El Goonish Shive

My armchair advice would be "when sex is first suggested". Something like "if we're going there, there's something you should know before going further". But of course, there's theory and there's real life...

Yeah, definitely not that. That’s the kind of situation that often leads to trans people being attacked and/or killed. There’s this idea that we only ever tell people right when they’re about to screw us (or during, or after), and it’s this kind of “Hah! See! I tricked you!” thing. Tons and tons of tv shows use that as a source of gross out comedy, because it sure would be disgusting to find out your partner is a trans, huh?

In my own experience, and that of people I know, it’s far smarter to come out as early on as possible, but also as safely as possible. So like. Texting them “Hey, look. Just a heads up. I’m transgender. I was born with (insert parts here), but I’m (insert gender here). I really do like you, and I want to be open and upfront about this. Does this change anything between us?”

Because that way, you’re a safe distance away in case they do react badly, and it’s early enough that it comes across more as just a precautionary thing, like “oh by the way I can’t difest gluten, can we keep that in mind with wherever we go to eat?”

Or, as was mentioned before, only ever dating people who are already aware that you’re trans.

That's why I said "first suggested", not "in the bedroom". To go with your gluten example, my suggestion is the equivalent of mentioning gluten problems when your date suggests "how about we meet for dinner?"

Edit: Oh, and suggesting includes "blatant non-verbal moves".

Edited by Medinoc on Nov 14th 2018 at 5:40:26 PM

Yeah, the tricky part there is that sex isn't always suggested in advance. Sex sometimes just sorta happens.

And I can think of no worse time to have that conversation than when your partner is super-horny and raring to go.

Besides, like I said, sometimes the topic winds up revealing itself if left unchecked. A casual makeout session could easily result in hands being in places that haven't been explained to Sarah yet. Not everyone follows a "traditional" schedule for things like "Third date, goodnight kiss."

Especially in this day and age, where romance is more improvisational art than the strictly-standardized business exchange of the past. We tend more to just hook up than necessarily court these days, which greatly diminishes the window of opportunity between "Want to see a movie?" and "One-way ticket to Bonetown".

Edited by TobiasDrake on Nov 14th 2018 at 9:50:20 AM

Honestly though, this is EGS. Sam will try to tell Sarah he’s trans, and when he explains what that means, the universe itself will censor him so that he can’t mention the existence of naughty bits. Everyone is barbie dolls down there, which is why nobody has ever had sex, and never will.

I don't know. Since the focus of the arc is Grace, I'm guessing that Grace will continue trying to dance around the question/suss things out herself, expose herself as awkwardly as possible to both Sam and Sarah, and then Sarah will reveal that she knew all along. There are five pages of her explaining why she's okay with it, everyone laughs, fin.

Though the no one having sex thing is a given either way.

I think Grace is just the framing device here. I'm sure Sarah's about to set up a flashback to the actual date, and Grace will just pop into voiceovers to ask questions or make comments.

Because surely, Shive wouldn't deprive the audience of actually seeing one of the two long-awaited dates to come out of the MtG arc.

Surely.

Somewhere, Shive sits in a chair in darkness, stroking a white-furred catgirl, and sipping on a cocktail made from the tears of his fans...

Why do that when we could see another date between Elliot and Ashley? That's what everyone is here for, not that ridiculous stuff about Jason or whatever his name is.

Now that is some quality trolling, smokey.

The more I think about it, the more I'm certain that what I previously mentioned will go down. I don't think Shive would want to present Sarah in that negative of a light, so push comes to shove, I think Shive will make it so that Sarah is cool with dating a transman. Besides, we've already had plenty of foreshadowing built up that says that the only problem Sarah had with Elliot in girl form was the "sibling" issue, and Sarah being cool with dating Sam while knowing about him being trans is probably going to be the culmination of all this.

My biggest worry is that Grace is going to continuously be awkwardly inserted into this arc. She really doesn't need to be there.

NP NanaseCraft14

I imagine that sound effect is the noise a gecko makes. ... What does the gecko say?

Kishishishishi ^note  In reference to Gecko Moria

Edited by sgamer82 on Nov 14th 2018 at 11:53:31 AM

I too wish to reach the levels of "done" that let them shrug these pages situations off.

I don't think geckos are colorblind, in fact I think many reptiles can see more colors than we can.

Yeah. He mentions in the commentary that the colour blindness is a secondary transformation to make the task harder.

I will say, I'm amused by the people saying "this is definitely not inflationism in the slightest" when this arc opened with shive admitting the entire story was gonna be suggestive

I think that was more of a general statement, rather than a specific content warning. Note the, "Every so often...". Context is important.

The context is as follows:

1. this happens right before the arc starts

2. the arc has suggestive themes in it other than the inflation strip.

3. Even if it is a stand alone, the fact that Shive admits that this is part of his thought process means it's totally viable to read a fairly common fetish into a comic that features it.

Edited by MrAHR on Nov 15th 2018 at 10:15:09 AM

I never got the appeal of a lot of internet fetishes. But I think it is fair to say that it was an inflation fetish in that panel.

Shive worrying about being too suggestive doesn't mean everything after said worries is going to be pole dancing. Considering the additional context of coming shortly after being briefly and mistakenly labeled "Adults Only" by Patreon, I think a serious case could be made for it implying exactly the opposite, that the forthcoming material will be less risque than it might have been.

Dude if multiple people who don't have a fetish look at a comic and go "oh this looks like that fetish" I don't think it's much of a stretch to say, that in a comic that's ALWAYS been fetishlite, there is a depiction of a fetish in it.

And the "adults only" backtracking doesn't work when the comics in between the nanasecraft and that were still with some sexual themes to it! hell, the nanasecraft story also has it, with nanase's outfit and some of the other jokes with it.

for instance, this comic happened after that revelation

Edited by MrAHR on Nov 15th 2018 at 10:31:27 AM

To an extent it's fine for people to see a fetish if they want to. It's not fine to insist that everyone else see it. Especially when it's a non-sexualized depiction, given that a non-sexual fetish is an oxymoron.

Edited by Daremo on Nov 15th 2018 at 10:34:34 AM

The whole "spherical body engulfing the limbs" look is certainly very distinctive of that particular style of artwork.

Non-sexual fetishes isn't an oxymoron, and many people do actually have nonsexual fetishes. It's a thing in the asexual community, as an example. It's also a thing for many people who have fetishes that might go into nonsexual aspects of their interests as well (why so many BDSM people LARP, for example).

Also fetishes can be depicted not super sexually, and still have sexual overtones. As an example, here is a sfw image from an old wonderwoman comic◊. We know for a fact the person who wrote these comics had a bondage fetish, so we don't even have to speculate on this one. (not to say I think Shive has a specific fetish, just that wonder woman provides a clear and cut case due to what we know).

Finally, we're not saying that everyone can see it, just that to a good deal of us, it's really obvious.

Edited by MrAHR on Nov 15th 2018 at 10:41:18 AM

And for me it's very much not. So where does that leave us?