General Sonic The Hedgehog thread

I mean, that's not exactly wrong...

It's just the conclusion from the train of thought is a little drastic.

Plain and simple, that's never going to happen.

I can't disagree with it, because it's absolutely true. But it's extremely drastic to just toss out over two decades of content, even if it was controversial.

Modern Sonic has been around for more than the series` entire lifespan.

I understand faith in the series is low, and that the series does need to reestablish itself, but do you really need to throw Modern Sonic under the bus to do it?

Edited by BlackYakuzu94 on Nov 26th 2020 at 2:40:57 PM

Modern Sonic isn't going anywhere. I wouldn't worry.

Oh I know that, it's just disturbing how people genuinely feel that way. It's not even just a minority opinion either.

After Mania was so damn successful over Forces, there's more than a few people musing how they should be the ones running the series now.

....maybe Modern Sonic does need a break though. They clearly don't know what to do with it.

Using the Mania formula to rebuild their pedestal while they figure out how to do Modern Sonic correctly may not be a poor idea. As long as they make it clear they aren't abandoning the modern stories.

I don't fully know how I'd improve Modern Sonic except for one thing: Bring back how he controlled in the Adventure series.

Sonic controls so fluidly in Adventure 1 and 2 & he's never controlled so fluidly since then. Playing through Colors helps make me realize as I struggle with precision platforming in that game as Colors's platforming controls aren't as fine-tuned as the Adventure games are.

Sonic has a whole slew of issues that go beyond just the control, and I wouldn't even know how to begin tackling them all. We're talking over twenty years of mismanagement here.

What's baffling is that only Sonic seems to go through as none of Sega's other franchises seem to be suffering.

Considering Sonic Retro is mostly comprised of hardcore Classic fans, not surprised they would make that sort of consensus

That said, I wouldn't mind if they put 3D games on hold to re-think their approach and stuff (no matter what, though, Sonic's gameplay from the Adventure games is most ideal). Just so long we keep getting Modern material rather than just pure Classic. Like, why can't we have new 2D Modern games like the Advance series and Rush duology?

I mean, it's kind of in the name.

Edited by Perseus on Nov 26th 2020 at 9:43:21 PM

Other than aesthetics (& worse level design) Advance is practically no different from the classics.

It doesn't need to be Advance 4(because obviously), it just needs to be a new 2D game.

Another Rush Game with some more playable characters and a bit of the mindset they used for Sonic 3 and Knuckles wouldn't be so bad actually.

Plus, people do like Blaze. The only issue is that people might not have faith they could do it well....and that's well earned.

Imo, the best way forward - though Sonic Team might not have the resources for it any more - would be to focus on having a range of experiences. Continue Mania, make a new 3D game, and then maybe a third platform series a la Rush, and just commit to making a new one every few years, rather than throwing everything behind their big new projects all the time. Consistency.

Wouldn't having Mania and another series like Rush/Advance be kind of redundant? That's kind of been a criticism lately, that with Mania around, the 2D segments of the 3D games aren't really needed anymore...and they're worse in every way than what Mania offered.

This isn't necessarily a problem, but it does make me understand where Retro is coming from; Mania is quite literally the most successful product the series has had in years, so much so that it completely overshadowed the series "main game" and it wasn't even made in-house.

It's honestly hard to justify why should anybody have faith in Sonic Team to deliver a satisfying experience where there is already a team capable of doing so.

I'll go to bat for the Modern games, but even I can't really say I have any faith they'll deliver anything actually satisfying now, and even if they did, there's no guarantee that they will be able to keep it up. I really try not to be cynical towards this series, but it's really hard not to be.

I feel like what the series truly needs, are people who are actually interested in pushing it forward and making a new vision. I honestly feel like Sonic Team, whoever is left of them, just aren't interested in making Sonic games anymore. Everything after Generations just feels so phoned in and lacking that it's hard to even say they CAN deliver a good game. So I'd at least be interested in what a new director would bring to the table.

But yea, either get Christian Whitehead to make a new Mania sequel (maybe a new artstyle plus Amy into the mix) or hire somebody who actually gives a damn, but I can't really say I'm all too enthusiastic for another entry from the in-house devs at this point.

Basically, what they were doing until '06?

I do think that part of the reason why certain fans are restless nowadays might be in part because all we are getting are the big projects with no side projects in sight.

Edited by powerpuffbats on Nov 26th 2020 at 5:18:58 AM

I second this. Get someone who wants to work on the game, and is willing to put in the work, and give them time to do that (instead of trying to rush them, which has been a big issue with a lot of Sonic games).

After that, earn back trust of gamers, before maybe taking some risks by bringing back spin-offs.

I also wanna rescind a bit; its not that Sonic Team don't wanna work on Sonic games...they don't want to make consistently good Sonic games, they want to experiment and treat Sonic like its their personal tech demo.

They're like children who want to play with their toys however they want.

Pretty much my biggest objection to "just make more Mania" is that I vastly prefer the Modern aesthetic to Classic.

I'm sure that's a lot of people, but the entire point of Mania is that it's built on the Classic aesthetic primarily and given how popular it was, there's absolutely way they'll use any modern aesthetics for that series.

I think the gameplay experiences, while similar, are sufficiently different enough that people wouldn't only buy one or the other. Like Megaman X vs Zero vs Megaman Classic.

Rush, especially, is a very different beast. It's boost gameplay in 2D.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Nov 26th 2020 at 3:46:08 AM

Not that there's any difference other than 5 character designs.

I feel like they'd have to differentiate them just a bit more to make that more obvious.

There's definitely more of a focus on speed (and therefore, spectacle) in Rush than in the slower paced and more explorative Mania.

The only downside I can see is that Rush is pretty homogenized around Boost, so there's not much room for diversity, which means everyone might just end up playing too similar to each other.

Well there's a lot less focus on spectacle, and linear levels in Mania, and the lack of plot and voice acting is another difference.

Edited by BlackYakuzu94 on Nov 26th 2020 at 6:51:23 AM

imo, split the core series into three different pillars.

Classic platformer series, Boost racing series (or a racer/platformer hybrid, given I'm suggesting the same control scheme of the Boost games recontextualised), and the return of Adventure styled games to serve as a more occasional entry in the series.

Honestly what needs to happen is for the adventure crowd to have a team like the people who made Mania, and for them to make their own 3d sonic.

Better than Sonic Team is able to make nowadays.

The thing is, fans understand how to do 3D Sonic even less than Sega do lol. The best 3D game to date is in fact, you guessed it, a Classic styled one with Sonic Robo Blast 2.

Project Hero is transitioning to a simpler control scheme and Classic aesthetics.

The only finished Modern 3D fangame that is actually finished is Sonic GT, and that's definitely more reminiscent of Boost than Adventure.

I'm torn; there definitely needs to be more Mania games, without a doubt; but I honestly can't tell you what the 3D games should be doing. Can't just say "Do Sonic Adventure again" because here's the thing about Sonic Adventure; its' technically six different games in one. So are people about the whole package or just the part with Sonic in it lol.