Examples do not match article: Girls Love

Yeah Girls' Love requires Romance, anything else is just Girl On Girl porn.

I am really surprised we don't have a Flower Motif trope They are very very prominent in Girls' Love series framed by flowers or flower backgrounds during Squee moments, cuddling or even sex (most often if its even shown its very softcore.) Maria Holic plays with it to death [1]◊ [2]◊ [3]◊ [4]◊ [5]◊ [6]◊[7]◊ its literally everywhere when Kanako goes into squee mode when talking about a girl.

edited 24th Jun '11 1:52:50 AM by Raso

It's lumped with Love Bubbles as a redirect Love Flowers.

WTF that's a different thing... This◊ vs Love Bubbles... bah.

Plural... ffs time to add a redirect.

edited 24th Jun '11 4:28:39 AM by Raso

We do have Flower Motifs.

Other than the previously mentioned Franco-Belgian Comics, I might also add Britpop, Europop, Bollywood, Spaghetti Western, Caribbean Literature, Euro Game, British Conspiracy Thriller, Brit Com, etc. ...And these are just the genres. Don't even get me started on the more specific tropes.

It's not that Japan is some mysterious special country, but that many tropes, genres, and even media are divided by their cultural origins, regardless of where this origin is coming from.

It's not about language either, note that many of the above are used for differentiating British works.

It's not even really about the country where it was made. While for simplicity's sake, some of the pages are worded that way, it's not physically impossible to write one of these outside their native country, just unlikely. For example, Slumdog Millionaire is a good example of a Bollywood-style movie, that wasn't made in India.

After all, tropes are all about expectations in the audience's mind, and different cultures have different expectations. They all have different ways of seeing the world, different histories, different values, different fashion, different sense of humor. Yes, some Older Than Dirt tropes appeared in every human mind since the dawn of time, but some others only appeared based on specific things, like in this case, the different cultural beliefs about homosexuality.

Even professional art analysis separates movements like English Renaissance, or German Romanticism.

That whole Jungian-Campbellian interpretation about how the collective unconscious is the source of all tropes, is very interesting as a theory, but if it means denying tropes, genres, and mediums that the audiences, the writers, the industrymen, and the analysts all agree that they exist, that theory starts becoming iconvinient for the purposes of classifying storytelling.

edited 24th Jun '11 5:43:00 AM by EternalSeptember

Except you haven't defined anything for this trope that rules out the other examples on the page. You haven't defined what makes this a distinct style. What makes this more than just Lesbian Romance? The examples on the page aren't porn. They have a romance focus.

Sorry Raso but you're wrong here. There are lots of yuri PWP doujinshi that don't have any relationships whatsoever. Pictures can also be labelled as yuri (see image search from gelbooru or danbooru) even if there are no relationships depicted.

Huh? That makes no sense. Also you can't use tagging on Danbooru as a reason to do something, lots of tagging decisions there are arbitrary and only exist for our convenience.

(Using fan fic terms here)

Except for Girls' Love is more along the lines of Shoujo-ai and Yuri can be broader covering pretty much everything but in fanfics it usually means smut with occasional WAFF.

edited 24th Jun '11 8:14:47 AM by Raso

Actually, the adult PWP version of Yuri Hime has recently been renamed to Girls' Love.

Alright, how about the Visual Novels from Shinging Star Lily's which are definitely more about the porn than the romance?

This is stories about the relationship, not just the sex, right? Made distinct from lesbian porn by that distinction.

No, it can be either. Same thing with Boys' Love and Bara.

edited 24th Jun '11 8:25:23 AM by CBanana

Right, the lines get blurred in fandom parlance (4chan's lesbian porn bord is /u/ - Yuri, though it has less porn than any of the other "porn" boards), but what the page is describing is the genre, known most commonly as "Girls' Love" or "Yuri", which is mostly about relationships, usually between fairly young characters (teenagers to mid-twenties), usually their first realization of their sexuality. While sex can and does occur, its not generally the point. Probably the most "hardcore" thing I'd say would still fall into this genre are the Sono Hanabira Ni Kuchizuke Wo Visual Novels.

Sex does not equal "porn"

edited 24th Jun '11 8:27:37 AM by SakurazakiSetsuna

Is there anything about this that separates it from Lesbian Porn?

Whats the difference between a romance movie with a few sex scenes, and Porn?

Edit: To clarify, there is some overlap between Girls' Love and Lesbian Porn, but there are plenty of examples of both that don't fit the others definition

edited 24th Jun '11 8:29:43 AM by SakurazakiSetsuna

Romance is the major thing I suppose its all about relationships even if nothing happens from it, we could rename it Shoujo-ai (which actually means Literally "Girl - Love") to distance itself from the more wider used term "Yuri".

edited 24th Jun '11 8:32:00 AM by Raso

Lets not.

Look, if you want an article about an Anime/Manga, genre and nothing else, on this English speaking wiki, give the English speakers a hint in the name.

Something like Girls Love Anime or Lesbian Anime. Not some Japanese word that will be misused and gunk up perfectly good sentences elsewhere.

Girls' Love sounds like a trope, not a genre. That's where the confusion is coming from.

edited 24th Jun '11 8:36:41 AM by FastEddie

No kidding, thats what we're working on figuring out here, ok?

The point failed there.... but Girls' Love is more romances than anything even Yuri Fan Girl s see subtext and romance vs Yaoi Fan Girls who go for just the smut.

C Banana is trying to argue that Girls' Love is broader and includes smut.

And Fan fiction divides Shoujo-ai and Yuri as Romance with no action and smut respectively so terms are imported wrongly.

edited 24th Jun '11 8:47:04 AM by Raso

Girls' Love is a pre existing term, though. Along with the already redirects Shoujo-ai and Yuri.

That being said, I don't think it is really a genre other then 'Lesbian love, in Japan". These terms are used indiscriminately to any lesbian romance in anime, without any criteria. Some would differentiate a 'Yuri=porn' and 'Girls' Love=romance' but, ultimately, the terms are used regardless of the content, as long as there is 'lesbians' and 'anime' in there.

There is a particular genre (or, at last, a bunch of common tropes) inside anime lesbian fiction, however. Driven mostly by subtext, suavity and, why not, immaturity. Since Maria Sama Ga Miteru it have been quite common and referred. Not all the called Yuri/Girls' Love/Shoujo-ai are this, however.

edited 24th Jun '11 8:56:49 AM by Heatth

About the title: Technically, it's more like Anime, Manga and Visual Novels, so even if we keep the subtrope/genre split from the generic Queer Romance, it should be something like Girls Love Genre, rather than Girls Love Anime. Just as Harem Genre, or Mecha Show. Those also pretty openly note their relation to Japan.

Girls' Love should be used as a redirect of that, not as the name for the more generic "Lesbian Romance". It is already a pre-existing name for a genre, so even if you were misled by it, others, who are already familiar with the phrase would expect it to be about the japanese genre.

Well, for one thing, the fact that the protagonists are schoolgirls, the way it's borderline Two-Girl "Romantic" Friendship, these, are pretty important elements. Something like Xena Warrior Princess doesn't work like that.

edited 24th Jun '11 9:02:25 AM by EternalSeptember

Oh I am liking Girls Love Genre.

If it is Girls Love Genre, it is not just Japanese source material. Romantic lesbian stories are in every medium.

edited 24th Jun '11 9:20:36 AM by FastEddie

Twenty Year Old Girl X Thirty Year Old Maiden and Ebisu-san and Hotei-san aren't yuri (as they contain no schoolgirls)? They were both published in prominent yuri magazines.

edited 24th Jun '11 9:24:47 AM by CBanana