ContraPoints

I wonder what her next video will be about. She sort of implied at the end of Cancelling that she'd be doing another one in that realm of subject matter, ("there's gonna be a part two, gorge"), but who knows what it'll be specifically or how soon she'll continue in that subject.

Shame.

After a few months of me bemoaning that I couldn't relatate to Nat anymore she goes and releases this x3

I definatly never assumed I was anything other than a lesbian post trantiin and I definatly never felt the shame, but what she was saying about how her attraction to men works is very true to me - I can fetishize men without actually being attracted to them I guess (not nessicarily in a sexual way)

And Joanne's anxiety that dating another trans woman would detach her completely from centralised society is something I've considered myself. I've been dating another trans woman for over six months now and while I am eager to redefine what womanhood is (and that's very easy to do between two women who weren't socialised to be girls in our fomartive years) I want any redefinition I do to be part of a larger pan-female movement, and like Joanne said, it feels like we are too fringe to be a part of that sometimes.

I've really thrown myself into trans spaces this past year and have felt this counter desire to also position myself in cis female spaces as well so I can avoid loosing touch with centralised female experiences and activism.

Not really seen anyone else out this into words before.

Also infantalising imagery in the trans subcultures has always been a problem for me (I had a huge hate on for the trans flag for ages for this reason) even if it makes perfect sense for me for a group of people who were both deprived of conventional childhoods and are labeled as menacing boogymen to want to have that portrayal.

Yeesh, why do Breadtube videos have to be so long lately? TTvTT I'll watch it tomorrow.

You mean this flag? Are the colors too pastel or something?

Edited by Lyendith on Feb 16th 2020 at 12:41:04 PM

It's the colours new born babies are wrapped in.

Which kind of clashes with the intention that I'm transitioning into being an adult woman.

I see… I wonder if that was the intention behind the flag…

So I watched the video. Pretty ironic that Natalie comes out as lesbian just a couple months after Olly came out as bi. Maybe she wanted to avoid overlap.

As often with her vids, I can't personally relate (except the part about the "demiromantic" thing, maybe) but I learn a lot hearing about her experiences. I've occasionally heard the idea that bisexuals are just gays who are afraid to identify as such, but I doubt that's always true.

I'm very new to the Contrapoints fandom, having first seen one of her videos last fall. I had seen references to the channel earlier, but never actually sat down and watched one until "Beauty". I was dealing with a lot of body image issues and trying to untangle dysphoria from general self-esteem issues, and that video helped.

So I watched more. I haven't watched the whole backlog, just everything from "Gender Dysphoria" forward, because that's when Natalie really upped the game on production value and was publicly transitioning (I feel weird watching pre-transition videos, like I'm invading her privacy). And again, many of the videos have been super helpful in expanding my vocabulary and articulating thoughts I've been struggling with.

But I had only been watching her stuff for a few weeks when Opulence came out. And that was a lot to deal with as my Twitter feed blew up with criticism of Natalie... and I was like, "But she's really helped me these past few weeks." It is a tough situation. Even more so with the video this week. As a trans woman it said a lot that I needed to hear. Below is what I said on a reddit thread about the video:

“The video certainly hit me really hard at points, the biggest moment being when she talked about sacrificing her sexual orientation to hold up her gender identity. For years I did the opposite, sacrificing my gender identity to hold up my orientation.

I did not believe I could be a woman, because I did not know it was possible to be a trans lesbian. I fought acknowledging my gender because I did not want to be seen as a predator the same way Natalie described. Hearing her speak about that fear, that shame, was so helpful.”

Edited by ciyinwanderer on Feb 17th 2020 at 1:03:40 AM

At first I didn't quite see how this was the 'sequel' to the Cancel Culture one, but I think I get it now.

I've read about 'comp het' before, and this was such a good video, but man the subject is... unsettling. If you can't even trust that your feelings are real feelings... how are you supposed to live your life?

Yeah, it sound like some les woman, trans and cis kinda sorta gaslighting herself....that dosent sound healthy.

I wonder what happen to chad.

Next step for Nat': coming out as a weeb?

SEW did mention Contrapoints in one of his "my favorite things this season" videos last year. Might just be someone using the same name on Patreon though.

So Buck Angel is having a complete transphobic meltdown on Twitter:

https://www.resetera.com/threads/buck-angel-has-had-a-complete-meltdown-on-twitter.171747/

Wonder if Natalie will continue to try and defend him, or if this is going to absolutely devastate her. She doesn't seem to be in a very good place right now

... Did she defend him in the past? She defended having him in a video IIRC, because (as I understand it) he was a trans icon back from when what we now call transmedicalism was the only way to be trans, and now that we've moved past that, he's just still stuck back there. I don't know if she's defended his current views.

I heard that a cis lesbian YTer who was known for being pretty TERF-y "came out" as conservative recently, and Buck Angel's wholeheartedly supported her.

Yeah, that's probably what prompted the above meltdown tbh. Basically holding some views that were progressive 10, 20, 30 years ago and realising you've lost your progressive cred now that those views are almost normalised (certainly within progressive circles) and the progressive "frontier", if you will, has moved way past you into areas you don't wanna go into is what unites them.

It's quite funny to see people literally claim "my views haven't changed for 20 years since I was in college, I was progressive back then, but apparently I'm a bigot now?!?" - like yeah, that's literally how it works if you don't move with the times.

Going by her Cancel Culture video, she doesn't agree with his current views, no.

…Actually, does she still follow Twitter?

Edited by Lyendith on Feb 25th 2020 at 2:07:59 PM

I do recalling that she said she'd drop support if he acted actively exclusionary. Which this definitely is

Maybe he was being nice by helping her get out of such an ambiguous space?

Lindsay Ellis runs Natalie's twitter now, just to post promotional content when a new video is released.

I'm wondering since the last two videos have focused very specifically on Natalie's life if this month might move back to a more general topic.

I enjoyed Cancelling and Shame, but those were extremely raw and emotional, and I don't think it will be healthy for her or her followers if every video is like that.

She did say towards the end of last year she wanted to move away from her videos being so auto biographical and focused on her transition experience. So, maybe!

She kinda back and for about it, her videos about shame and this one are both in part of controversy so you can said she got sidetrack by this.

I've only watched a few of her pre-transition videos, but they definitely semeed to tackle a wider area of political subjects (like the one about "Race") rather than the more gender-focused ones she does now.

Though I guess "Opulence" was an outlier in that regard − which makes it all the sadder that it was Overshadowed by Controversy.

Edited by Lyendith on Mar 8th 2020 at 12:56:54 PM

Her pre transitioing videos is more about her dismantling alt right shittery while vocing is disregard with some issue of the left, like they love-hate relationship with violence and their love of overly old russian man, now it seen to talk about her transicion experience.

Anyone see Natalie's latest Instagram post and story? Does she have the coronavirus?

Luxander, who is a nonbinary youtuber and prominent former critic of Natalie has just live streamed them watching The Aesthetic, and they actually defended it as useful media.

If I recall my criticism of The Aesthetic at the time wasn't that was wrong or hurtful, just that it's kind of unrelentingly depressing?

Edited by Whowho on Mar 26th 2020 at 8:25:51 AM