Note: If a newly launched trope was already given a No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only designation while it was being drafted on the Trope Launch Pad, additions to the proper index do not need to go through this thread. Instead, simply ask the mods to add the trope via this thread
.
This is the thread to report tropes with problematic Real Life sections.
Common problems include:
- Conversation on the Main Page
- Flame Bait
- Squicky content
- Impossible in Real Life
Real Life sections on the wiki are kept as long as they don't become a problem. If you find an article with such problems, report it here. Please note that the purpose of this thread is to clean up and maintain real life sections, not raze them. Cutting should be treated as a last resort, so please only suggest cutting RL sections or a subset thereof you think the examples in question are completely unsalvageable.
If historical RL examples are not causing any problems, consider whether it would be better to propose a No Recent Examples, Please! (via this forum thread) for RL instead of NRLEP. If RL examples are causing problems only for certain subjects, consider whether a Limited Real Life Examples Only restriction would be preferable to NRLEP.
If you think a trope should be No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only, then this thread is the place to discuss it. However, please check Keep Real Life Examples first to see if it has already been brought up in the past. If not, state the reasons and add it to the crowner.
Before adding to the crowner:
- The trope should be proposed in the thread, along with reasons for why a crowner is necessary instead of a cleanup.
- There must be support from others in thread.
- Any objections should be addressed.
- Allow a minimum of 24 hours for discussion.
When adding to the crowner:
- Be sure to add the trope name, a link to where the discussion started, the reasons for crownering, whether the restriction being proposed is NRLEP or LRLEO (and in the latter case, which subject(s) the restriction would be for), and the date added.
- Announce in thread that you are adding the item.
- An ATT advert should be made as well (batch items together if more than one trope goes up in a day).
In order for a crowner to pass:
- Must have been up for a minimum of a week
- There must be a 2:1 ratio
- If the vote is exactly 2:1 or +/- 1 vote from that, give it a couple extra days to see if any more votes come in
- Once passed, tropes must be indexed on the appropriate NRLEP index
- Should the vote fail, the trope should be indexed on KRLE page
Sex Tropes, Rape and Sexual Harassment Tropes, and Morality Tropes are banned from having RL sections so tropes under those indexes don't need crowner vote.
Crowner entries that have already been called will have "(CLOSED)" appended to them — and are no longer open for discussion.
After bringing up a trope for discussion, please wait at least a day for feedback before adding it to the crowner.
NRLEP tag:
%%https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13350380440A15238800
LRLEO tag:
%%The following restrictions apply: [list restriction(s) here]
%%https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13350380440A15238800
Notes:
- This thread is not for general discussion regarding policies for Real Life sections or crowners. Please take those conversations to this Wiki Talk thread.
- Do not try to overturn previous No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only decisions without a convincing argument.
- As mentioned here, the consensus is that NRLEP warnings in trope page descriptions can use bold text so that they stand out.
- The [[noreallife]] tag doesn't currently work. This is a deprecated tag that was introduced many years ago — originally, it would have displayed a NRLEP warning banner when you edited the page. However, there's been some staff conversation (Feb 2024) about what a new technical solution might look like, so we'd advise against deleting these from pages, at least until we have a decision as to whether it'll be fixed or replaced.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 8th 2024 at 10:49:13 AM
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
For White Sheep, while I could see issues, there are some examples (at least Frank Dalton) I think work.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
How? IIRC, it's a fundamental policy of "burn or save" where such sections are concerned.
edited 21st Apr '17 10:14:26 AM by Theatre_Maven_3695
No, the other one.
Criminals sometimes work for tropes similar to morality, depending on how the trope is defined. The problem with White Sheep is that it outright calls the family evil, repeatedly. As it's written, real life examples should not be allowed. I could potentially see someone straight-laced in a family of criminals follow the spirit of the trope, but I'd want it rewritten to allow those.
Also, family legacy is important, so just one other sibling to contrast with is shoehorning any way you cut it.
Related, I removed one, out of two, examples from Black Sheep. Well, it wasn't so much an example as a couple of lines of natter. The remaining example is an invoked one.
edited 21st Apr '17 1:53:57 PM by AnotherDuck
Check out my fanfiction!
"In distress", my ass.
I don't think there's any chance that The Last DJ is going to reverse unless we get a bunch of new participants that all vote to keep, so calling to make it NRLEP. Added 19th Apr '17 at 12:20:59 PM, 12:1 (13).
White Sheep, however, could stand to stabilize before the final call, so since it's the start of the weekend going to hold off on the final judgement till Monday morning.
—
Currently pending:
- White Sheep: Added 19th Apr '17 at 3:12:57 PM, 3:1 (16)
edited 21st Apr '17 12:54:44 PM by Nohbody
All your safe space are belong to Trump
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
You forgot to strike it. Don't worry, I already did.
And That's Terrible is about the author pointing out the evils in a character's actions, which will most likely constitute as NRLEP bait for being a narrative trope. A few years ago, a Wiki Vandal forced it onto the NRLEP, falsely claiming that it attracted "natter and batter and chatter and clatter and fatter and flatter and hatter and latter and matter and patter and platter and scatter and slatter and smatter and splatter and shatter and tatter and vatter magnet" as well as flamewarring.
However, the examples there should most likely be distributed to other folders.
edited 22nd Apr '17 11:17:55 AM by MitchellProductions
All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy, but all play and no work makes Jack a mere boy
No, the other one.
Cleaned up And That's Terrible. The usual generics, ZCEs, and a little natter.
![[down]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_down.png "[down]"){kind=icon}
Just bits in the wording. Nothing major.
edited 23rd Apr '17 12:38:00 AM by AnotherDuck
Check out my fanfiction!
What was the natter?
edited 22nd Apr '17 6:50:43 PM by MitchellProductions
All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy, but all play and no work makes Jack a mere boy
Sorcerer in training
@ Madrugada: Thankyouthankyouthankyouthankyou. I'll put Artistic License – Paleontology on my to do list in case the vote comes out in favor of keep. But right now, I say nuke them.
@Waterblap: You are mostly correct. Natter/Conversation on the Main Page are also big problems.
I want to note: Out of all the Artistic License Real Life sections I have examined so far, only one did not have problems. That's a very sad ratio.
edited 22nd Apr '17 9:19:38 PM by Candi
Coming back to where you started is not the same as never leaving. -Terry Pratchett
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
AD: The Frank Dalton thing for White Sheep seems appropriate.
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
I'm not even sure how artistic license would WORK as real life examples.
Zzzzzzzzzz
Well as real-life examples for AL:
Here's an example of Artistic License in Real Life that doesn't fall into a media category — while it's about a musical group, it's not about their music.
David Lee Roth on the Brown M&Ms rider in the Van Halen contract:
I came backstage. I found some brown M&M’s, I went into full Shakespearean “What is this before me?” … you know, with the skull in one hand … and promptly trashed the dressing room. Dumped the buffet, kicked a hole in the door, twelve thousand dollars’ worth of fun.
The staging sank through their floor. They didn’t bother to look at the weight requirements or anything, and this sank through their new flooring and did eighty thousand dollars’ worth of damage to the arena floor. The whole thing had to be replaced. It came out in the press that I discovered brown M&M’s and did eighty-five thousand dollars’ worth of damage to the backstage area.
... Well, who am I to get in the way of a good rumor?
That last line? Artistic License on Roth's part.
...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
Oversized Garden Ornament
We'll, at least it's an example that's not complaining or "ner ner, those silly people got it wrong", but a somewhat entertaining anecdote. But I think it's quite a bit of a stretch to use it as an example of artistic licence.
Zzzzzzzzzz
It's Artistic License: deviating from the facts to make a better story or to make the story work better. People do it in Real Life all the time when they're talking about something they did, or that happened to them.
The way they tell it, they are drunker than they really were, the other person is more attractive, or ruder, or whatever than they really were, they didn't actually think of the witty rejoinder they claimed they used in time to say it... But it makes the story better, so the details get fudged.
edited 23rd Apr '17 11:51:46 AM by Madrugada
...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
Oversized Garden Ornament
OK, I expressed myself badly. Of course it's a kind of AL; what I meant was that it's only with a bit of a stretch that it merits an example, because it's so trivial - people embellish their stories all the time. I'm not saying it's PSOC, but it's so common that we can't make an example of time somebody is doing it, and it felt a bit odd to single out this particular tall tale (I'm sure any seafarer could provide much more drastic examples).
I'm not arguing for deleting this example in particular. I guess what I mean is that if this is the best example we can find from the RL section, it's not much.
edited 23rd Apr '17 1:26:40 PM by GnomeTitan
Zzzzzzzzzz
No, I wasn't clear. That isn't from any actual RL section of an AL page. It's an example of the kind of thing that is "Artistic License in Real Life"; it's the kind of AL that would legitimately go in a Real Life folder, and thus, it's part of why I say there shouldn't be Real Life folders on the AL pages.
It's was in response to ACW's "Im not even sure how AL would work in Real Life." It's not that it doesn't happen in Real Life. It's that it's "Trivial in Real Life."
edited 23rd Apr '17 4:33:07 PM by Madrugada
...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
Sorcerer in training
In the end, though, that might not wind up in a Real Life folder. It would be sourced from a magazine or newspaper or website, and could legitimately wind up in one of those folders.
Coming back to where you started is not the same as never leaving. -Terry Pratchett
The Computer Is Your Friend is an AI-related trope. By current standards, this would be impossible in real life as with A.I. Is a Crapshoot.
All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy, but all play and no work makes Jack a mere boy
No, the other one.
No examples, no problems. Or has it been cleaned?
Check out my fanfiction!
Oversized Garden Ornament
Madrugada: OK, I misunderstood the point of your post. It seems we're in agreement.
Regarding the AL pages, I think the most important reasons to make them NRLEP is that the RL sections are complaint magnets and also that they encourage lengthy explanations of how things really work, which would be more suitable as Useful Notes in the cases where they are at all relevant for this wiki.
edited 24th Apr '17 5:11:19 AM by GnomeTitan
The section for that trope was already cleaned three years ago for being a shoehorn. This was also done with Performance Artist for being a ZCE.
The Social Darwinist is a villain trope, and its real life section is loaded with ROCEJ violations.
All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy, but all play and no work makes Jack a mere boy
"In distress", my ass.
Calling White Sheep to make it NRLEP. Added 19th Apr '17 at 3:12:57 PM, 3:1 (20).
As for The Social Darwinist, I cleaned out a lot of the crap in the RL folder, but I wouldn't shed any tears over it becoming NRLEP
—
Nothing pending as of this post.
All your safe space are belong to Trump
Sorcerer in training
I think, under the principle we run each page through on its own merits, regardless of what it is related to, that Artistic License Law and Artistic License Paleontology should be run through at this point, since those two were the most problematic of the ones I reviewed.
Coming back to where you started is not the same as never leaving. -Terry Pratchett
Witch Hunt may have been run through the crowner once but rejected, but it still contains ROCEJ issues for being political subject matter, etc..
All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy, but all play and no work makes Jack a mere boy
Crown Description:
Vote up to either forbid all real life examples (No Real Life Examples Please) or forbid real life examples for specific subjects (Limited Real Life Examples Only); vote down to Keep Real Life Examples. To add a trope to a No Real Life Examples Please index or the Limited Real Life Examples Only index, its crowner option must meet the following criteria:- Stable 2:1 ratio needed for NRLEP or LRLEO
- Must have been up for a minimum of a week
- If the vote is exactly 2:1 or +/- 1 vote from that, give it a couple of extra days to see if more votes come in.
FWIW, I've no problem with making all the Artistic License pages NRLEP.
I'm undecided at the moment about another go for Not So Different, but leaning towards "yes put it in the crowner", given AnotherDuck's post about having a second go-round indicating an actual problem and not just a potential one.
—
Pending:
- The Last DJ: Added 19th Apr '17 at 12:20:59 PM, 9:1 (10)
- White Sheep: Added 19th Apr '17 at 3:12:57 PM, 4.5:1 (11)
All your safe space are belong to Trump