Star Trek

Holy shit talk about unexpected character.

Well, this show is all about the deep cuts huh?

The funny thing is, it's so obvious now that she was tied to Sybok.

She couldn't help but notice Spock's pain. It ran deep, and he shared it with her.

<Ducks a brick>

On a completely different note, Spock telling Chapel doesn't change anything, since Chapel wasn't crew member by the time Sybok actually showed up. In fact, with the current exception of Uhura, he could theoretically tell all the members of the crew who aren't part of the Kirk helmed Enterprise crew if the writers wanted to.

The tattoo was what gave it away for me. That screams "pirate" pretty loudly.

Who put up that energy web? If it was a trap by the pirates, it seems to get in the way of Angel's plan.

When I saw the "Previously on" at the start and they showed the scene of Captain Pike holding a dinner party, I didn't think that was going to be foreshadowing that his ability to cook was going to be a plot point.

Edited by WillKeaton on Jun 16th 2022 at 4:33:53 AM

I dont think it was an obstacle to Angel's plan coz Angel's basically the one who tells Spock how to get out of it. I think it was just there to ingratiate herself further. For all we know either power source could've been valid and Spock only thought he had a 50-50 thing

Edited by Ghilz on Jun 16th 2022 at 2:54:05 AM

Pike was on fire this episode and he wasn't even the focus character. There's a bit toward the end I'm half-convinced was a blooper they left in.

At this point the show has a pretty comfortable rhythm, it knows what it wants to do and is having fun with the way the characters interact. "How close do you want me to get? First date or third date?" "How about blind date?" We are getting the barest hints of a Myth Arc, and it's more in the sense of setting something up for later, Sybok is one hell of a reveal and a villain who practically gets a Dr. Claw "Next time, Gadget, next time!"

Edited by EmeraldSource on Jun 17th 2022 at 6:59:22 AM

And who has a cool ship shaped like a bug!

Re: Pike and Ortegas' banter, I hope the latter gets a focus episode before this season is over because to date I feel like everyone else has gotten deeper characterization if not their own episode.

Ortegas is still kind of an enigma. She gives off very strong queer energy of some sort and is a very good helmsperson, but we know next to nothing about her.

I mean, the most detail we've gotten is having an ego in Starfleet Academy and apparently having gotten wrapped up in a Vulcan relationship and got hit with a lirpa.

This episode didn't work for me. Both because I really didn't buy the ship capture, the sudden communication delays (except for when the villain and Spock need to talk to T'Pring (is the Vulcan-only prison colony on the edge of the Federation? Why would that possibly be the case?)) and the general incompetence of security. I know it's a long-running Star Trek trope that security is basically useless, but in this one it really jumps out. I also really disliked the scene where Nurse Chapel wins the fight against two armed pirates. It was well done technically, but I really dislike the tendency to force every character into the 'skilled combatant' role. I did like that T'Pring did trust Spock and took the actually logical out that he gave her. I'm a little concerned how that's going to tie into who we know she becomes, but we'll see...

Edited by ECD on Jun 18th 2022 at 6:09:30 AM

I'm enjoyng SNW a lot, alongside The Orville they're really giving me the kind of sci-fi I like and haven't had in years. I'm not up to date to it tho so please spare me to be a little behind.

I found the Freaky Friday episode of Spock Amok fun although at first I role my eyes on how fantasy-based it was until I remembered there's a similar episode in TOS.

My only problem with the show is personal, now that the Gorn are presented as humanitarians. I wrote and published a sci-fi comedy novel back in 2013 that had man-eating Reptiloids as the main villains. The Gorn were never established as man-eaters before thus saw no problem, now that they are people is going to think I copied Star Trek.

I liked the Omelas, I mean, Majalis episode even with the Downer Ending though I couldn't avoid to feel a little contrive. The Elder was about to open-up to Pike when Spock interrupted. I mean, I think Pike would clearly said to Spock "I'll be there in a minute" and wait to see what the guy was to say. Is not like he has to run as if there was an emergency or something. Also if the guy was so much up to save the kid he clearly could spoke before as it is obvious they won't deliver him if they knew. Interesting ending and the kind of ending that indeed stays with you as good sci-fi usually do, but I think that part could be handled better.

Also I was thinking; is really wise for M'Benga to carry his daughter around in a ship that can be destroy or suffer a power disruption that would erase her? Wouldn't be safer for her to have her in some medical facility somewhere safer... like Earth. I know he wants to be close to her to keep in touch but that feels more like he fulfilling his emotional needs to see her often not so much her own interest. Not that I think he's a bad guy or something is just... weird.

Edited by Dgon on Jun 18th 2022 at 9:33:17 AM

Well the people on Earth were making her comfortable for her death in a year's time. M'Benga is keeping her in a transporter to buy time until he finds some alien technology or miracle in space. I think the implications of the Ghosts episode is that no ethical hospital would consider M'Benga's activities justified.

So much so that he was willing to stop it and let her pass on.

Which is weird cuz one common fan discussion is precisely that keeping patients with terminal or incurable deceases in the transporter's memory until a cure is found should be a standard medical practice.

Maybe not that weird if we consider that keeping people in the transporter isn't only unsafe, but clogs it up when it might be needed for other people, along with introducing other problems, like we saw happen with the sick bay transporter.

Although it's in the future, Star Trek: Deep Space Nine does complicate things a little, since it outright shows you can transport someone, and load them onto some regular computer chips without worrying about their pattern degrading. You could hold someone in that kind of setup indefinitely.

Edited by techno156 on Jun 19th 2022 at 7:34:25 PM

I think DS 9 is probably tech advances. But I don't think it blocks usage of the medical transporter. We see that it's used a bunch in the show. It's the fact that he was hiding it meant it didn't get security updates it needed, because that would reveal she was there, which was the problem.

This one really does feel like rebellion for the sake of rebellion.

They're definitely going with the idea this is highly unethical and nonstandard practice. My assumption is they also don't seem to use stasis in the future either. I wouldn't be surprised if this is because of the Roddenberry-esque idea that humans are not excessive about attempts to stay alive in the future.

It's worth pointing out that transporter accidents do happen and not always due to negative space wedgies. See The Motion Picture where 2 people just die in the Enterprise transporter and that's transporting someone from Earth from one transporter room to another. Basically ideal conditions.

So it's not entirely unjustified to have the medical establishment be "Yeah not sure about storing people long term into transporter buffers" when there's a non 0 chance each time you'll get back a puddle of goo.

Plus there's the obvious difference that aboard the Enterprise, Dr. M'Benga can ask people he meets about ideas for cures. If you're doing that back on Earth you're just hoping a cure will come up which could lead to patients being stuck in transporter buffers for year. Have fun coming out with your entire family dead or some such.

I'd argue that STTMP actually was deconstructing some Star Trekisms. Scotty flat out told Kirk the ship was incomplete in its refurbishment and not ready to go out for a couple of more days at minimum.

But it was the one time in his life he wasn't padding his estimates.

But as we see, M'Benga's daughter just notes her dad is acting REALLY weird to her over the course of a few days she's experiencing. Because it's been almost a year already. Not much quality of life.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Jun 19th 2022 at 6:48:16 AM

Exactly.

I think no one is saying that M'Benga shouldn't be traveling in space finding a cure instead of just passively staying on Earth. Is just questionable that he keeps his daughter in such on and off state more for him than for her. It doesn’t really do anything good for her as she's not conscious as long as is in stasis thus the only reason to do it is for himself because he emotionally wants to be with her and seeing her periodically for his own needs and not hers.

He could keep her in a safer place, keep travelling and doing research taking advantage of the exploration and if something promising happens ask for a leave and goes whenever he has her to apply it.

Edited by Dgon on Jun 19th 2022 at 7:17:36 AM

You know how there's that weird detail about M'Benga being the main doctor in SNW and he's like, an assistant in the original show who only shows up occasionally?

Maybe this is why?

I think the point is that Doctor M'Benga can't store her anywhere else. He has her in the pattern buffer and is constantly dephasing her because it is a lunatic solution and they apparently don't use stasis for the dying in Star Trek. If he'd left her on Earth, she'd be dead by the time he returned.

CharlesPhipps: They're definitely going with the idea this is highly unethical and nonstandard practice. My assumption is they also don't seem to use stasis in the future either. I wouldn't be surprised if this is because of the Roddenberry-esque idea that humans are not excessive about attempts to stay alive in the future.

Cryostasis, and transporter use is contraindicated for use with medically vulnerable patients. When Voyager had to put its crew under, they required constant active monitoring, and a careful/lengthy frosting/thawing process, which might not be ideal for someone on the verge of death. Similarly, transporting the newborn Naomi Wildman caused a neurochemical imbalance that's needed her to be hospitalised for a few days/a week, which is probably also bad news for someone on the verge of death.

The only reason you might transport someone who is dying is if they needed urgent medical treatment, and could be saved in the shorter transport time compared to moving them conventionally.

Ghilz: It's worth pointing out that transporter accidents do happen and not always due to negative space wedgies. See The Motion Picture where 2 people just die in the Enterprise transporter and that's transporting someone from Earth from one transporter room to another. Basically ideal conditions.

So it's not entirely unjustified to have the medical establishment be "Yeah not sure about storing people long term into transporter buffers" when there's a non 0 chance each time you'll get back a puddle of goo.

Plus there's the obvious difference that aboard the Enterprise, Dr. M'Benga can ask people he meets about ideas for cures. If you're doing that back on Earth you're just hoping a cure will come up which could lead to patients being stuck in transporter buffers for year. Have fun coming out with your entire family dead or some such.

There's an argument to be made that it wasn't ideal conditions, since the Enterprise was poorly refit, and the transporter wasn't even supposed to be usable due to problems that they found.

Especially since the refit was rushed ahead of time to get the ship out ASAP.

Environmentally, it would have been ideal conditions, short of physically wiring the transporters together, but not with the condition the Enterprise's was in.

Dgon: I think no one is saying that M'Benga shouldn't be traveling in space finding a cure instead of just passively staying on Earth. Is just questionable that he keeps his daughter in such on and off state more for him than for her. It doesn’t really do anything good for her as she's not conscious as long as is in stasis thus the only reason to do it is for himself because he emotionally wants to be with her and seeing her periodically for his own needs and not hers.

He could keep her in a safer place, keep travelling and doing research taking advantage of the exploration and if something promising happens ask for a leave and goes whenever he has her to apply it.

There probably isn't a safe place to keep her that would be able to keep her in stasis like that. The fact M'Benga had to hide it means that it's either a form of preservation that is not medically recommended, or something he thought the Enterprise's crew would not permit.

If it's the former, no medical institution would allow it, compared to just having the disease run its course. Especially since he's working on the very faint hope of maybe finding a cure out amongst the stars. It might not be considered ethical to limit a patient's quality of life (M'Benga's daughter's recent memory is a constant string of bedtimes, with only a few minutes of consciousness between) raising their hopes with a possibility that's not likely to be realised at all.

There's also the possibility that her disease doesn't allow for stasis at all or that leaving medical stasis might severely worsen her condition before a cure or treatment can be applied.

In this case the transporter buffer is actually her best solution. And since M'Benga doesn't have access to any other Transporter that'd let him do this, Enterprise it is.

I could see there being a ban on using stasis (whether freezing or transporter based) in this way.

If, whenever someone's health starts failing, you put them in stasis until a way of prolonging their life can be found, then you'd end up putting every dying person in stasis, whether their problem is illness, injury, or just their body giving out from old age. Eventually, the number of people in stasis, awaiting a cure, would outnumber the living.

You'd end up creating a society where most of their resources, and a not inconsiderable amount of their time, is devoted to keeping their ancestors on ice indefinitely, rather than on improving their own futures. Whether that's a fair burden to place on future generations is definitely a question worth asking.

That could be it.

Pike is really making merits as the best ST captain. He feels like a combination of Kirk and Picard.

Makes sense when you remember TOS Pike's basically the first draft of the character that would become Kirk. This interpretation of Pike is basically a Kirk 3.0 if TOS Pilot Pike was 1.0 and Kirk was 2.0

He's even got some Sisko too (Cooking, he's more casual with his entire crew).

Edited by Ghilz on Jun 19th 2022 at 1:30:03 AM