Police in the comic book worlds

In at least one Spider-Man TV show and three Batman TV shows, there have been people who have said that Batman and Spider-man should leave the crime-fighting to the police, and while that statement may fly in the real world for obvious reasons, in the comic book worlds, it seems like a pretty weak statement.

In the worlds of Marvel, DC or any other comic book, the police are usually portrayed as being kind of useless. The very villains that people like Jameson say that Spider-Man should let the police handle (e.g. Doctor Octopus) can easily take down dozens of cops without getting the least bit harmed. And criminals like Ra's Al Ghul have alluded the authorities of numerous countries for years, Batman was the only one he and his League of Assassins saw as a real threat.

And if power wasn't enough, there are times when the police are rendered powerless by the criminals because they do something like bribe a government official or something.

Simply put, if heroes like Batman and Spider-Man didn't exist, places like Gotham and New York City would have been overtaken by criminals by now.

Peter Parker wouldn't lose any of his powers if he became a cop, nor would Bruce Wayne lose his training or detective skills.

Officer Parker wouldn't be the kind of normal cop who Doc Ock slaughters; he'd be a cop with super agility, Spider-Sense, and web shooters, which would still allow him to take down supervillains.

If I remember right, there was a story where Bruce Wayne tried joining the FBI before becoming Batman, but decided that they weren't good enough for him.

if they operate within the law, they have to follow certain procedures and there are certain things they do as vigilantes that they wouldn't be able to do otherwise. mostly talking about batman here; he basically breaks and enters all the time to gather evidence and spy on people. police don't do that.

Also tampering with evidence and interfering with crime scenes. And assault.

And illegal surveillance. And torture. And unlawful use of military grade ordnance...

In general, the existence of superheroes is justified either by the police being corrupt and ineffective, or by the appearance of threats obviously outside their competence. The former is an outright criticism, and the latter isn't that flattering either since, depending on the threat, it starts including higher and higher levels of military operation that inevitably prove little more than extras for the monster of the week to stomp on. Even human machinery has to be artificially weakened for some plots to come through.

I'd say the golden ground has to be Spider-Man, since most of his foes are neither too weak to reasonably be apprehended by regular cops, nor too strong to warrant immediate military attention. He himself is fairly low-powered, built around mobility rather than destructive potential, so it makes sense for him to be the first to arrive and deal with the crooks, immobilizing them for the police to book later. It takes subtlety but you can have the police be generally competent, while heroes mostly deal with non-standard threats. Although, in the ninja pirate zombie robot kitchen sink universes of modern superheroes, exactly what comprises a non-standard threat isn't easy to imagine.

edited 18th Sep '14 11:34:26 PM by indiana404

I completely agree with everything Indiana just said.

Most modern independent works involving super-people take some time to explain why they become superheroes instead of police officers. For example in Tigerman, the main character is supposed to be a neutral diplomat who doesn't interfere with local affairs—but a masked and costumed weirdo—no one would be surprised if one of those fought crime and injustice.

I dunno. That sounds like the old-fashioned reasons played straight. That was the modus operandi of the The Scarlet Pimpernel, the Ur-Example of the superhero.

edited 19th Sep '14 6:56:00 AM by KingZeal

It generally comes from the wish fulfillment aspect that's highlighted by the whole "Heroes go to the lengths the cops and legal system won't" argument. Everyone has an instance of being wronged by someone who got away with it because of some technicality, and superheroes fit into that desire to see those sorts of people punished.

Thing about Spider-man, he generally does leave most crime to the police. There's a running gag in his comic about crooks in a shoot out who surrender when they see Spider-man swinging toward them, only for him to completely ignore them as the cops show up and arrest them. That gag has been on since the 1960s...or maybe the 1970 at the very latest.

If you're arguing against J Johna Jameson, you're arguing against a Straw Man...well, you're arguing against a man with Irrational Hatred for Spider-man, a Butt-Monkey Hero with Bad Publicity. Also, Spider-man has horrific destructive potential. What in your immediate vicinity weighs ten tons? The fact that he doesn't generally break and throw things is kind of part of his whole "responsibility" ethos.

No, what Jameson should have said was "Peter Parker should be leaving the passing of the dead to its course and not consulting with Lords Of Hell." but then he'd be unambiguously correct, and Marvel can't have that.

Although when you think about it the Police really should be able to deal with a fair amount of threats in comic book universes. Doctor Octopus has his tentacles sure but does that really stop a sniper from putting a bullet in his head? Same goes for basically every Batman villain except Clayface, Solomon Grundy, and Killer Croc.

Also I believe heroes like Superman have been shown to be much more effective at actually lowering crime, a lot of stories say Batman might have made Gotham even worse, and I do believe he was deputized by the PD. The MPD SCU has also been shown to be pretty effective in their own way dealing with superpowered crime.

What the actual fuck?

I think it would be fun to have a comic focused on the Police Department in more self aware comic book world. You know they have class on battling atop moving vehicle/while climbing large structures as part of basic training. The SWAT unit employs a giant mech, ect.

It's really sort of a Necessary Weasel. I've seen people argue that one of the big problems with Thou Shall Not Kill is that while it makes sense for the heroes, there's literally no excuse for the cops not pumping someone like the Joker full of hot lead. Especially given how trigger happy cops tend to be in the news quite a bit these days.

@Vampire Buddha: That was back in the late 1950s, Batman's cuddliest period—which also was the basis for a lot of the Adam West TV show. Batman was deputized by the police force, had his costume legally protected, smiled a lot...

Cops don't shoot to kill unless you're black and unarmed.

Zing!

On the subject, the only time I've ever actually seen it addressed where cops or guards took it upon themselves to kill the Joker was an issue Paul Dini did where they did try and get rid of him, only for a Deus ex Machina to result in his escape.