History WMG / Angel

As mentioned somewhere else, she didn't know about Angel's curse, but she did know he was a vampire - and even a Twilight fan knows that vampires are [[ImAHumanitarian humanitarians]]. She had only known him for a few days, and had no way of telling that he wouldn't simply lose control and rip her apart once he started drinking her blood. Angel even says something about how she's really doing this because she can no longer stand the pressures of Hollywood. She was actually using him as an elaborate suicide method - either he kills her while feeding and she no longer has to deal with her stressful life, or she gets successfully turned and gets to be young and beautiful forever. To her, it would seem like a win-win.

[[WMG: Although it begins with WMG in the source, it's fact. Angel could kill the TrueBlood vampires if they foufgt the way he fights, or if he fought the way they fight.]]

Well he still has his soul so WTF. But other than that the original post makes sense. No matter how much better Connor's life is now, the memory wipe means that the original version him from season 4 doesn't exist anymore. He is for all intents and purposes, dead (even if his memories live on in the new Connor now). Just like many of [[PlanescapeTorment The Nameless One's]] previous incarnations.

[[WMG: {{Jesus}} was one of the Powers That Be, who are in fact [[UsefulNotes/{{Gnosticism}} Aeons]]. Also, some or all of the CthuluMythos is real.]]

[[WMG:Skip killed Billy Blum's original guardian.]]

But it makes more sense if Blum was originally guarded by someone or something else. Wolfram & Hart threatened Cordelia's life to make Angel rescue the guy. To ensure that Cordelia would be rescued, Jasmine's cult eliminated the original guardian and installed Skip in his place to ensure that Angel would succeed; thus Cordelia would not be rescued.

[[spoiler:Instead of giving Connor a real happy life, Wolfram and Hart instead gave him a life that only made him appear successful and happy]] This life is the one of Pete Campbell and is depicted on the TV show {{MadMen}}

** [[http://elisi.livejournal.com/337501.html Have fun!]]
** All of these reasons are awesome. And Angel and Spike's mouths would hang open when they saw him. And then he'd [[KissKissSlap kiss and then punch Spike]], who would be completely confused.
*** ... happened [[Recap/TorchwoodS2E1KissKissBangBang here]], too.
* The two times when we know for sure that the Immortal is in Rome are also times when Jack's whereabouts are more or less undefined (the 19th-century one would be sometime after he jumped back at the end of series 1 ''Series/DoctorWho'', the 21st-century one is slightly before series 1 of ''Series/{{Torchwood}}''.
* Possibly he took the name "The Immortal" because it sounds like a Time-Lord-ish name and he's trying to attract the Doctor's attention.
* The Immortal is said to dislike magic, which corresponds well with Jack's technophilia.
* Jack was fond of Italy in his days as a rogue Time Agent. The Immortal loves Italy but was gone for 350 years. Interesting...
* The CEO of Wolfram & Hart's Roman branch claimed that she had many dealings with him in the past, which would make sense, since Jack would have to have liaisons with such offices if he had to grab alien technology from other countries while running Series/{{Torchwood}} Three.
* Much about the Immortal is a lie crafted by the good guy Slayers. And the info conveyed by Wolfram and Hart? Heck, they lie as a matter of course.
** What are you talking about? Angel and Spike knew about him personally.
*** In the season eight comics Buffy says there are a few look alikes of hers running about and doing stuff to try to fool her enemies about her whereabouts. One of them is in Italy and is apparently getting very close to some Immortal guy. Buffy doesn't know why Andrew suggested this or why he finds it funny. However just because it's not Buffy dating the immortal doesn't mean a) The Immortal isn't real and b) that the Immortal isn't Jack.
*** True. Also, Andrew finds it funny because he's a fan of ''Doctor Who'' (he said that in ''[[Series/BuffyTheVampireSlayer BtVS]]'' season 6).

* As a complimentary theory, Spike is Captain John Hart.

* The Powers That Be are ''Creator/JossWhedon''. They think that TrueArtIsAngsty, and ''the world'' is their artwork.

** ^ This. One of the things one has to remember when talking about Angelus reputation is that it is not about the body counts, it is about the way those bodies ended up. He likes to focus on one person at a time and torture their minds in the way he determines is best before moving on to the final kill or worse turning them. See Drucilla. I always got the impression in Buffy Season 2 that Angel was just taking his time, but you notice as he starts to realize the scoobies are closing in, he picks up the pace some. Just a bit too late. In Angel season 4, he knows his time is limited due to the reasons he was ''released'' so he doesn't have time to bring his "A" Game. That and of course the demons and other vampires after the beast arrives. Had he been given time (and the show been a very different kind of show) we might have seen him really go all out on Faith. And I imagine turning her would have been just the beginning of some potential plan of doom. Probably involving getting back at ''that bitch'' Buffy that Angel loved.

* Ouch.

* Interesting idea, but {{Jossed}} by the DVD commentary.
** ...Which means Joss wasn't writing it with that in mind. It's still the most logical interpretation of the season on both series. It also means that at the very least if no great plan (such as the empowering of all the Potentials, which was what happened) had been found to stop The First from taking over the world, stopping Jasmine would have clearly been the bad decision. Jasmine's UtopiaJustifiesTheMeans was flawed, and most people would probably prefer free will even with the evil that comes with it; but if the other option is "all humans are killed by The First and its minions", it's at the very least the less awful option.

Further evidence for the partners being human is the revealation that their Home Office is on Earth and not some hell dimension, their "children", Hamilton and Eve, are both humans and Holland having WRH taking responsibility from everything to the first murder to the Inquisition and Khmer Rouge. I think more likely the Wolf Ram Hart are sorcerers like the ones who created the first slayer except dedicated towards corruption and evil.

A running theme through the first season is Cordelia getting freaked out and pushy isn't getting enough clients, which seemed not to faze Angel in the slightest. He also didn't think anything of buying an entire abandoned hotel or an entire wardrobe of designer clothes for Cordy. It's likely he looted a lot of money in his rampage through Europe days, stored it, and [[CompoundInterestTimeTravelGambit let it collect interest]].
* Alternatively, he's stolen a lot from dead demons.

* Angelus always seems to talk a bigger game than he plays. He killed [[SacrificialLamb Jenny Calender]] and some [[RedShirt nameless students]] in Series/BuffyTheVampireSlayer, but that's the extent of his successful crimes in his first appearance. He makes lots of threats [[HannibalLecture while he's in a cage]] (including [[AttemptedRape one threat]] toward Fred that the writers probably wouldn't have dared state so bluntly back in S2 Buffy); but once he's out, he doesn't do any permanent damage. This is probably more the result of StatusQuoIsGod than a reflection on Angelus, but it does make his onscreen rampages tame compared to his reputation.

[[WMG: When Conner has a vision of his mother in Angel "Inside Out", it was actually the First.]]

The Beast in ''Series/DoctorWho'' calls himself the bringer of darkness; the first thing The Beast does in Angel is put out the sun. They're both ugly as sin, and are both covered in armor and have horns. They don't look exactly the same, but certainly close enough to [[http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_009NsnA-TcU/R_PjpIpn0PI/AAAAAAAAAbo/px3cT_BIlPQ/s320/s4_beast.jpg notice]] the [[http://listverse.files.wordpress.com/2009/11/the-satan-pit-doctor-beast3.jpg resemblance]]. The slight difference in appearance can be explained by saying that The Beast manifests differently on different planets. Oh, and [[CaptainObvious they're both called "The Beast."]]

[[WMG: The Immortal is JossWhedon.]]

* The Powers That Be are ''JossWhedon''. They think that TrueArtIsAngsty, and ''the world'' is their artwork.

JossWhedon had to have a part for Alan Tudyk somewhere in one of the two shows, and you just know it's him.

**** there's a comic story out there, somewhere, in one of the Omnibus I believe that has something akin to this; where a Slayer became a Vampire, she was Japanese and got tricked, or something (my memory is a tad rusty on this) and became a vampire. So Darla being a Slayer turned would not be out of the question; her actions all in all could possibly support this.

[[WMG: Wolfram and Hart founded the [[{{Dollhouse}} Rossum Corporation]].]]

* Also, taking a little inspiration from Twilight!Angel in the comics, the Senior Partners could be good guys, possibly agents of the Powers that be, who created their organization not only to control and manage the forces of evil, but to corral them for convenient slaughter. I think it's safe to say that everyone in the Circle of the Black Thorn is undeniably evil; it was awfully nice of the Senior Partners to bring them together so Team Angel could take them out. If there was no Circle, no secret society to which all those Big Bads belonged, Angel would never have been able to earn their collective trust and gather the intel required to take them all out.

* On the other hand, Pyleans seem to know about them, and Illyria's statement was somewhat vague. Perhaps the Wolf, Ram and Hart are just a name. Think of brand names like Kodak, Xerox or Macintosh. They're just names that symbolize something. Wolf Ram and Hart is just that - a name or symbol for something even more terrible than any demon or sorcerer could be: the inherent darkness of humanity.

They talk about how psychological profiles and history could have been retrieved after the fall of the council, but it's a little hard to believe that would have enabled a cyborg to impersonate Roger so well his son couldn't tell. Rather, they had access to Roger himself, whose personality and memories were duplicated with his cooperation to create the fake Roger. He helped create the cyborg organization after deciding to be more proactive in going after threats after the Watcher's Council's indolence led to its destruction. Wesley is just trying to convince himself that his father wouldn't really have done this, and the others are aware of how traumatized he is and are willing to play along.