Supernatural Undead vs Super Science Undead

I wonder has this concept ever been executed before?

So you got your zombie plague and horde, but opposing them are a handful of skeletons, ghosts, and possibly vampires. Humans are unlucky to be caught in the middle.

I had this thought for sometime and it came about as a result of what I feel is an excess of "zombie" in videogames.^note What do game devs have against the skeleton military?

edited 8th Oct '13 4:23:41 PM by Worlder

It's been sort of done in City of Heroes/Villains. The Vahzilok enemy faction had plague zombies, but there was also a voodoo-themed group and in a few scenarios they'd end up working against each other.

It was also done in Magic's Innistrad block- the world mostly consisted of humans and things derived from them (zombies, werewolves, ghosts, and vampires) with only a few instances of the normal big stompy creatures (wurms, dragons, demons, etc.) Specifically, black-aligned zombies were the necromancy kind (they even got a card called "zombie apocalypse") and the blue-aligned ones were the Frankenstein's monster kind (often needing to be "built" from other dead creatures.) Of course, this is Magic, where, well, magic basically IS science.

In an interesting twist, when things got really bad for the humans, the vampires (who normally treat them like cattle) started rallying to their defense, simply because they didn't want their livestock depleted. So there's that.

That said, let's be honest here. Zombie apocalypses are caused by magic, whether or not that magic is painted over to look like science. The practical limitations of a corpse make it implausible as anything except some kind of arcane reagent.

edited 9th Oct '13 2:40:40 AM by edgewalker22

That's a good point. I suppose that's why newer zombie media sometimes has "zombies" that are still alive, like 28 Days Later or Resident Evil 4/5.

So four damned souls are forced back into world of the living as skeletons. As it so happens they arrived after a zombie plague took out most the world's population. To gain some semblance of freedom or absolution of their past sins, they must rid the world of all other "undead".

Imagine a skeleton wearing tattered modern combat gear and wielding a riot shield and machete cutting through hordes of infected.

edited 9th Oct '13 10:06:47 PM by Worlder

When all that's left of your head is the skull, you've got nothing to fear from zombies.

Scientific explanation for the Walking Dead?

I love the idea of using genetically engineered "designer lifeforms" ranging from microbes to redwood- and elephant-sized plants and animals and giant underground fungi for purposes like adapting planets for human habitation by introducing new but non-disruptive GE life into its ecosystem. I think it's realistic given the progress we are making in understanding how genes replicate and interact, and there are even more possiblities within the emerging field of Epigenetics.

So why not engineer designer life to keep a human body alive?

Suppose the following: Diverse genetically engineered parasites (arguably symbiotic life rather than parasites, but I'm going to use that word for convenience) throughout the body designed to stimulate recently killed flesh. The brain parasite keeps the brain alive by providing electrical stimulation. The heart parasite does the same. The stomach parasites release nutrients to keep the microbes we depend on active, maybe even hyperactivating them, since zombies feed on raw flesh. The parasites released into the immune system provide activity and function for the cellular components of that system. The skin/bone tissue parasites regenerate damage to those systems. Basically a recently dead human brought back to life by genetically engineered, specialized parasites designed to keep the body going past brain death. But since the parasites aren't sentient, the reanimated human is just a walking, eating machine. The parasites can't access advanced cognitive functions, but they consume necrotic tissue for nutrients as it spreads, and then gets regenerated by the parasites, but since the human is technically dead, the quality of the nutrition it could provide is limited each cycle, so eventually the "undead" human would degenerate and die completely. But... if you're looking to unleash a zombie plague that combines old fashioned Slow Zombies with the pseudoscientific explanations given for more recent "Fast" or "Viral" Zombies, this is how I'd do it.

edited 11th Oct '13 5:15:32 AM by fulltimeD

That kind of zombie would be contagious but the infected wouldn't turn into zombies until they actually died. Interesting, someone could be a carrier for years will no ill effects (and quite possibly enhanced health) only to die and become a zombie. Potentially entire generations could become zombies before people caught on.

That's basically the way the Reworks in the very, very gory webcomic Rework The Dead...err...worked.

Turns out the 'virus' was a kind of bio-nanite spread by a hiveminded creature of sorts. The author has on various occasions implied either supernatural or extraterrestrial origins for that creature, and it's basically an Orphaned Series since he's been busy with other stuff for over 10 years now, but it's definitely an interesting way to do 'zombies' with some sort of internal consistency.

^ I don't know Zombie Fiction that well but it seems like it's headed for a merging of sorts with Bio Punk. My parasite idea comes from several stories I'm working on in a setting that has a Bug War in its backstory (parasitic worms controlling a conquered species and their technology try to invade and spread).

^^ That adds even more dimension I didn't think of. Maybe the parasites lie dormant until death is the catalyst that activates them.

I have a background in Bio so when something's needed that technology isn't supposed to be able to accomplish, I usually turn to genetic engineering and try to come up with realistic and functional forms of GE life rather than waste time with technobabble. How does the spaceship crew breathe? Easy. They carry GE plants that produce oxygen. How do humans settle planets with indigenous life like viruses? They engineer microbes to fight the viruses inside the body until the humans are able to adapt over the generations. I also like writing stories where corporations control designer genes or even "designer lifeforms" as I call them. I wrote a story once about a GE brain parasites that's used to carry the memories and personality of one person inside another person's brain, but if it doesn't get removed in time, the carried personality takes over the host.

edited 13th Oct '13 4:33:11 AM by fulltimeD

The thing is, the original zombies, or at least zombies as they were created in Haiti, are not undead at all. They were just conditioned to think that they were. (Zombi was a word meaning spirit in some African languages but they were not exactly undead either)

Still I could imagine super science zombies being like some kind of after effect of a biological bomb used on a population believed to be compromised by a more supernatural menace. Maybe the bomb was used without knowledge of super natural undead but they happen to come out and find the super science undead competing with them for the same food source.

Maybe super science undead cannot be turned or make poor meals for the super natural ones, yet their natural aggression means the two groups will be opposed to each other anyway. Maybe the super natural undead have more human mentalities (merely being cursed people) and are trying to protect normal human, who they identify with, from the shambling super science horde?

^ On that note... a few thoughts...

I wonder if Stoner Comedy and that X-Files episode with the Genie haven't portrayed zombies more "realistically" (as in "well thought out" than zombie fiction).

Anyone remember that 90's movie "Idle Hands?" Stoner Zombies. X-Files? Guy's brother is killed and he wishes for the Genie to bring him back, but he comes back as a barely functional zombie with all the unexpected but "realistic" consequences.

Wasn't there an old science fiction story (called "Necroville" or something) where the dead were brought back to life and pretty much resumed their old lives but were forced to live in a ghetto?

edited 29th Oct '13 8:03:34 AM by fulltimeD

One of the Invisible Cities is a vast necropolis buried beneath the living city, populated by corpses posed according to their duties in life by a secretive order of priestly, hooded morticians who mediate between the living and dead cities and are believed to recruit acolytes from both. The dead are set in their ways and never make any changes without considerable forethought and contemplation, and so in respect for their wisdom the citizens above attempt to emulate them in every respect. And so no one can truly say which city is living and which dead.

Probably not what you were thinking of, but it's what came to mind. :P

edited 16th Nov '13 12:28:52 AM by Noaqiyeum

I think this is a very so, and I hope someone does make something out of it. I am not really into the horror genre, so I doubt it will be me, unless I finally make something out of that nebulous concept of an undead hero that's been floating around my head for the last couple months.

Going back to the OP's note about what game devs have against (reanimated) skeletons: short answer, I don't think they do, really. I've seen plenty of them, although there are two reasons why not to have a skeleton military.

First, I've heard about some games having to retexture skeletons with skin, or have their games banned in China. Apparently, its a cultural taboo there to show bare bones. Second, in a science fiction setting, skeletons can't move. They need muscles to move, which means flesh, at which point you're already in fleshed zombie as opposed to a skeleton.

That last paragraph may or may not apply as one forumgoer on a Chinese gaming website once showed that AION apparently had no issues showing naked skeletons over over there.