This is the thread for discussing Dungeons & Dragons 3rd Edition rules and how they may or may not apply to The Order of the Stick.
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Edited by wingedcatgirl on Feb 22nd 2024 at 11:46:50 AM
I think True Neutral is probably the best outcome we can hope for for V, after seeing the results of Familicide.
Alignment on which he acts =/= posthumous score. A single Evil action can change the latter, but not the former. He accrued a couple kilonazis on that one spell, but continued to act TN while the afterlife he would be heading to was probably NE.
Remember that alignment is not a Karma Meter. Even if they racked up loads of evil points back with the Familicide, that doesn't mean they can't change alignment but simply acting differently.
Although, it says something about their alignment that they would ever do it in the first place.
edited 14th Mar '12 12:54:18 AM by MangaManiac
Lapses happen. Remember bandit camp? Roy wasn't acting very LG when he left Elan. But he reconsidered.
V has a chance for the same. It was the same spur of the moment decision. Difference is that V's took immediate effect and was way bigger. So his penance will have to be too.
edited 14th Mar '12 1:04:58 AM by Adannor
Agreed: the Diva made the point to Roy that the fact he was always trying to be Lawful Good even with the slip ups, and that that was the important thing. Mere mortals (re: PCs) can't be the epitome of their alignment 24/7 due to, well, being mortal.
In V's case, yes: major slip-up. But, if ke continues to face the music and works to try to limit or repair the damage somehow, then that shows attempting to get back on track. That counts. What measures V takes? Will determine the outcome.
speaking of the Deva shouldn't they know about Eugine's burning of V's file by now?. Honestly if Roy wasn't so impatient about being raised he'd be clued in on this,becuase when your case worker wishes to tell you something you really should listen.
edited 14th Mar '12 7:24:36 PM by dazai
Diva?
Are you sure it wasn't a deva? Maybe it was a deva that was a diva.
Lost in Space
Celestial beings can't intervene in the mortal plane without being specifically summoned, except under extreme circumstances, which this really doesn't qualify for. Also, the impression I get of the "cloud realm", for lack of a better term, is that one's alignment is locked at the moment of death, and actions post-mortem don't affect it. If Eugene qualified for Lawful Good, that's where he's going should the Blood Oath get fulfilled, no matter how much of a Jerkass he is as a spirit.
Of course, when said actions materially affect the outcome in the mortal world, I wonder if an exception might be made. But that would be for Rich to decide; there's no canon rule for it.
edited 14th Mar '12 11:53:36 AM by Fighteer
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
I'm allowed to be a spelling idiot. I'm short, female, a cute cuddle-bunny and, therefore, special! <lofty tones> 
EDIT: I'm also still getting to grips with the new keyboard layout. <growls>
edited 14th Mar '12 2:33:36 PM by Euodiachloris
A minor typo had multiple people thinking diva was the right term :P
The sad thing is I have the book that she appears in and I still misspelled it. I just have the impression that Roy's caseworker by keeping an eye on his actions as well as Eugine's by extension. Speaking of Roy's time up above any guesses on what that feat Horace taught him was?.
edited 14th Mar '12 8:06:20 PM by dazai
Seems like some kind of caster disruption ability?
Lost in Space
It seems unlikely to be a core feat. Without knowing any more details I'd be hard pressed to assign a specific mechanic to it, but were I to design such a thing myself I might have it be a feat whereby a successful melee attack imposes an additional penalty on the target's Concentration checks.
Maybe something like this:
Disrupting Strike
Prerequisites: Weapon Specialization
Effect: The damage inflicted by your specialized weapon is doubled for its effect on Concentration checks. Also, any opponent that you have damaged with your specialized weapon in the previous combat round takes a penalty equal to half your base attack bonus to their Concentration checks to cast defensively.
edited 15th Mar '12 9:38:08 AM by Fighteer
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Complete Arcana has a feat called Mage Slayer. Somewhere in that tree is basically a "Characters can't cast defensively around you" feat.
Have we ever seen Xykon cast defensively?
Also, what are we talking about again?
^^I do not think what you think it means.
we were talking about what feat Horace may have taught Roy. I know that Casting defensively means succeeding a Concentration Check to avoid provoking an attack of opportunity though I'm not sure why I phrased the question like that.
Horace? Did I miss something?
His grandfather. The previous wielder of the Greenhilt Sword. Though Dazai may be getting the name wrong, I think Horace is the wizard greenhilt.
edited 15th Mar '12 11:06:26 PM by Adannor
Ahhh. Hmmm... Roy's intelligence score actually WOULD make him a prime target for using the Mage Slayer feat, if he can drop 4 skill points to get 2 ranks in Spellcraft. If he did so, for the cost of one feat, spellcasters would be unable to cast defensively. With power attack (and presumably some way of hitting Xykon's defenses), he'd actually be able to counter act Xykon's concentration checks while wielding a two handed weapon. So, it's plausible-seems unlikely because it's non-core BUT, Mage Slayer IS a bonus fighter feat.
ACTUALLY, with Pierce Magical Protection, Xykon's defenses would be limited to ... well, a shit ton of high powered magical items.
Does Xykon use Bracers of Armor, or does he cast Mage Armor?
edited 15th Mar '12 11:30:23 PM by TheyCallMeTomu
According to the spell list O'Chul made, Xykon has Epic Mage Armour, so probably the latter.
Though he also has a magic item of some kind that grants fire immunity.
edited 16th Mar '12 6:41:19 AM by Gilphon
Lost in Space
Xykon doesn't seem to attract a lot of misses in melee combat, indicating that he doesn't place a terribly high emphasis on Armor Class. Fitting given his innate Damage Reduction. Rich pointed out in one of the book commentaries that he is of the opinion that a creature with Damage Reduction would tend to be relatively fearless in combat, counting on DR to make it immune to most injuries.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Right. I mean, Roy uses a sword, so he's kinda So L on the damage reduction issue, but Epic Mage Armor can be totally negated if he takes Pierce Magical Protections or whatever it's called. The real question is whether Rich is willing to give Roy feats from a non-core source, even if they do perfectly fit the narrative.
I don't know if I'd say V will ever reach Good alignment so much as simply less callous and power driven. I think a Good alignment would be more like V goes out to right wrongs and whatnot. Not something I see happening.