History Fridge / KingdomHearts358DaysOver2

* FridgeLogic: If Xehanort was trying to turn Organization members into vessels, why did Saix give Roxas the idea to keep a diary? That's the sort of self affirming and introspective thing that would help grow a heart, making him a poor host. Even if Saix didn't know this, wouldn't Xemnas have put a stop to it?

* FridgeBrilliance: So, if Axel's such a jerk, why did he choose to be so nice to Roxas, of all people? [[spoiler:Lea met Ventus. Axel retains those memories. Boom, friendship. Though seeing as the meeting between Lea and Ven was only for a few minutes, that it can spark a "best friendship" with Roxas is...strange, to say the least.]]

*** And another bit of FridgeBrilliance there - Ventus met Tinker Bell, but he also met Peter Pan. Peter Pan was intentionally kept out of the game because otherwise he'd become a WalkingSpoiler.
* On a related note, the fact that [[Disney/BeautyandtheBeast Beast's Castle]] is the world where Riku meets Xion and is also [[spoiler: the place where he sees her for the last time]] has a lot of potential for [[Main/FridgeBrilliance Fridge Brilliance]]. Think about it. During this game, Riku's wearing a blindfold to prevent himself from turning into Ansem, which kind of parallels the Beast in a way... While Xion ends up being held against her will by the Organization, not unlike Belle.

* FridgeBrilliance / Tearjerker: In the scene where Roxas and Xion meet [[Disney/{{Aladdin}} Genie]], Genie remarks that they could do better than a simple, "Nice to meet you too," kind of thing. The Tearjerker comes in when you realize that because they're Nobodies, they actually CAN'T do better. Whenever they go into worlds and meet people with Hearts, they're doomed to see everyone around them all enthusiastic and happy/sad/angry/etc while they themselves cannot. The Fridge Brilliance comes in when you realize that it may be one of the reasons they are to remain stealthy. Interacting with normal people, with the Tearjerker in mind, would most definitely lower morale in the group.

* FridgeBrilliance: [[spoiler:Xion is indeed yelling generic taunts to Roxas... but in actuality she's committing SuicideByCop. She knows she's the irregular who isn't supposed to exist; whereas Roxas won't cause any more harm by being alive. So she wants to die, but she can't do it herself, as Roxas needs to inherit her abilities. She's close enough to Roxas that she wants to die for his sake; and she knows that she can't just walk up to Roxas and say, "Kill me. Please. It's for your own good". Thus, she pretends to go AxeCrazy and makes Roxas kill her out of self-defense, and taunts to make him think she really ''is'' AxeCrazy when inside, she's probably tearing herself up with every Ragnarok she throws at Roxas.]]

* Bit of a meta example, but over on the fridge page for ''[[Fridge/KingdomHeartsII KHII]]'', someone decided to erase Xion's name from each (save one) entry, much like with her existence in the actual series. The only way to notice it is that there are obvious missing words and a whole heaping of "'s" without a name to go with it.
** That's not fridge brilliance, that's just vandalism. And poor grammar.

* When I first played through mission 89, I was initially confused why we had to [[spoiler:fight 7 (for mission completion's sake) giant heartless totally alone]] until I realized it's probably [[spoiler:the Organization's underhanded attempt to kill Roxas, who is certainly weaker due to Xion's growth]]. The earlier attempt, [[spoiler:the illusion fight with Xion,]] failed, and after you RTC, Saix seems awfully unhappy that [[spoiler:you survived]].

* The [[BlindIdiotTranslation infamous translation errors between]] [[VideoGame/KingdomHeartsI KH1]] [[BlindIdiotTranslation and]] [[VideoGame/KingdomHeartsII KH2]] may seem particularly odd at first... until you realise they ''aren't'' translation miscues. Would Organization 13 have known or cared about what Jiminy Cricket named the Heartless? Nope. They named them what they wanted.

*** That doesn't necessarily say that's the only explanation. it's known that multiple things in the series, like Xion's name, [[TakeAThirdOption are supposed to mean multiple things.

*** The logic can be seen, only, to expand, it could represent the Oblivion of his friendship with both Axel and Xion (even though, technically, they never stopped being friends)

*** It's extremely conspicuous that Lea dreams of [[spoiler: Roxas reminding him about a promise that Axel ''explicitly made to Xion'']], implying that Axel's memories of Xion were likely overwritten with Roxas in her place to some sort of extent after she died. Whether taken to be platonic or otherwise, the reality is that Axel deeply cared for both of them.

*** Seconded because it's extremely conspicuous that Lea dreams of [[spoiler: Roxas reminding him about a promise that Axel ''explicitly made to Xion'']], implying that Axel's memories of Xion were likely overwritten with Roxas in her place to some extent after she died.

*** Seconded because it's extremely conspicuous that Lea dreams of [[spoiler: Roxas reminding him about a promise that he ''explicitly made to Xion'']], implying that Axel's memories of Xion were likely overwritten with Roxas in her place to some extent after she died.

*** Seconded because it's extremely conspicuous that Lea dreams of [[spoiler: Roxas reminding him about a promise that he ''explicitly made to Xion'']], implying that to some extent Axel's memories of Xion were likely overwritten with Roxas in her place after she died.

*** Seconded because it's extremely conspicuous that Lea dreams of [[spoiler: Roxas reminding him about a promise that he ''explicitly made to Xion'']], implying that to some extent Axel's memories of Xion were likely overwritten with Roxas in their place after she died.

*** Not really. Considering Dream Drop Distance and [[spoiler:Lea's dream]] interactions with Roxas, I'd say the original troper has a valid point. And remember, he said he also can't just standby and let Xion disappear either.

* FridgeBrilliance: So, if Axel's such an asshole, why did he choose to be so nice to Roxas, of all people? [[spoiler:Lea met Ventus. Axel retains those memories. Boom, friendship. Though seeing as the meeting between Lea and Ven was only for a few minutes, that it can spark a "best friendship" with Roxas is...strange, to say the least.]]
** Except Axel isn't an asshole. He was just acting like one for the sake of his goals. Underneath it, he's a pretty laid back guy.
** Let's review the people who met both Roxas and Ventus. Lea, who didn't meet Ven for long enough to remember him, but did develop enough of a connection to piggyback some rudimentary emotions off of Roxas from the semi-inert Ven heart shaping Roxas; Tinker Bell, who is incapable of speaking English, and so might have actually noticed something, but couldn't say so; Philoteces, who wasn't paying much attention when he met Ven, and would only really remember Terra the Hero and maybe Sexy Aqua (Herc would recognize him, but a big deal was made about how Roxas kept juuust missing him). 358/2 was, it appears, carefully planned so that Roxas either gets sent only to places where Ven didn't go, or to places where Ven went but only at times when the people who could say something weren't there. Braig/Xigbar probably knew the entire time, but didn't say anything out of fear of waking Ven's memories up, since he knew that would be a Bad Thing.

** I always thought it was the beginning of Sora influencing Roxas, like the dreams Roxas has at the beginning of [=KH2=]. Oathkeeper being Sora's promise to Kairi, and Oblivion representing Riku, who, when he and Sora parted ways at the end of the first game, was [[spoiler: trapped in the dark realm]].

*** Sorry to burst your bubbles, but WordOfGod states that Oathkeeper and Oblivion represent Sora's memories of Kairi (Light = Oathkeeper) and Riku (Dark = Oblivion).
*** Doesn't say that's the only explanation though. And we know multiple things in the series, like Xion's name, are supposed to mean multiple things.
*** [[TakeAThirdOption True, very true.]]
** Is this the only troper who always had a feeling that Oblivion represented Roxas's connection with Axel?
*** The logic can be seen, only, to expand, it could represent the Oblivion of his friendship with both Axel and Xion (even though, technically, they never stopped being friends, but you get where I'm coming from, right?)
* At some point early in the game, Roxas gets the day off. He generally spends this day derping around and trying to figure out what he's supposed to do with himself, but that's beside the point. This vacation occurs on Day 118 of Roxas's time in the Organization. Now, to me, Kingdom Hearts 2 has always taken place in late Summer/early Fall, as we see, during the course of [=KH2=], the Struggle Match, which according to DTT residents, always happens right before school starts. Since Roxas spent exactly one year as a separate being from Sora, this means he was born some time in late summer/early fall. There are exactly 116 days between September 1 and December 25. Yes, fellow tropers, Xemnas gave the Organization a Christmas/New Year's vacation.

** Actually, it's stated that the events of Halloween Town in the first game took place 36 days (September 25) before Halloween; meaning Roxas was created around late September/early October. And in some countries, Summer ends around mid September. All we know about the timeline is that Sora woke up just two days before the beginning of the school year, and Xemnas was defeated shortly after Christmas.
** Of course that's 36 Days till before Halloween Town by Halloween Town's timeline. All the worlds run at different speeds...which kind of makes the entire point moot. Still I like to think Xemnas gave them a day off based on the Twilight Town Calendar that The World That Never Was shares.
* After completing the Neverland stage in ''VideoGame/KingdomHeartsBirthBySleep'', this troper suddenly had one of these -- Tinker Bell seemed so insistent on getting Roxas to go somewhere in ''358/2'' because he looks ''exactly'' like Ventus - And Tinker Bell ''knew'' Ventus from 10 years ago. Heck, that's probably also why Peter Pan never appeared in ''VideoGame/KingdomHearts358DaysOver2'' (other than the fact that they were supposed to operate in stealth). Because if Tink remembered Roxas as Ventus, so would Peter Pan. And Peter Pan would probably wind up giving away some of ''VideoGame/KingdomHeartsBirthBySleep'''s plot, even if the Neverland portion was relatively minor. Of course, I don't know why Tink never thought of saying "Hey Peter Pan! Ventus is back! Remember him from 10 years ago?!" That's also probably why we're lucky that Captain Hook never looked over in Roxas's direction -- because he looks ''just'' like Ventus, the kid who kicked his ass 10 years ago (after slowing him, that is.)
* Axel and Saïx are sun and moon. Yeah, Saïx obviously draws power from the moon and that's the symbolism there, but what's Axel's? Look at his weapon - The chakrams actually look like a sun. And sun is often associated with fire...
** An extension of this: Axel's "You know why the sun sets red?" talk... He was talking about ''himself'': He's the color red, the one member of the Organization, who "travelled the farthest", ergo, got closest to regaining his heart: By formining a friendship with Roxas and becoming a piece of his/Ventus' heart.
*** Saix is blue, Xigbar is purple, and Xemnas is purple/black (or rather, ultraviolet), the colors the travel the shortest.
*** And ''why'' does red light travel the farthest? Because it doesn't scatter in the atmosphere as quickly as blue and violet do. [[spoiler: Thanks in part to Roxas and Xion, Axel kept the most of his sense of self out of all the "true" nobodies in Organization XIII, while Saix, Xigbar, and especially Xemnas became little more than vessels for Xehanort's heart.]]

** Unfortunately, there must be two of them, because Roxas was also using the Kingdom Key for the period of time between the end of KHI and the end of [=CoM=]... at the same time as Sora. I'm pretty sure Nomura even confirmed somewhere that they were using the same Keyblade. Besides, how would Riku know about the X-blade, much less about the Kingdom Key being half of it?

* It always annoyed me how [[spoiler: Xion got her keyblade back.]] I mean, "Forgot how to use it?" [[FlatWhat What?]] Then I played [[VideoGame/KingdomHeartsBirthBySleep Birth By Sleep]] and realized what really happened. Roxas [[spoiler: performed a Rite Of Sucession on Xion.]] And Xion was already a Keyblade Weilder, that means [[spoiler:Roxas gave Xion innate dual weilding abilities.]] Therefore [[spoiler:both of Roxas's Keyblades belong to Roxas!]]
* FridgeBrilliance / Tearjerker: In the scene where Roxas and Xion meet Genie, Genie remarks that they could do better than a simple, "Nice to meet you too," kind of thing. Tearjerker comes in when you realize that because they're Nobodies, they actually CAN'T do better. Whenever they go into worlds and meet people with Hearts, they're doomed to see everyone around them all enthusiastic and happy/sad/angry/etc while they themselves cannot. Brilliance comes in when you realize that it may be one of the reasons they are to remain stealthy. Interacting with normal people, with the Tearjerker in mind, would most definitely lower morale in the group.

** It gets even ''worse'' if you go play Drop Dream Distance because [[spoiler:it turns out Saix was one of the ones to undergo the multiple Xehanort plan and so his personality changes were partly due to Xehanort slowly hijacking his brain. It's unclear if Saix was aware was going on to himself, but Axel notices the changes to his friend and...wrote it off as Saix just turning into a bigger jerk and ditched him for Xion and Roxas. ''Ouch''.]]
** It's actually apparent in game that Saix doesn't know anything beyond what Xemnas tells him, and he strongly believed Axel was the one who had changed, not him.[[spoiler: Saix was suspicious of Xemnas's goals and generally wanted to take over the organisation with Axel to get their hearts back. So he couldn't have wanted or even realized he was slowly turning into a vessel for xehanort. Heck even Xemnas at the time didn't know about Xehanort since he's basically possessed Terra's amnesic nobody.]] Xigbar was basically the only member...actually, the ONLY person in the game who knew exactly what was going on.
** Technically Xemnas [[spoiler:knew full well about Xehanort's plan to create the χ-blade to create a new world as shown by Drop Dream Distance even if he didn't have any memories of his life before becoming a Nobody]].

* [[spoiler:Xion's fight has her taking four different forms. Each form except the last is supposed to represent a Birth By Sleep character: First is Ventus (Quite a balanced form), second is Aqua (Focuses on long range and magic), third is Terra (Brute force in every attack). What about the fourth form? Sora.]]

* At the start of the game, a lot of characters are rather flat. But over time, you can see Roxas, Axel and Xion become actual characters. Why? [[spoiler: As noted in 3D, Nobodies can grow Hearts.]] Nobodies ''literally'' go through CharacterDevelopment.

* The Aubade Keyblade, Roxas and Xion's shared Mystery Gear weapon, is symbolic of both of them. An aubade is a serenade or poem by lovers parting ways at dawn (continuing the theme naming of their Keyblades associated with various forms of light). You KNOW that choice of name HAD to be deliberate, and sums up [[spoiler: Roxas and Xion's final scene together, their separation via the latter's death and erasure from physical and mnemonic existence at Twilight Town]].

*** And ''why'' does red light travel the farthest? Because it doesn't scatter in the atmosphere like blue and violet do. [[spoiler: Thanks in part to Roxas and Xion, Axel kept the most of his sense of self out of all the "true" nobodies in Organization XIII, while Saix, Xigbar, and especially Xemnas became little more than vessels for Xehanort's heart.]]

* The Aubade Keyblade, Roxas and Xion's shared Mystery Gear weapon, is symbolic of both of them. An aubade is a serenade or poem by lovers parting ways at dawn (continuing the theme naming of their Keyblades associated with various forms of light). You KNOW that choice of name HAD to be deliberate, and sums up [[spoiler: Roxas and Xion's final scene together, the latter's death and erasure from physical and mnemonic existence at Twilight Town]].

* Just a small one, but during the Saix fight, most magic is pretty much worthless on him... but fire magic hits for a decent amount of damage, more then any other kind. Axel's element is fire. Saix's slight weakness to it symbolizes how even though he's being controlled by Xehanort, and doesn't really feel anything anymore, he still has a soft spot for Axel.

** Let's review the people who met both Roxas and Ventus. Lea, who didn't meet Ven for long enough to remember him, but did develop enough of a connection to piggyback some rudimentary emotions off of Roxas from the semi-inert Ven heart shaping Roxas; Tinker Bell who is incapable of speaking English, and so might have actually noticed something, but couldn't say so; Philoteces, who wasn't paying much attention when he met Ven, and would only really remember Terra the Hero and maybe Sexy Aqua (Herc would recognize him, but a big deal was made about how Roxas kept juuust missing him). 358/2 was, it appears, carefully planned so that Roxas either gets sent only to places where Ven didn't go, or to places where Ven went but only at times when the people who could say something weren't there. Braig/Xigbar probably knew the entire time, but didn't say anything out of fear of waking Ven's memories up, since he knew that would be a Bad Thing.

** Let's review the people who met both Roxas and Ventus. Lea, who didn't meet Ven for long enough to remember him, but did develop enough of a connection to piggyback some rudimentary emotions off of Roxas from the semi-inert Ven heart shaping Roxas; Tinker Bell and Stitch, both of whom are incapable of speaking English, and so might have actually noticed something, but couldn't say so; Philoteces, who wasn't paying much attention when he met Ven, and would only really remember Terra the Hero and maybe Sexy Aqua (Herc would recognize him, but a big deal was made about how Roxas kept juuust missing him). 358/2 was, it appears, carefully planned so that Roxas either gets sent only to places where Ven didn't go, or to places where Ven went but only at times when the people who could say something weren't there. Braig/Xigbar probably knew the entire time, but didn't say anything out of fear of waking Ven's memories up, since he knew that would be a Bad Thing.

*** There's a pretty brilliant explanation for all this, if not, as usual, a little [[KudzuPlot convoluted.]] [[spoiler: Between Sora, Xion, Ventus, and Roxas, at any given time, there are only two Keyblades between them. (Ven's, and Riku's original Keyblade.) During the start of Days, Sora is still awake, so Roxas has one Keyblade, Sora has the other. The only time we see Xion use the Keyblade while Sora is awake is when Roxas drops his, and she picks it up, all in a cutscene. After this, we have the section where Xion 'forgets' how to use her Keyblade. But then, [[KingdomHeartsChainOfMemories some things happen]], Sora is asleep, and Xion uses Sora's Keyblade. Roxas is only able to duel-wield later because Xion, Ven, and Sora are asleep or, [[RetGone well...]]

* The panel system seems like the odd one out in this series, seeing as in every other game all the player has to do to become stronger is fight enemies and level up through the resulting experience, including Kingdom Hearts 2 which chronologically takes place after this and Roxas can still become stronger without it. However, it's actually the Organization that is behind this and thus when he's no longer under their thumb he's able to level up and grow stronger more naturally in Kingdom Hearts 2. By making sure that Roxas can only grow more powerful by unlocking and placing panels they ensure he only becomes stronger at the rate they want him to, and thus they make sure he never becomes so strong that he can just slaughter his way through the entire Organization if he decides to turn on them as he does at the end of the game. Therefore, Xemnas makes sure Roxas does his dirty work for him but is still far too weak to ever challenge him. The other members probably have to deal with the same sort of thing, thus Xemnas makes sure he remains the strongest member of the Organization by far and can beat down any potential insurrection.

* FridgeLogic: If Xehanort was trying to turn Organization members into vessels, why did Saix give Roxas the idea to keep a diary? That's the sort of self affirming and introspective thing that would help grow a heart, making him a poor host. Even if Saix didn't know this, wouldn't Xmas have put a stop to it?

* [[spoiler:When Xion starts to be forgotten]] Roxas goes kind've crazy... why? [[spoiler:Xion and Roxas are essentially Sora's two halves right? A lot of people point this toward Xion just being his feminine side, but when you realize that Xion's appearance is so similar to how he would remember Kairi.]] This means that Roxas isn't going crazy just because he's [[spoiler:losing Xion, but because Roxas, the Sora half of Sora, is losing his other half, Kairi. Essentially the scene is showing what would happen if Sora lost Kairi, showing just how much he cares about her.]]