For a list of bad laconics, see Sandbox.Pages Needing Better Laconics.
For generally accepted guidelines for laconics, see Sandbox.Laconic Wiki Template.
Today I found out an interesting fact from troper Ironeye:
Don't ever make the mistake of using the Laconic version as the canonical trope meaning—the laconics are often written by people who don't actually understand the drop. In this case, the laconic only corresponds to one possible cause of Darkness-Induced Audience Apathy.
The Laconic Description for DIAA states as follows:
The thing is, these descriptions are supposed to make it easier to understand what the page is about. If they can't be accurate as well as short and sweet, then there's a problem.
So for starters, what would be a better description for DIAA?
Edited by MacronNotes on Jan 29th 2023 at 6:23:45 AM
Betty and Veronica just says, "Two girls in a Love Triangle with contrasting personalities." I'm not sure about the Love Triangle part because that page does say, "Even shows without such romantic entanglements in-universe can inspire Betty/Veronica debates amongst the Fandom; hence, Mary Ann/Ginger, Bailey/Jennifer, Janet/Chrissy, Velma/Daphne, etc." Besides that it's that they have very specific contrasting personalities. Also shouldn't there not be all those links in it?
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Took out the potholes (most of them were really sinkholes anyway) and took a stab at making the definition clearer. Better?
...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
That's much better. I like the first part, but for the second I would have gone with simply referring to them as being one down to earth and the other exciting.
The laconic for Wise Beyond Their Years simply says, "Precocious." One word is not a synopsis or statement. Does anyone have an idea of what it should be changed to?
As much as I don't like duplicating the first line of a description with the laconic, the first line of the description seems to be spot-on.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
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Changed it to
"A child who is far more mature (emotionally, intellectually, and/or philosophically) than is typical for their age."
Better? Good enough?
...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
That's better, but couldn't we discuss it before changing the laconic?
Magical Negro need a better laconic.
The current laconic is "Closer to Earth ethereal Black character existing only to help the White hero", while the description doesn't require either black or white. Not sure if a Hero is a needed part of the trope.
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^^ The previous Laconic was useless. I changed it to something clearer, that's a simple rephrasing of the thesis statement on the main page. There's nothing saying that it has to stay in the form I put it in, but I'd like to hear your reason that we should leave a horrible one in place while we discuss exactly how to word the change.
edited 9th Oct '13 7:20:23 AM by Madrugada
...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
From the description:
If it's a black character who's magically/mystically helping heroes who are also minority characters, it's not Magical Negro. A Magical Negro is always a black Token Minoritynote put in there to help the heroes with his supernatural wisdom and mystical ways (actual magic optional).
edited 9th Oct '13 12:26:28 PM by Nocturna
Well, one have to be changed. The description continues to use the word minority and use that in a general way. So I think it's the laconic that needs to be fixed.
edited 9th Oct '13 1:01:23 PM by m8e
The problem is that Magical Negro is a term used in literary criticism, where it refers exclusively to black characters. I really don't think we should be expanding it beyond its meaning elsewhere.
EDIT: Especially given that inbound count. Holy moly. Giving out misinformation on what pre-existing literary terms mean is not going to make this site look good.
edited 9th Oct '13 11:02:40 PM by Nocturna
We don't need to expand Magical Negro. Tropes similar to it but involve other minorities are under Closer to Earth.
I'm all for getting rid of a horrible laconic. I just think it would be nice to always do it in one move without any tweaking. As long as it gets changed to a statement that reflects the page the exact wording doesn't matter.
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Well, ideally we'd only have to fix it once, but leaving a crap laconic because we haven't settled on the exact wording of the new one strikes me as letting the perfect be the enemy of the good. Get the garbage out even if we don't have something great to replace it with.
That said, I think that Nocturna nailed it here:
Then the examples need a thorough purging —the list is full of non-black (in some cases non-minority-of-any-type), non-Token, non-secondary or minor characters.
edited 10th Oct '13 8:50:24 AM by Madrugada
...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
Laconic.Hormone Addled Teenager: Is this a good laconic?
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
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Not really.The way "perverts" is used is confusing. "Thinks about sex" a lot is not the same as "perverted" That's a usage I'd like to see killed dead on this site.
...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
"All teenagers are obsessed with sex." would seem to work.
Four days late, but ^ seems too narrow to me given the trope description. Don't know of anything better, though.
Also, on Laconic.Exactly What It Says On The Tin, thoughts on using "The premise or plot of a story is right there in the title"? Personally, I feel that "The title of a work tells you exactly what the work is about, with no further explanation needed." sounds a bit ambiguous - "what the work is about can cover a lot of stuff".
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
I'd say Hormone-Addled Teenager is more properly a job for the Trope Repair Shop.
Most of the examples are "Sex!", some are "shop and have fun", a few with twue love obsession...
It's almost a Self-Demonstrating Article when viewed from a certain angle.
The Final ECW Champion
The Laconic for Living MacGuffin is "Everybody wants them"
I propose adding four words "They do nothing but everybody wants them." That actually tells them what the trope is about.
Modified Ura-nage, Torture Rack
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On Exactly What It Says on the Tin, how about adding "everything meaningful " to your suggestion: "Everything meaningful about the plot or the premise of a work is right there in the title."
...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
I am preoccupied that "meaningful" is a bit ambiguous there.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Trollblade69
Bringing this in from "Locked Page Edit Requests":
Maybe we could shorten People Sit On Chairs to "Not everything is a trope" or some variant of that.
Yes, I am the guy who refused to call Magikarp Power "not worth the effort"
Cut the second half, it really didn't have anything to do with the trope.
...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.