Content Policy Change:

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[up][up] An accident relating to the Hentai category removal, most likely. The subpages are still intact and none of the wicks were removed.

I'm okay with the removal of porn for the sake of porn. Porn in general does lie on a blurry, even questionable line or beyond, so it's not a loss for me.

edited 14th Apr '12 10:25:37 AM by EarlOfSandvich

I now go by Graf von Tirol.
52 SilentReverence14th Apr 2012 10:25:22 AM from 3 tiles right 1 tile up
adopting kitteh
So wait, if someone for some reason added Star Wars to the hentai index it would have been cut as well? That robotic is the system?

Besides, that FR was cut without announcement or discussion when it is about much more than porn / explicit (as has been one of the kinda-guidelines to evaluate whether things are cut or not) and when a committee is still not formed, makes me simply distrust that we'll have it back in any reasonable future time or condition.

edited 14th Apr '12 10:26:45 AM by SilentReverence

53 SeptimusHeap14th Apr 2012 10:26:50 AM from Laniakea , Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
As lu said, we'll bring some works back once the TV Tropes Porn Watch Comittee have passed their verdict.

Re[up]: Not sure.
I just want to say that I agree with robster's post here. I know robster's post is a collection of several points, and each one could be discussed in its own topic. But the first one's relevant to this thread, so I'll focus on that.

What is TV Tropes, as a site? And "What age group is the site aimed at?"

If we're genuinely aiming to make Tropes a clean site, I think that's a good thing. But, in terms of an informative site, I know it's possible to be a quality site without being clean. There are sites that include controversial topics for the sake of information, even if it's not the pleasant kind.

So, the fact that we have this policy means that this has to be part of the identity of TV Tropes. It's like Safebooru. That site distinguishes itself from some other imageboards by making SFW as part of its identity, along with hosting animation IM Gs.
Now using Trivialis handle.
55 SeptimusHeap14th Apr 2012 10:35:39 AM from Laniakea , Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
[up]13+ is the age group we cater to. The Goals of TV Tropes about your other question.

edited 14th Apr '12 10:36:22 AM by SeptimusHeap

Is this still only sex under [some age decided by FE], or all porn?

And which trope and YKTTW* categories are being cut? I won't cry over porn-only tropes, but rape tropes and incest tropes and torture tropes, hideous and awful and disturbing though they are, still are worth carefully documenting in my opinion (so long as Real Life examples are cut).

edited 14th Apr '12 10:41:27 AM by ArcadesSabboth

Oppression anywhere is a threat to democracy everywhere.
57 Psyga31514th Apr 2012 10:38:35 AM from Dungeons & Dragons No Sekai , Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Start your Engine!
This is gonna be an inevitable question, but what about games or other works that have undergone Bleached Underpants?

edited 14th Apr '12 10:40:44 AM by Psyga315

Serena: And Ash ran! Your brother saw him go. After we got to Pallet Town, he just... ran!
58 TwoGunAngel14th Apr 2012 10:39:54 AM , Relationship Status: Singularity
The Demon Slayer
Considering that Fate/stay night is probably the primest example of the Bleached Underpants thing, I would very much like to know the answer to that question.
59 SeptimusHeap14th Apr 2012 10:39:58 AM from Laniakea , Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
[up][up][up]Let's not talk about "16", "14" or any of these. They are just Flame Bait.

All the other questions will likely be answered once the TV Tropes Porn Watch Comittee convenes.

edited 14th Apr '12 10:40:41 AM by SeptimusHeap

60 MarqFJA14th Apr 2012 10:41:05 AM from Saudi Arabia , Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
O' Allah, save Egypt
I'd like to note one utmostly major problem with this unilateral mass-cut: The massive amount of redlinks generated as a result throughout the site, which can easily act as a green-light to anyone who has the slightest reason to axe the redlinked tropes/works from any example list they find them at, particularly the overzealously prudish part of our editor base. Nice Job Breaking It, Hero couldn't have put it better.
Ash-shaʻb yurīd isqāṭ ḥukm al-ʻaskar
61 SeptimusHeap14th Apr 2012 10:43:32 AM from Laniakea , Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
[up]I think that deleting an example of a work just because it's a redlink is a form of vandalism - we have a lot of examples for works that don't have any page.

About tropes: Crosswicking is the only thing I could think of.
62 TwoGunAngel14th Apr 2012 10:44:53 AM , Relationship Status: Singularity
The Demon Slayer
And this brings me to a question that has been on my mind since this thing began. If a work is cut, and it is decided that it's not coming back, do we just sever the wicks on the examples on other pages (like I've been doing with a certain disturbing game), or do we cut the examples entirely?

edited 14th Apr '12 10:47:27 AM by TwoGunAngel

63 SeptimusHeap14th Apr 2012 10:46:37 AM from Laniakea , Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
[up]I don't know, but I wouldn't be above reporting people that delete the examples to Ask The Tropers for vandalism.
[up][up]Interesting question. I'd assume if a work is deemed too porny, that any sexual examples from it should be cut. But if it has furnished non-sexual examples as well, I'd think just un-Wiki Word the redlinks.

edited 14th Apr '12 10:47:30 AM by ArcadesSabboth

Oppression anywhere is a threat to democracy everywhere.
65 MarqFJA14th Apr 2012 10:50:14 AM from Saudi Arabia , Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
O' Allah, save Egypt
[up][up][up][up] I think so too, but there is no feasible way of tracking them all down; cutting an article renders its wick list ultimately unreliable, according to a mod on a TRS for some cut page (I think it's Baby Got Back?) several weeks ago.

Crosswicking... If only it were that easy. One major problem I've seen is that many tropes, even ones that surely aren't within the new policy's scope, have a disproportionately large wick count in comparison to their actual example list.

[up] What if the sexual examples were on trope articles where the sexual aspect is relevant, like the Sex Tropes, or Fanservice tropes, or Rule of Sexy tropes?

edited 14th Apr '12 10:52:43 AM by MarqFJA

Ash-shaʻb yurīd isqāṭ ḥukm al-ʻaskar
66 SeptimusHeap14th Apr 2012 10:51:41 AM from Laniakea , Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
[up]Yeps, and the wick tracker tool that FE gave us for Innocent Panties is such a resource hog that we should never use it without admin say-so.

Crosswicking in the sense of "copying examples on the trope page to the work page"

edited 14th Apr '12 10:52:41 AM by SeptimusHeap

67 desdendelle14th Apr 2012 10:51:43 AM from a Mantis , Relationship Status: It was just a setback
Sleek and stylish
[up][up] You can use the wick finder for deleted articles (it's in Itty Bitty Wiki Tools IIRC) to find wicks for cut articles.

edited 14th Apr '12 10:52:13 AM by desdendelle

Madame Vastra: The game is afoot. We're going to need a lot of tea.
Well, for Fate/stay night most of its links are still blue because no one ever got around to pointing them at the correct namespace. Yay for lazy editors!
Pronounced YAK-you-luss
Wasn't it suggested that porn example folders on pages (and their contents) should be deleted?
What's precedent ever done for us?
70 MarqFJA14th Apr 2012 10:53:27 AM from Saudi Arabia , Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
O' Allah, save Egypt
Ninja-posted, damn. I've ninj'ad my previous post for important addendums.

[up][up][up] That tool only works with admin approval, as Septimus noted.

edited 14th Apr '12 10:54:52 AM by MarqFJA

Ash-shaʻb yurīd isqāṭ ḥukm al-ʻaskar
@Septimus Heap:

I don't think that this clean policy will accurately fit in with the current goals as they stand right now. IMO, TV Tropes cannot present itself as "the comprehensive site for trope info" the way it currently stands. It has to incorporate, in a way, "We are a safe site" into its theme, much like my Safebooru example does.

I understand the site going clean, but it should not be arbitrary change-making. As robster said, it has to be enforcement of core guidelines. That means we need this policy to be a guideline that represents the site as much as "no notability" is.

See, we know that this site's been making some big changes so that its idea is different from what it used to be. The site needs to accept that and assert it. I dare say, many of the complainers will be at least satisfied with the clarity/fairness if they know what kind of site they're coming to.

edited 14th Apr '12 11:08:49 AM by abstractematics

Now using Trivialis handle.
72 SeptimusHeap14th Apr 2012 10:56:07 AM from Laniakea , Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
Marq FJA: Actually the tool works without admin approval, but you shouldn't link it anywhere.

[up]It just means we are making an exception for porn as explained in the OP here. The sex tropes can stay - the problem is the explicit stuff, not just "fanservice".

edited 14th Apr '12 11:51:21 AM by SeptimusHeap

They should have at least told us before saying that adult orentated works aren't allowed. I mistakenly believed that most tropers were adults.
74 SeptimusHeap14th Apr 2012 12:43:35 PM from Laniakea , Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
[up]It about "porn", not "adult". Super-gory stuff is still OK.
I don't really care about gory stuff, but I mean stuff like Lolita, Black Bird, Game of Thrones and other entertainment that adults can enjoy. Only one of the three wasn't cut during the purge.

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