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2020 mod notice:

Because this thread is a central OTC hub for lots of information and news, it is not likely to be locked.

However, for the same reason, the amount of panicking and fearmongering has more potential impact here.

If you are posting unsourced, inflammatory statements, or responding with "we're all doomed!", that is obviously and clearly damaging the quality of this thread. And you will be warned, your post mod-edited, thumped, or suspended if necessary.

Edited by SeptimusHeap on Feb 6th 2020 at 4:18:00 PM

RainehDaze METANOIA from Scotland Relationship Status: Mu
METANOIA
May 22nd 2020 at 7:24:36 PM

You have to have a really negative interpretation of Biden to assume that's what was meant.

Create a history, with the light God could not know
Demongodofchaos2 Best Dad from Eldritch Nightmareland Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Best Dad
May 22nd 2020 at 7:32:41 PM

[up][up] While true, pretty much most of the people that are African American voting for him not only acknowledge that he was joking, but even appreciated the fact that he apologized for it.

Edited by Demongodofchaos2 on May 22nd 2020 at 10:33:09 AM

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Fighteer Geronimo! from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Geronimo!
May 22nd 2020 at 7:38:22 PM

Yeah, why don't we ask a black person how they felt, rather than presume to be offended on their behalf?

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AzurePaladin The Part-Time Lurker from Hakurei Shrine Relationship Status: Mu
The Part-Time Lurker
May 22nd 2020 at 7:47:13 PM

I'm angry on my own behalf, thank you very much.

She/Her Pronouns
Draghinazzo My love, has dressed me like a clown Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
My love, has dressed me like a clown
May 22nd 2020 at 7:47:47 PM

I don't think anyone is under the impression that Biden's statement couldn't have been worded better or that it didn't have poor implications. But as has been pointed out, most of the reactions of black people seem to be that while the former is true, the intention of the statement had some truth to it and they seem to be more concerned about the false equivalence the right is doing, pretending that Trump is in any way comparable to Biden.

Edited by Draghinazzo on May 22nd 2020 at 10:48:28 AM

It's the end of the world as we know it, and I feel fine. ...not really though.
RainehDaze METANOIA from Scotland Relationship Status: Mu
METANOIA
May 22nd 2020 at 7:50:03 PM

[up] I wonder if there's also an element of "if Biden WASN'T saying something awkward in off the cuff remarks, it would seem off".

Create a history, with the light God could not know
Fighteer Geronimo! from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Geronimo!
May 22nd 2020 at 7:55:46 PM
Thumped: Wow. That was rude. Too many of this kind of thump will bring a suspension. Please keep it civil.
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AzurePaladin The Part-Time Lurker from Hakurei Shrine Relationship Status: Mu
The Part-Time Lurker
May 22nd 2020 at 7:58:38 PM

First off - wow. Just...wow.

Second off, no, I didn't post about it on social media. I'm not interested in people liking my posts or whatever.

Edited by AzurePaladin on May 22nd 2020 at 10:58:56 AM

She/Her Pronouns
May 22nd 2020 at 8:03:32 PM

I feel like everyone needs a puppy break to cool down a bit.

(For anyone who doesn't know, his is something we do on the coronavirus thread as a break from everything terrible.)

Edited by megaeliz on May 22nd 2020 at 11:14:16 AM

Fighteer Geronimo! from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Geronimo!
May 22nd 2020 at 8:05:32 PM

Sorry, that was uncalled for. You can feel however you like. But my core point stands: being angry at things without directing that anger into some sort of productive action doesn't help.

This whole election cycle has me bored to tears. In 2016, I got much enjoyment and slowly creeping horror from watching the Republican primary, and was utterly flabbergasted to see the media bending itself inside out to make the election seem like a war of scandals instead of an ignorant, racist sexual predator against a massively qualified political veteran.

This one, though... I have no interest in hearing what Trump has to say about anything ever again. He belongs in prison with a muzzle. I know how awful things can get and what the stakes are. Biden could piss in a bum's face or salute the Nazi flag and I'd still have no choice but to vote for him. Anyone who doesn't feel the same way isn't someone I can even have a reasoned conversation with.

Edited by Fighteer on May 22nd 2020 at 11:11:20 AM

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AzurePaladin The Part-Time Lurker from Hakurei Shrine Relationship Status: Mu
The Part-Time Lurker
May 22nd 2020 at 8:11:45 PM

Well, I'd have second thoughts if he was saluting a Nazi flag...But I know what you mean.

I know the stakes, I've said repeatedly that he has my vote in the name of harm reduction. Still have hard feelings about this sort of thing though.

She/Her Pronouns
May 22nd 2020 at 8:14:20 PM

I genuinely feel he was trying to make a joke and said something dumb before trying to apologize for it.

May 22nd 2020 at 8:14:40 PM

For all any of us know Azure is a black person and you're doing exactly what you said she shouldn't be doing.

Or, and this may be unduly presumptuous of me, as a trans person who is very familiar with people dying a core aspect of her identity, she's very sensitive to people doing so to others even if she's not actually a member of th e specific demographic.

Either would be a perfectly valid reason to take offense, even giving Biden the benefit of the doubt he didn't mean it that way.

The snark is unnecessary.

Edited by LSBK on May 22nd 2020 at 10:15:35 AM

Demongodofchaos2 Best Dad from Eldritch Nightmareland Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Best Dad
May 22nd 2020 at 8:14:54 PM

Considering that Trump was at one point gonna apparently do the first nuclear tests in decades before being told not to, Yeah, its obvious who I'm still voting for at this point.

Edited by Demongodofchaos2 on May 22nd 2020 at 11:19:55 AM

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PhysicalStamina so i made a new avatar from Not DC, transplants. Relationship Status: It's so nice to be turned on again
so i made a new avatar
May 22nd 2020 at 8:15:56 PM

Still, you'd think he'd learn to be more careful at this point.

It's only political when you don't agree with the 'politics' presented.
May 22nd 2020 at 8:16:57 PM

I don't think even Biden himself would argue that he should be exempt from criticism because of Trump. I don't have any compunction in saying that Biden is the only moral choice if he's against Trump, but constructive and good faith criticism from your own side is a good thing.

Edited by Lightysnake on May 22nd 2020 at 8:18:33 AM

Fighteer Geronimo! from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Geronimo!
May 22nd 2020 at 8:17:17 PM

Damn it, this isn't a time when identity politics will help. I absolutely sympathize with the frustration of marginalized minorities, but no matter how you feel about Biden, look at what he faces. On one side, at least there's a chance to keep one's rights and advance one's cause. On the other, you'd be lucky to survive.

I've said many times that I preferred Elizabeth Warren, but that ship has sailed.

By all means, push for Biden and the Democrats to adopt the most progressive and sensitive platform possible. Speak up. Don't be marginalized. But don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good.

Edited by Fighteer on May 22nd 2020 at 11:18:54 AM

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May 22nd 2020 at 8:19:54 PM

I don't want to speak for Azure, but she did say she would vote for Biden for precisely that reason.

We need to be united, but I think there are ways to have good-faith conversations with the nominee, which are attitudes he's been encouraging.

Edit: Making it clear the 'he' is Biden, not Azure. Want to make that firmly clear in case it was ambiguous.

Edited by Lightysnake on May 22nd 2020 at 8:20:55 AM

Draghinazzo My love, has dressed me like a clown Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
My love, has dressed me like a clown
May 22nd 2020 at 8:23:32 PM

Still, you'd think he'd learn to be more careful at this point.

It doesn't seem to have overly hurt him so far, but I agree that it would do nothing but help (if only marginally) if he stopped putting his foot in his mouth.

It's the end of the world as we know it, and I feel fine. ...not really though.
RainehDaze METANOIA from Scotland Relationship Status: Mu
METANOIA
May 22nd 2020 at 8:23:36 PM

Just seems excessive to me to get angry at someone when they do have a point, we can all see what the point they were getting at is, and the situation doesn't even lend itself to nicely planned responses. Then the phrasing is bad and for the next 24 hours this is what everyone's up in arms about.

Even before comparing to Trump's remarks in a similar time period.

[up] I always find it fascinating how easy people sometimes assume it must be to not only unlearn behaviours but completely relearn how to think in conversation at all times.

Edited by RainehDaze on May 22nd 2020 at 4:25:34 PM

Create a history, with the light God could not know
May 22nd 2020 at 8:26:00 PM

[up] Especially since the quote was from a famous movie.

Edited by megaeliz on May 22nd 2020 at 11:29:44 AM

BearyScary Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
May 22nd 2020 at 8:33:54 PM

I'm all for criticizing Biden when he messes up. We may actually get through to him sometimes, unlike, well... you-know-who.

My blog--an ode to the history of video games
Fighteer Geronimo! from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Geronimo!
May 22nd 2020 at 8:35:15 PM

Well, he did apologize. So that alone is orders of magnitude better than what we've currently got.

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SatoshiBakura    Remember freedom?    from    The Shadow Realm    Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
   Remember freedom?   
May 22nd 2020 at 8:53:54 PM

I don't usually speak here, but I feel the need to express my opinion now.

I don't totally like Biden that much. I do wish that someone more progressive like Warren or Sanders was nominated. And I do hope that a progressive is nominated for VP.

But right now, none of that matters. Trump is a major threat to everyone. He has proven himself to be a horrible, impossibly stupid, impossibly callous human being. And his actions are actually getting people killed.

So what if Biden is not who I wish to support? We need to support him over Trump no matter what. Any vote not for Biden might as well be a vote for Trump. We can't let him win.

   Don't want to be an American idiot...   
M84 Light our darkest hour! from Our little blue planet Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Light our darkest hour!
May 22nd 2020 at 8:56:56 PM

We're at the point where the POTUS is telling people to drink bleach and take drugs with dangerous side effects that aren't proven to actually help.

...You know, part of me couldn't believe that I just typed that sentence.

Disgusted, but not surprised

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