My Hero Academia

Retributive justice is not really what Batman is about, that's more on the vein of the Punisher actually (or Frank Miller's Crazy Steve).

I would say one of the core aspects of Batman (and The Cowl archetype in general) is introspective story-telling, whether it's when he does detective work, he's dealing with his trauma, has to best the mind games of someone else, the way he has to fight his opponents or how to find light in dark places.

I meant the people who thought Deku would go for the retributive justice route.

Boku no Hero Academia: "Maybe the so-called villains are those who were failed by society or by their families. Maybe they deserve better than many face punches. Maybe they're people who fell through the cracks and deserve empathy and validation."

Also Boku no Hero Academia: "Anyway, let's talk All For One. Let me tell you about the worst fucking baby in the world. Just a complete trash bag of a child. Irredeemable from day 0. You will cheer for a loud teenager to explode this particular baby."

I think it's less about that and more that people believe that his actions are just treating a symptom, not the disease; that is, he's fighting the villains that arose as a result of society's failings, but he's doesn't seem to be doing anything to address those failings to make sure that this whole mess doesn't happen again.

However, I think the problems with that perspective are that:

1. The story isn't over yet and the threat posed by the villains is much more imminent; there's plenty of time after Shiggy is dealt with to address the underlying issues that lead to him becoming a villain. You can't rebuild society into a more caring and empathic culture until you've saved it from being completely obliterated.

2. Deku himself isn't exactly in a position to address those issues. He has OFA, but he doesn't really have any political power to make changes, nor does he really have the experience implement the kind of changes that are necessary. His role would make him able to act as an advocate for better counseling and reforms in how quirks are treated, but that's about all he's really equipped to do at the moment.

TL;DR I think that it's true that the story needs to address underlying problems that caused the villains to become villains, but I think that having Deku address those concerns at this particular point in the narrative wouldn't make that much sense.

I mean, those two things aren't necessarily mutually exclusive; even given the best emotional support and care, some people are just dickheads.

Edited by JapaneseTeeth on Feb 10th 2024 at 10:14:31 AM

Deku's only job is to stop "All For One" and nothing else right now as the rest of the issues are meant for people qualified to handle them.

Expecting more is just asking too much from a kid that hasn't even finished his first year in high-school yet.

Edited by Trainbarrel on Feb 10th 2024 at 5:18:28 PM

@RedHunter: I did laugh pretty hard at this post coming almost immediately before you got to the part where exactly that happens.

"So yeah, about that ..."

Even dragging the problems into the light is a bit of a victory.

I've heard that the anime had some problems even doing that much

Edited by Bocaj on Feb 10th 2024 at 8:23:35 AM

I know. It's great right. Toga isn't the only one who got exactly the ending that worked best for them.

All my hate Stain. All my hate.

He is very hatable and he probably doesn’t tip the waiter

I agree with LSBK that stories don’t necessarily have to answer all the problems they bring up but I also think it’s interesting that posters here are referring to the issues with Superhuman Society as systemic. There’s a lot of social issues but I don’t think there is a single system that causes all the problems in the series to be reformed to solve all the problems. Like, there’s talk here about Deku not being a politician but the issues we see are not something that entirely stem from a particular government program or policy. Well, except the HSPC, but that was (conveniently) destroyed before we entered the finale.

I read a commentator once say MHA’s issues are ‘more social than systemic.’ And the causes of the many of the series’ problems also have other aspects to it. It’s one of things I think is interesting about MHA.

Ex: All Might’s persona was absolutely necessary for people feel confident enough to live their lives without fear and break the hold of AFO’s reign of terror, but it caused them to believe the problems they see everyday are not their problems to solve. Except for the people who were, in fact, inspired by his example do something by All Might’s example (Deku, Bakugou, Todoroki, etc.), whose example in this arc will probably kick off a cultural shift similar to All Might’s original debut.

Ex: The Hero Ranking system is shown to disincentivise teamwork, which causes heroes to get in the way of each other. But one of the big things of the Pro-Hero arc is that such competition can be a good thing and is necessary. None of the other pros thought they could measure up to All Might so they never tried to either match he’s strength or to become a symbol as he did to assuage the public, except for Endeavor. His obsession with beating All Might is toxic and caused a lot of horrific pain and suffering for the Todorokis but his constant attempts made him strong enough to hold up against Hood as well as he did and his determination inspired Hawks to want to be a Hero.

Relatedly, Deku and Bakugo’s whole relationship is basically going from toxic competition to healthy competition, so how do you make a system that discourages that former and encourages the latter?

Ex: There’s the matter about how Quirk laws are overly suppressive (as demonstrated during the Forest Training and MVA arcs and Vigilantes) but when we see people average citizens try to handle things themselves post Liberation War they end up hurting themselves and others due to panic, prejudice, and lack of training. So how do you create a system that fixes both issues?

There’s a bunch of talk in the series about how suppressing certain forms of individuality in fervor of others is something inherent to human nature. AFO lectures Deku in the Dark Hero arc about how it is inherent to all social organisms regardless of what kind of society people live in, Re Destro goes on about how the existence of superpowers means people no longer have a “mold” but still conform to the “old way of thinking.”

When young All Might talks to Nana about creating the symbol of peace he says he wanted to put people at ease to end a cycle of hatred.

When Deku and Shiggy are fighting now Soggy is talking about how Deku is trying to understand him but it’s impossible because he’s just applying his own perspective to Shiggy and can’t really understand his experiences. That goes back to their encounter in the mall where Deku says he can understand Stain but not Shigaraki. That seems like a common theme in anime going by Ao T, FMA., and what I hear about Naruto.

As far as Deku killing Shigaraki goes and the retributive vs. rehabilitative justice thing, I don’t think it’s that simple. There’s sort of a balance between giving people a chance and receiving punishment and having them repay a debt to society. The bad guys are somewhat a victim of circumstance but that still have their own agency and are responsible for their own actions.

The police officers who were overseeing Gentle say that Gentle should be given a second chance but they still point out that he has to work for it and he still goes to prison. They basically tell Gentle not trying to turn his life around would be a personal failing on his part, basically giving up is the easy way out.

Same with Endeavor. Even when he changes, he still needs to do right by his family add make it up them as best he can and he isn’t entitled to their forgiveness or acceptance.

My problem though, is that Shiggy’s actions now are an immediate threat to everyone in Japan, by Deku not going for the kill it’s like he’s prioritizing Shiggy’s life over the rest of Japan, which is problem way beyond whether or not he deserves to die on the face of it.

…I think this post got a bit unfocused and I’m not entirely sure if I had a point to it anymore but just some thoughts I had related to the discussion brought up.

Edited by CheapMarzipan on Feb 10th 2024 at 1:54:30 PM

I think it's the last bit that gets people's goats. Izuku's attempt to rehabilitate Shigaraki even as the latter threatens to kill every person in Japan despite everyone advising him to end Shigaraki as a threat immediately.

I can see it coming across as selfish, short-sighted, and suicidally idealistic given that Shigaraki has embraced his evil and openly describes his desire to kill everyone.

I can grasp that.

But the plot has made it clear that Deku is going to do it, so he'll do it.

Shiggy still talking shit and saying Everybody dies is just meant to be extra tension.

I mean, Deku probably could kill Shiggy at this point and not come off as looking bad for it, since he's literally done everything he could to save him. The boy needs to learn the power of positive quitting.

But it's going to be done. If Deku can save someone this far gone, it'll lend credence to doing the same for others who aren't as totally corrupted. Also, as others have pointed out....can he kill Shiggy at this point?

Between Decay, and all the enhancements he's received, it might not even be possible for OFA to do it. So saving him might be the only option.

I dunno. Deku does say he dosen't know how to get past Shiggy's physicals +regen + decay and Kudo does say that he can't be killed and transferring OFA to destroy the "Leaden Mass" is the only option, but Nana tells Deku to build up more power to strike a killing blow (chapter 412) and Shigaraki says Deku's blows might be able to kill him (in chapter 411).

Edited by CheapMarzipan on Feb 10th 2024 at 3:59:54 AM

Yeah I think the idea that Deku could have possibly brute forced his way through the regen is put forth to make Deku's decision to go the other route more meaningful.

“His obsession with beating All Might is toxic and caused a lot of horrific pain and suffering for the Todorokis but his constant attempts made him strong enough to hold up against Hood as well as he did and his determination inspired Hawks to want to be a Hero.”

Wanted to point out that this right here comes with the problem that said actions lead to far worse issues involving his firstborn son, who even used his identity to cause more widespread chaos in the long run. Nevermind that the way he raised Shoto actually held him back in a lot of factors cause of his “training”.

It’s always going to be a grey area because his actions lead to both good and negative results, and the negatives cause actual widespread harm as well.

Edited by OmegaRadiance on Feb 10th 2024 at 2:39:52 AM

Endeavour is a double edged sword in human form.

You could admire his raw determination to actually surpass All Might when no one else was even willing to try, and he probably came as close to doing so as anyone could while still never coming close.

But the things he did due to that determination have been so harmful on so many levels that it shoots whatever positive message you could take from it right in the face and leaves it bleeding to death on the ground.

Endeavor is a flawed human being basically.

I am still holding out to see what destroying the "mass" inside Shigaraki is exactly gonna doo. At first I thought it would destroy his Quirks and make it so he could not continue fighting, but the way everybody is talking about it makes it seem like it is only supposed to affect him on an emotional level.

And not trivially flawed, either.

Yeah, Endeavor messed up big time with his family and traumatized at least one little kid, but at the same time, he's saved countless lives, inspired Hawks, putting distance from his family because he knows he's hurt them and he has to be a dad and give space, and trying to stop his son from supervillaining.

He really is a double edged sword in human form. All sorts of failures and flaws along with victories and virtues. He's a fascinating character to watch.

But certainly one you don't want to meet in real life unless your life is in danger.

Edited by RedHunter543 on Feb 11th 2024 at 10:53:19 PM

Oh yes indeed.

Of course, those who faced the negative side of someone akin to Endeavor's is why there's a subset of fans who thinks he should never be forgiven.

He paid too much attention to the Super, not enough at the Man, and everyone paid for it.

Edited by Blueace on Feb 11th 2024 at 11:57:35 AM

Almost everyone was guilty of that, Endeavor was just in a position where him screwing up meant more.

So... is there a chapter this week? All the other releases this week on Viz's website are up but MHA's still says "coming in a half hour."

Edited by HamburgerTime on Feb 11th 2024 at 9:09:05 AM

I assume someone just forgot to update the release date, since there is definitely no chapter this week.