Needs Help: Video Game.Super Smash Bros

I want to propose a split to this article. Right now, the main video game page details all five games with a description, as well as three trope subpages for all games, and one for Brawl's campaign mode. The moments subpages, YMMV subpage, WMG subpage, and others all cover all games. The individual games only have redirects to the main page and a characters sheet detailing fighters introduced in them. However, I believe all five SSB games should get their own pages. Why should we do this?

• Each game deserves a page: All five installments are distinct enough from each other, have varied visual styles, different content, gameplay features unique to each one and tons of fans.
• Many other pages series got splits eventually: For example, the Mario Kart series. All games in it are very similar. They're all about racing in karts, using items, and more. But eventually, each game got its own article. If MK got split, SSB should too.
• It's a good idea to do this before Ultimate releases: The more we hold this off, the worse this will get. Once Ultimate releases, it may just be too late to split, since it will likely give us even more stuff to move and rearrange. It may already be tough now, but it will only get worse unless we take decisive action.
• We may get rid of an unnecessary namespace: We're trying to get rid of unnecessary namespaces, and if we give each game their own page in the Video Game namespace and remove tropes that are in the Super Smash Bros namespace, we may be able to merge the general page into one page and cutlist all trope subpages, getting rid of the extra namespace. I'm not guaranteeing this will happen, but it might.

What plan for splitting do I have in mind?

• Each game would get its own page, like Super Smash Bros. 64, Super Smash Bros. Melee, Super Smash Bros. Brawl, Super Smash Bros. 4 and Super Smash Bros. Ultimate. Examples specific to one entry would be moved from the subpages to each individual page. Also, the The Subspace Emissary page would get deleted and moved to the Super Smash Bros. Brawl page, in a separate folder.
• The moments subpages would be moved to each own game's page. The YMMV and Trivia pages too. The others probably will stay general.
• Wicks would need to be changed if referring to a single game.
• We could start a Short-Term Projects thread for additional help.

What do you think? Do you have ideas of your own? Thank you.

Currently mostly inactive. An incremental game I tested: https://galaxy.click/play/176 (Gods of Incremental)

I can get behind that.

she/her | TRS needs your help! | Contributor of Trope Report

I'm 100% on board with that!

Maybe we could have a Franchise page for Tropes that apply to Smash Bros as a whole?

edited 18th Jun '18 9:39:57 AM by WarriorSparrow

I am all for this. Your reasoning is very sound.

edited 18th Jun '18 9:39:20 AM by AzureSpiritStone

smash bros. being exclusively a series of games means that it doesn't qualify for a franchise page; the main page would still be under the video game namespace

this sounds like a solid plan to me, especially since the character pages have been split accordingly

I am all for separate pages for each game, though.

Optimism is a duty.

Oh yeah, I'm in on this

Sounds good to me

"Leftover items still have value!"

As a sidenote, we should probably figure out the name for the eighth-generation games' page before we start splitting everything.

Technically Super Smash Bros. 4 is a fan name, but it's the most concise option, so I wouldn't be opposed to it.

I had a dog-themed avatar before it was cool.

According to How to Create a Work's Page, work names must use official titles and not fan names. So we'll have to use Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS and Wii U, also moving the character sheet and DLC character sheet there, and probably make Super Smash Bros. 4 a redirect.

Currently mostly inactive. An incremental game I tested: https://galaxy.click/play/176 (Gods of Incremental)

Don't forget to redirect the official Japanese names. It didn't matter with the original page settings, but with them separated...

I am very fine with this.

I *guess* this would probably be a place to throw my hat into this discussion.

I was working on a side project where we would give each stage its own description and space for examples, with a sandbox of that here. Given the overlap of stages between each title, and especially with the fact that roughly 70% of the franchise's stages have already been confirmed for Ultimate just from the Nintendo Direct alone, it might just be worth it to have a separate page.

Meanwhile, pages based on various iterations of the game would focus on the modes and features present in the games themselves, as opposed to the stages cluttering up multiple articles. (Quick suggestion for the naming of things: Franchise.Super Smash Bros for the series as a whole, and VideoGame.Super Smash Bros for the original game.)

edited 20th Jun '18 12:25:57 AM by KingClark

I don't believe SSB qualifies for Franchise/, so the old standby of disambiguating N64 games with "64" seems to be our best option.

Even within the official English translation itself, I believe stages from the N64 game have been notated as "[Stage Name] 64", so it's an unofficially official name, if you get what I'm saying.

I had a dog-themed avatar before it was cool.

Three things:

1. Super Smash Bros. can't be classified as a franchise at all. In order to get the Franchise namespace, it needs at least three work pages in three different namespaces. It may get five work pages, but they'll all be in the Video Game namespace, so it'll stay in Video Game.
2. I'm not sure what namespace the stages page would go to. Video Game would be wrong in this case, and a Stages namespace just for this would be completely gratuitous. We usually don't accept stuff that would cause a one-off, since stuff like Theme.Glee, Weapons.Destiny and Community.Dwarf Fortress was cut. I suppose if we really must add a stages page, we could keep the Super Smash Bros namespace, though I still oppose this proposal of stages getting their own page. It should work fine if stages are troped on work pages.
3. Can I start making sandboxes for the hypothetical single installment pages? The consensus for splitting seems stable, I just want to make a draft that everyone can improve before we make the pages in the Video Game namespace.

edited 20th Jun '18 4:05:15 AM by Piterpicher

Currently mostly inactive. An incremental game I tested: https://galaxy.click/play/176 (Gods of Incremental)

I just thought of something... Could the stages fit under the "Recap" namespace for each individual game?

The game doesn't really have a story or episodic gameplay. So not really.

Overall, the stages aren't really interesting to list in the first place. There's definitely tropes where they can be listed as an example, but they aren't worth their own personal entry.

Yeah, the stages don't deserve their own personal entries. Also, no one appears to be objecting, so I'll make the sandboxes for each individual game. Everyone would be welcome to edit them, of course.

edited 23rd Jun '18 12:08:57 AM by Piterpicher

Currently mostly inactive. An incremental game I tested: https://galaxy.click/play/176 (Gods of Incremental)

I agree with splitting the page.

I used to plug my deviantart here but turns out the link was too long.

Alright, some very unfinished sandboxes for individual pages are made. Please help with:

• Sandbox.Super Smash Bros 64
• Sandbox.Super Smash Bros Melee
• Sandbox.Super Smash Bros Brawl
• Sandbox.Super Smash Bros For Nintendo 3 DS Wii U
• Sandbox.Super Smash Bros Ultimate

I'd say that after some description tweaking, an image for each, a few more indexes and at least 10 more tropes for each, we may move them to the Video Game namespace.

All of them now have images. If anyone doesn't like them, we can settle it in Image Pickin.

All of them now have confirmed indexes.

All of them except for Ultimate now have fleshed out trope lists and expanded descriptions. We may start the migration soon!

edited 24th Jun '18 8:07:58 AM by Piterpicher

Currently mostly inactive. An incremental game I tested: https://galaxy.click/play/176 (Gods of Incremental)

Bumping to say I've made big progress on the individual sandbox pages. Now I'm moving the content to the Video Game namespace. Help is still appreciated.

edited 24th Jun '18 10:03:20 AM by Piterpicher

Currently mostly inactive. An incremental game I tested: https://galaxy.click/play/176 (Gods of Incremental)

Agreed in this too. Though should we include Subspace Emissary for Brawl or should it still be its own thing? I also noticed Character-related tropes in main entries.

I plan on moving the content from the The Subspace Emissary page to the Super Smash Bros. Brawl page in a separate folder, since I don't think the page for it is too big to not be on the main SSBB page. And as for those character tropes on the main page… well, I'll think about what to do with it later. The new pages are here:

• VideoGame.Super Smash Bros 64
• VideoGame.Super Smash Bros Melee
• VideoGame.Super Smash Bros Brawl
• VideoGame.Super Smash Bros For Nintendo 3 DS Wii U
• VideoGame.Super Smash Bros Ultimate

Currently mostly inactive. An incremental game I tested: https://galaxy.click/play/176 (Gods of Incremental)

You should probably cutlist the sandboxes.

Once I add all the pages to the relevant indexes, I'll do that.

Currently mostly inactive. An incremental game I tested: https://galaxy.click/play/176 (Gods of Incremental)