films, but at least they got that right.

Edited by TobiasDrake on May 31st 2019 at 7:01:41 AM

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... Could Tony have remote-controlled an Iron Man suit to Snap?

The physical act of snapping isn't the what triggers the stones to do the thing, it's just a focus for the mind to concentrate around, IMO. Without a sentient being there to tell the stones exactly what it wants from them, I don't think it would work.

"...in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach."

The precise mechanics behind the plot are not the directors' job. Their job is to manage the actors' portrayals and ensure that they're presenting each scene in accordance with the vision they've been hired to make real.

It's okay for them to have a different interpretation of how the fantastic metaphysics work. They're not responsible for those metaphysics. They're just responsible for making sure the actors present the correct level of emotion and dramatic timing when discussing those metaphysics. There's a bit of a hierarchy of expertise in how a plot works.

• The writer, whose job is to actually craft every niggling detail in the script and figure out how it all works together.
• The producer, who hires the writer to put their big picture idea to pen and who often comes up with some of the major plot points that the writer is expected to incorporate.
• The director, whose job is to bring the writer and producer's vision to life on the big screen by arranging the actors and directing their performances.
• The actor, whose job is to know a single character inside and out, but whose ideas for that character may not always mesh with what was actually put to pen.
• Graphic designers, boom mic operators, and anyone else who had nothing to do with the actual story development.

Mind you, it's not always so simple in film development. Scenes have been known to change based on actor input or director ideas before they reach final production, though that may also involve the producer and/or writer signing off on the idea.

But when there's a disagreement on plot ideas, I find it best to refer to that hierarchy. If RDJ says that Tony's actually an adopted Latino child and Kevin Feige goes, "That, uh, that's not a thing," then we should defer to Feige. RDJ might be playing Tony as an adopted Latino child, it might be what he has in mind whenever he goes on camera, but that's not the canon.

Sadly, this doesn't always happen because writers get the short end of the stick in Hollywood. Actors and directors are celebrated for making a film happen while writers are totally snubbed. In the public eye, "THE RUSSO BROTHERS, Chris Evans, RDJ, etc. made Endgame happen" while Markus and McFeely just sort of exist also. Writers get no respect.

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> Find some Kree and kill the shit out of them and take their blood!

I'm sure Doctor Strange knows some necromancy..

New theme music also a box

Honestly, the only other solution I would have liked would have been to have each of the original Avengers hold a stone (to be precise, Steve Time, Natasha Reality, Thor Space, Hulk Power, Hawkeye Soul and Tony Mind), and everyone else on the battlefield latching onto them, so that THAN Tony could do this snap. But I am okay with Tony dying.

That kind of organization didn’t fit with the dramatic and hectic tone they were going for

Edited by Bocaj on May 31st 2019 at 9:39:04 AM

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I know, that would have required a different movie. Like the symbolism though, despite it kind of being a rip-off of Got G.

Also would have required getting the Soul Gem from Vormir without Hawkeye or Widow dying. Which I'd be fine with.

Also, I just realized that Strange totally "traded lives" to beat Thanos. I mean, he says he'll do that when Tony broaches the subject of facing Thanos. He straight up tells Tony that if it comes to a choice between his life and protecting the Time Gem, he'll let Tony die. And he follows through on that.

But wow, that's kind of the final nail in the coffin regarding Steve's Infinity War philosophy. We talked a bit in the IW thread about how the film weirdly seems to be taking Thanos's "Strength to make sacrifices" side over Steve's "We don't trade lives" philosophy. With Endgame out, I feel confident saying those concerns were right.

Thanos is beaten not by the strength of Steve's philosophy but because Strange 100% traded a life to buy his defeat. While Hawkeye and Black Widow traded a life for the Soul Gem, just like Thanos did.

RIP Steve's idealistic virtues.

Edited by TobiasDrake on May 31st 2019 at 8:19:44 AM

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There is a reason we have Word of Dante and Flip-Flop of God, I know with my own stories my internal rationale and interpretation evolves as I am writing it. Add in other writers, directors and producers who have their own take on the material and it becomes complicated. The MCU has not exactly been very consistent with a lot of things, but rely on being vague enough with the specifics that they are at least not contradictory (they explain enough to get to a plot point, but not to build the actual scientific theory around it).

Edited by KJMackley on May 31st 2019 at 7:20:38 AM

The point is not that you are ready to sacrifice, the point is that you are ready to do the sacrifice yourself. Yes, Strange went for the one scenario which gave them the win, but it was Tony who decided to do it. It's the difference between self-sacrifice and sacrificing someone else. (In this context the Vormir scenes mirror each other quite nicely...I am still bitter about them not giving Natasha more credit).

That’s the real reason why Steve retired

Because he didn’t want to admit that he was wrong

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Captain America is always right! Even when he's wrong.

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Since when has Steve an issue with self-sacrifice? There has never been a bomb he wouldn't gladly jump on.