When They Cry - Higurashi and Umineko

Mion was 16 (would be the equivilant to a US Junior due to being born in February given Japan starts school in April) in 1983, meaning she must have transfered to a different school in 1984, then already at college in 1985.

Keiichi and Rena were 15 (US Sophmore which translates to Japanese 1st year high school student) in 1983.

Yeah, Hinimizawa schooling was weird. Chie had to be proficient at multiple levels of education from elementary to high school.

Edited by magnum12 on Feb 12th 2021 at 12:54:48 PM

I think you've got the age's off because it specifically mention in dialogue that Mion transferred when she started highschool which means she was 14 in the main series

High School in Japan starts at 15. So Chie was teaching primary/elementerary and middle school classes.

There was a Retcon done very recently then (caused by Gou??) because the PS 2 version of the novel placed Mion’s DOB at 1966 (which would have made her 16 at 1983) and therfore Keiichi and Rena (7/7) at 1967.

A Retcon that pushed the age of most of the cast (except Satako and Rika) back 2 years.

I hate retcons so much. Most of them are terrible ass pulls anyway (One More Day is the typical retcon in terms of quality).

Edited by magnum12 on Feb 14th 2021 at 6:26:04 AM

Wasn’t Mion held back a year or am I confusing with another series?

Oh fuck… The Majestic Witch of Theatregoing, Drama and Spectating finally makes her move.

Also, I’m preeetty sure having a prison under the school to lock up students is illegal.

Edited by Lyendith on Feb 18th 2021 at 7:39:33 PM

Episode 20 implied Keiichi and Mion are infact a couple (the “center of Keiichi’s attention line).

That was an entire horn too.

Guess the theories of Hanyuu and Featherine being the same person were false after all.

Where Featherine is, Bernkastel is not far behind.

Looks like the truth seems to be Being Tortured Makes You Evil plus being corrupted by an exceptionally cruel witch.

Edited by magnum12 on Feb 18th 2021 at 4:36:00 AM

I didn't see Mion and Keiichi being a couple, to me that felt like Rika just falling back into her normal teasing. To me it seemed purposefully left ambiguous if Keiichi was dating Rena, Mion or neither.

Also I don't think them being the same person is deconfirmed? On one of Hanyuu's previous appearances the cracks on her horn seemed to be lit up and possible mending.

Was really interesting to see everyone revert back to how they used to act. And I really like that Mion, Rena and Keiichi go to the same college.

Satoko hurting someone with a trap was a bit painful to watch, felt a lot like Umineko spoilers Maria repeating Uu-Uu because it used to make Rosa smile. Except here she learns it doesn't work anymore.

Although not the biggest fan of how that kind of muddles the comedy/reality barrier.

Regardless, I'm surprised none of the students have tried burning down St Lucia's yet. UmiNo wonder Eva choose to send Ange there in 1998.

My biggest question is how the hell did Satoko manage to hang those buckets all the way up there? That ceiling is like 15m high!

Truly the work of a witch.

There's got to be someway to access them to clean them and change the light bulbs. I'm a little surprised that it was readily accessible and not kept in a locked storage cupboard but its the most likely explanation.

Guys, I just had a disturbing thought that explains...quite a lot actually along with why Chekhov's Gun has gone missing in episode 14.

What if the relationship between Hanyuu and Featherine is the other way around?

Basically, the true relationship between the two is the like Rika and Bernkastel (according to Word of God), Featherine being Hanyuu’s Enemy Without. Featherine being born from the darkness in Hanyuu’s heatt when Hanyuu became the all loving motherly goddess we know.

I kinda get why Satoko drew Auau’s attention… From the moment Satoko enters St. Lucia she only has two options − either trying to fit in with the "good girls" to stay with Rika, which she’s neither capable nor willing to do, or drop out and live a life without Rika, something that’s inconceivable to her as she considers Rika her other half.

A mix of lack of communication, stubborn pride and crippling emotional dependence create the kind of inescapable situation that are the tastiest dish for Witches.

In that regard, Rika just giving up on leaving Hinamizawa truly is the best ending possible… from Satoko’s standpoint.

I knew a Deadly Prank would be involved. The OP hinted at a death by trap.

I haven't read Ciconia yet, but it's nice to see WTC fans going absolutely nuts over the references.

Maybe more so than last week with the Umineko ones.

Edited by 32ndfreeze on Feb 25th 2021 at 11:19:19 PM

Hm? I’ve noticed the reference to "Vier", but were there others?

That’s just Featherine doing fourth wall trolling by refering to R7 recycling his character archetypes. Calling Satako by the other ones.

Each Satako/Takano archetype has a reference to the number 34 in it somehow.

-Edit: Looks like the internet is calling Gou “Higurashi: Rebellion Story”.

Makes sense if you look at Gou as a deconstruction of “Homura is a black hearted sociopath” theories/opinions.

At least Homura had good intentions with what she did (along with a shit ton of remorse) albeit faulty intel due to not knowing about the Memory Gambit, being tortured to insanity by Kyubey, and her tendency to use pragmatic/cynical solutions.

Edited by magnum12 on Feb 25th 2021 at 5:35:09 AM

Just that one reference I think.

Also this meme made early on in Gou turned out to age really well haha.

So I just finished EP 4 of Umineko, and...

How long was I on it!? I know Umineko is infamously long, but I honestly had no problem with the first arc, and only minor ones with two and three. There was a lot of talk, but also a sense that something was building up, and no conversation was entirely filler. Indeed I would say the first scene at the airport is one of the best examples I have seen of economically drawing up a large cast. It took me a while to get through them but it felt worth it.

Then came 4... which felt like little flashes of plot in a long slog of Ange being miserable and Maria being lonely. It was interesting seeing the basis of magic, but these segments just dragged on way too long, they felt like nothing was happening, and there were far too few interactions with the rest of the cast.

Then things got back to the action, the escape from the dungeon and Jessica and George fighting desperately, and Ange on the run and looking for clues was much better than her school days, then it looked like things were winding down with Battler's last stand... and then it goes off on another tangent that has no apparent connection to the main plot. I stayed up late thinking I would finish it. On several nights.

On top of just being too long, it also lacks its own plot focus. The first three arcs, long as they are, have a central plot that I can summarise in a sentence, and most of what happens serves that plot. This one has several plotlines, none of which deliver, and just feels like it is setting things up for later. I don't know how the arcs compare, but four certainly felt three times as long.

Even the climax was a disappointment, for another reason. Before now the "red truth" had felt like a genuine battle of wits (in B4 Battler is unarmed), having to match what is shown in third-person to the reader, and with the implication that Beatrice had to be careful what she revealed. But that weakened over the fourth arc and went out the window in the climax, where what was red truth seemed utterly arbitrary. I know there is a point here, that Beatrice was letting him win and to show that the conventions of the detective mystery genre are themselves arbitrary, but it meant that after my interest had been sapped all along the arc, there was nothing to revive it.

I will continue, but I wanted to get that out first. Katawa Shoujo has major pacing problems, but this still topped them.

Gou 22

So this episode explained a lot more about Satoko's motivations, and how she made the jump to murder.

With Certainty one might say

I was wrong about Rika being in the loops after the first Satoko non-death loop.

It's starting to feel like another season really is needed. Unless they plan on doing something like Umineko Gou haha. But without a (good) anime to base it off that seems unlikely.

Edited by 32ndfreeze on Mar 4th 2021 at 10:51:38 PM

Episode 22 makes Satako even less sympathetic with her knowing about the hell Rika went through and deciding to go through with it anyway.

Gou really is a Deconstruction of the anti Homura camp regarding Madoka Magica Rebellion Story’s ending. At least Homura is motivated by a genuine belief Madoka was suffering (accuracy of the flower field conversation unknown) and felt real shitty over her pragmatic/cynical solution. Not to mention refusing to kill another human unless imminent witch out or direct threat to Madoka’s life, which is ironic given her new demonic powers actually bolstered her ability to use non lethal solutions.

Yikes… So instead of being sympathetic of Rika’s suffering, she took it as a challenge. That’s… bold, if anything.

I really wonder how this is gonna end, because I didn’t expect Satoko to start… almost having fun with this?

Umineko related announcement on Monday. Which is exciting and not totally unexpected given how Gou has been trending.

Gou 23

Who expected the Teppai redemption arc? Although maybe that's too strong a phrase.

I guess it's started happening now because he's "close" to Satoko but not Rika.

That game of memory match was hardcore, since Satoko presumably immediately killed Rika then herself after each snap, likely totaling 20-30 times. Really true what she says about making her own miracles.

Speaking of, I don't know if the detail about fragment bleed-though requiring closeness to a looper and being permanent was known before.^note Saw an interview from last year that implied the closeness part But that explains Takeno's actions in the Matsuri+ loops.

But Rika referring to it as "miracles" is a bit ironic in the sense had she known how it actually worked she probably wouldn't have fallen to despair. After all each "victory" in the Answer arcs was essentially one step closer to a perfect fragment. Not just a random roll of the dice like she thought.

Edited by 32ndfreeze on Mar 11th 2021 at 11:10:30 PM

I certainly didn’t expect this character of all people to get some depth. But if this is the fragment that "replays" the Saving Satoko arc, then that actually makes it worse.

Still, it’s telling that even after becoming completely desensitized to killing herself and everyone else, Satoko is still physically afraid of Teppei…

On the other hand, I like the dark twist she puts on her Certainty vs. Miracles logic. And that laugh at the end of the match game was pretty terrifying.

Higurashi When They Cry Sotsu, the sequel to Gou, coming July.

It would seem Eua gave Satako limited chronomancy to boot. Each use sets the clock back about 5 seconds.

That’s how H173 gets stolen.

Satako has basically become a 1000x more malicious cross between Akuma Homura (who herself even as a demom has kind intentions but acting on bad intel and tortured to insanity) and Goro Akechi ( using H173 to inflict psychotic breakdowns on people, even her own friends).