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slimcoder Insane Religious Murderbot
Insane Religious Murderbot
Dec 7th 2019 at 10:18:16 PM

There's also people just using Naruto-comparisons as a bad-faith argument to try to prove that MHA sucks.

That's the only reason the "Green Naruto" thing exists.

Nobody is innocent, there are merely varying levels of guilt. Oh and Primus hates you.
Dec 7th 2019 at 10:32:35 PM

That doesn't make any logical sense to me, Deku is nothing like Naruto personality wise. Hell Deku is pretty much the opposite of almost every shonen protagonist out their barring Tanjiro from Demon Slayer.

slimcoder Insane Religious Murderbot
Insane Religious Murderbot
Dec 7th 2019 at 10:34:22 PM

Like I said homes, bad-faith arguments. (Shrugs)

Edited by slimcoder on Dec 7th 2019 at 10:34:33 AM

Nobody is innocent, there are merely varying levels of guilt. Oh and Primus hates you.
Dec 7th 2019 at 11:00:13 PM

Though if we're making Naruto comparisons I'd do so with Haku and Geten: Both are Ice users who could be mistaken for attractive girls and have their faces obscured for most of their panel time and singularly devoted to one specific person.

Of course, radically different personalities, as is the case for most of these comparisons, but you get the idea.

Edited by LSBK on Dec 7th 2019 at 1:02:53 PM

raziel365 Anka Aquila from Lima, Perķ Relationship Status: I've been dreaming of True Love's Kiss
Anka Aquila
Dec 7th 2019 at 11:34:43 PM

@ Wispy

Deku is more similar personality-wise to Tsuna from Katekyō Hitman Reborn! or Shinji from Neon Genesis Evangelion than to the standard shounen protagonist. Or as you mentioned, his personality arc is more similar to how Tanjiro started out in Kimetsu No Yaiba.

I don't know, maybe it's because I barely watched Naruto (nor Bleach or One Piece) that I do not see why some people talk about ripping off things from it.

Instead of focusing on relatives that divide us, maybe we should try to find the absolutes that tie us.
Dec 7th 2019 at 11:50:00 PM

He is also similiar to Kaneki from Tokyo Ghoul. Kaneki is more of a dark mirror to Deku though as he is basically what Deku would of been like with a really shitty quirk (ghouls are forced to eat humans) and mainly in the fact he does not value himself at all (which Deku comes close to being like that a couple times).

Edited by Wispy on Dec 7th 2019 at 11:51:46 AM

TitanJump Be thorough, be curious...be human. Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
Be thorough, be curious...be human.
Dec 8th 2019 at 12:11:32 AM

Back to Dabi/Touya...

That said, building from my previous post, that if Touya got a increased resistance to cold from his mother and using the fire quirk to keep his cells from crystallizing too badly, he could theoretically have survived the unknown "lethal" incident and woken up later when put into cold storage among the rest of the corpses, (perhaps even having the Doctor discovering him there while on a graverobber's shopping-spree for good quirk factors.) and then been nursed back to health in a tube, but then released to deal with the memory loss from having been put under for too long since his heart stopped while in the freezer. And having the worst of his burns patched up with skin transplants (I suspect that all "healthy skin" Dabi has, are not actually his, but transplants put on top of his severely burnt body beneath them.)

No need to resurrect him if the kid didn't actually die in the first place, but just resuscitate him instead.

Would this sound plausible?

Madness: an author's most magnificent muse and house maid.
Dec 8th 2019 at 2:27:27 AM

I mean, the Big 3 are called that for a reason. You can see the influence of Naruto, One Piece and Bleach in most stuff currently running on WSJ.

Iirc Horikoshi said in that interview with Oda that at first he intended to create a more Luffy-like protagonist, but ended up making him a lot more like himself.

So the real inspiration for Deku is Horikoshi himself. And you can see in all his interviews and comments that the guy is literally Deku in the flesh.

Edited by WashTheLaundryHero on Dec 8th 2019 at 2:28:02 AM

SalFishFin Ace with a Podao from A respectful distance away Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
Ace with a Podao
Dec 8th 2019 at 3:27:34 AM

I'm not about to call MHA a ripoff, because the two stories are clearly doing different things, but there are just. A whole lot of superficial similarities. It's pretty funny.

3DS FC for PKMN & Smash:3583-2242-1801
devak They call me.... Prophet Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
They call me.... Prophet
Dec 8th 2019 at 5:24:19 AM

There's also the small matter that kakashi's eye power is not actually his, that it's power is nothing like Aizawa's, that Kakashi basically got all of his initial traits from Obito but Aizawa didn't change all that much because of Shirakumo. On top of that, Kakashi was the genius to Obito's nobody, yet Oboro was a much better hero than Aizawa.

Sure there's superficial similarities, but if you look at the core aspects of Aizawa and Kakashi, they're nothing alike. Like, Aizawa is perpetually tired because he works at night, yet is always on time. Kakashi was perpetually late because he kept looking at the graves of his friends, and disinterested because his heart had gotten dead and cold from murdering his friends. Meanwhile Aizawa doesn't care because he's too tired to care.

Obito's ideals in life stung Kakashi because his dad killed himself over said ideas. Obito loses his life (seemingly) over this disagreement and after Kakashi realizes that well, Obito was right. Kakashi's stubbornness led to Obito's apparent death, Kakashi's actions led to Rin's death as she jumps on his fatal attack, and Minato dies because kakashi spilled secrets unintentionally. Meanwhile, Oboro's death is because they got caught in an attack they weren't equipped to handle, and the rest of Aizawa's team is very much alive.

So no, Aizawa is not a poor man's kakashi. They're nothing alike.

Edited by devak on Dec 8th 2019 at 2:24:58 PM

asterism Relationship Status: Hoping Senpai notices me
Dec 8th 2019 at 6:02:05 AM

You could write a small essay comparing and contrasting the two situations

Or you could just acknowledge the superficial similarities and accept that it's an homage.

Existence
Dec 8th 2019 at 10:12:13 AM

Good to see Toshinori being his dorky dad self. Good to see Uraraka and Iida.

devak They call me.... Prophet Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
They call me.... Prophet
Dec 8th 2019 at 12:28:26 PM

"symbol of sweets" is a really nice pun

sgamer82 from Middleton, ID
Dec 8th 2019 at 4:49:54 PM

~sdsaa

Immediate thought: What's the allusion?

Plus, remember how in Eragon everyone cries "a single tear"? Yeah, just try that with One Piece and see if it works
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
Dec 8th 2019 at 5:13:22 PM

Another theory that Endeavor needs to die to Dabi to be "redeemed" from Tumblr.

[up][up]And yes, can you please stop linking stuff without any sort of context, otherwise we're just going to ignore it.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
Dec 8th 2019 at 5:14:08 PM

https://linkspooky.tumblr.com/post/189251033565/can-you-please-explain-how-endeavor-alludes-to-the according to linkspooky ( enji has an attack called Flashfire Fist - Hell Spider ) endeavor alludes to the spider thread story

The Spiderís Thread is a story about Kandata, a thief who lives his life stealing from everyone and is sent to hell.

Among the groups of bad people in Hell, there was one man called Kandata. Kandata had been a very evil man. He had killed people, stolen from people, and even burned houses with people in them. He was truly an enemy of all good people. But once in his life, he had done something good, and Buddha remembered this. His one good deed is sparing the life of a spider he could have stepped on.

ĎNo, no. Even something this small has a reason to live. It would be truly evil to take its life away.í So he let the spider live, and went to steal from the man.

Enji Todoroki is someone who has lived similiarly to Kandata, in that both of them have been selfish their entire lives.

Endeavor is someone who used his family for his own selfish purposes. All he ever did was take from them. Rei lost ten years with her children. Todoroki, lost his mother and his chance at a normal childhood. Natsuo and Fuyumi were failures who were ignored by their father. Touya lost his own life. Despite being a hero, Enji Todoroki is a thief who does nothing but take from his own family over and over again the same way that Kanda does.

The spiderís thread thematically is not a story about redemption. Itís a story about one small chance at redemption. Kanda is offered a second chance, because of the one good deed he did in his life. There was one person he did not steal from. Thereís something beautiful about this small chance at redemption, because it means even in the life of a bad person, their good deeds donít go to waste. There is also something tragic, because in the story itself, the spiderís thread snaps.

Kandata shouted at the people below, ĎHey, you terrible people! You awful people down there! This spiderís thread is mine. It belongs to me, and only me! Who told you you could all climb up? Get off, get off!í Then, suddenly, the spiderís thread broke. It made a SNAP, and Kandata fell. He fell down and down and down. Finally, he landed in the Lake of Blood with a SPLASH, along with all the other bad people. The spiderís thread hung in the air, shining bright like the needles on the Mountain of Needles, while all the bad people sat below.

Kandataís chance at redemption comes from thinking about someone else other than himself for once. He spares the smallest amount of consideration for the spider and offers it mercy because there was no reason to take from them. Itís not just being a thief that sent Kandata to hell, itís his selfishness, he lived a life only thinking about himself. What gives Kandata his chance is thinking about somebody else. What makes the string snap is when once again, all Kandata thinks about is himself.

Ironically, Kandataís pursuit of his own redemption is selfish. He doesnít care about other people getting out of hell, heís only trying to save himself. Thatís why when he sees other people weighing it down, he starts trying to shake them off and itís that decision that makes the thread snap. His redemption had to be for other people, and not himself, and Kandata fails that.

So, at this point the conflict with Endeavor is he thinking truly of others, or is he being selfish again? Does he want whatís best for his family, or does he want whatís best for himself? For Enji growth would be thinking about someone other than himself for once, what makes other people happy rather than what he personally wants. His dream even shows him that, that his family might just be happier when he is not around.

In the chapter thereís a confrontation with this idea that Enji himself will always choose his career as a hero over his family, even when he claims what he wants is to make it up to them.

Ending, even says so in the latest chapter. That even when his own childrenís lives are on the line heíll continue to play hero. That playing hero always comes first to Endeavor. The spiderís thread is the decision to spare one person, to think about one person other than yourself for once. In that instance weíre shown Enjiís connection with Touya. What would be an actual concrete change for Enji, rather than just a desire to change lies in Touya.

Who we know now most likely, rather than being an innocent child has turned into a spider.

Touya is a genuine confrontation of Enjiís actions. That his actions directly created a villain. In Touya, Enji can no longer continue to have his way. He cannot be the number one hero, and also be forgiven by his family at the same time. Itís something that forces him to choose what is more important to him, what is best for the family that he ruined, or what is best for himself.

Enjiís greatest character flaw has always been his fire, and how wrapped up he is in his own emotions that he always ends up burning others and making others the victims of his own emotions. What he needs to realize is how his flames burn other people.

Ergo Dabi, the perfect conflict because he is a literal walking burn victim who was made this way because Endeavorís abmitions only thought of himself and not his children. He is the shadows that Endeavorís burning ambitions create, the confrontation of who Endeavor really is, a violent person who burns, who killed Touya. Dabi looks like a corpse because Enji is being confronted by the child who was killed in the abusive household that he created.

Touya is his spiderís thread. But remember, the spiderís thread as a story isnít actually a story about redemption. Itís a story that reveals the true character of the person offered it. Kandata spared one spider in his life, but when given the oppurtunity to help someone else he only thought about himself.

The fact that Kandata thought the spiderís thread only belonged to him, that he was the only one that deserved to be saved is exactly what causes the thread to snap. Itís a story about a selfish redemption.

Dabi could be the spiderís thread for him, but he could also be the flames of hell that he falls into.

Dec 8th 2019 at 5:21:18 PM

https://linkspooky.tumblr.com/post/189532468905/kurogiri-and-shirakumo here is a post that goes into detail about comparing and contrasting kurogiri and shirakumo and talking about lessening the black and white view that most heroes have and Kurogiri, along with the rest of the league of villains are clearly villains who were made, not born that way linkspooky often criticizes what gran torino said about shigaraki how in the end of the day he is a criminal when all might talked about finding him after finding out he was nanas grandson bringing up how he knows how manipulative afo is etc

IniuriaTalis Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Dec 8th 2019 at 7:24:10 PM

Spider's thread theory falls apart with the newer chapters that show Endeavor being willing to help his family build a new life together without him. He's not self-centered anymore.

And it's always a bit facepamly that Endeavor being abusive is a sign that he must atone and die to do so, but being mass murderers and terrorists is a sign that the villains just need the heroes to give them a chance.

That person missed the point of Gran Torino's words: the fact is that All Might wants to save Tomura because he was once Nana's innocent grandson, but nowadays he's a dangerous murderer, and it is much more important to stop him than to hope to fix him. It's not that he's a criminal, therefore pure bad, it's the fact that All Might knowing his family and his origins doesn't mean that he deserves special treatment.

Edited by IniuriaTalis on Dec 8th 2019 at 10:26:27 AM

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
Dec 8th 2019 at 7:35:35 PM

That post is full of shit because it assumes that Endeavor is still acting out of selfishness even when he's trying to atone. That when Natuso was in danger, Endeavor was still acting like a hero, despite the fact that he hesitated precisely because of consideration for Natsuo's feelings and told him afterward that his feelings of resentment and hatred towards him are not wrong and that he is still a kind person regardless.

At the end of the day, people are going to see what they want to see and think what they want to think because it is convenient for them. People don't want to acknowledge Endeavor trying to change for the better, and will try to spin it in as negative a context as possible because to them, Endeavor can't change, it's impossible. No matter what he does, the fact that he did so many terrible things will always be the biggest mark against his character regardless of what he does in the future. Literally nothing short of death or losing his powers and therefore his position as the top hero, will be good enough for these people.

Its honestly kinda deranged.

You really have to wonder what these people are going to say if, when All Might tries to reach out to Tomura and give him help, and Tomura just kills him in cold blood. What then?

Edited by BlackYakuzu94 on Dec 8th 2019 at 10:41:06 AM

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
IniuriaTalis Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Dec 8th 2019 at 7:41:06 PM

Meanwhile, they act like Shiggy and Dabi are still scared little abused kids, and not adult men who are choosing to inflict pain and abuse on other kids.

(Not gonna make a judgment on Kurogiri for now, because we don't know how much moral agency he has as a quasi-Noumu.)

Edited by IniuriaTalis on Dec 8th 2019 at 10:41:25 AM

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
Dec 8th 2019 at 7:43:01 PM

This is what really makes me want to see Tomura kill All Might; not because I wish anything bad on All Might, heavens no. But I really want to see how these people would feel seeing Tomura trying to get the help they feel he deserves, only for him to throw it away and kill one of the few people who would be willing to hear him out.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
IniuriaTalis Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Dec 8th 2019 at 7:44:53 PM

If it's similar to Kylo Ren, it'll just make people want to see the whiny asshole redeemed even more.

slimcoder Insane Religious Murderbot
Insane Religious Murderbot
Dec 8th 2019 at 7:46:47 PM

Please donít compare Shiggy or Dabi to Kylo.

Kylo is a fucking loser of immeasurable proportions.

Nobody is innocent, there are merely varying levels of guilt. Oh and Primus hates you.
fasoman1996 SANSHEAD from Argentina (A.K.A. Naziland) Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
SANSHEAD
Dec 8th 2019 at 7:51:22 PM

Should i point out that Rei's character sheet has Breeding Slave listed?

Pretty sure thats being hyperbolic

Living in the dankest timeline

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