Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.

I wonder the extent and longevity of Daisy's super enhanced powers. It's not like the centipede serum wears off or anything. So now she's just, super Quake?

So this idea was brought up in another forum regarding Ward. But what if the Berserker staff episode was some kind of foreshadowing?

Consider: Ward touches part of the staff, and gets hit with the berserker rage, having to fight constantly from attacking the rest of the team; it's enough of a cliche in this sort of plot that you just roll your eyes and ignore the fact that that's a dumb weapon to equip your soldiers with.

Then May handles the whole thing and manages to shakily set it down, and that plays as a May-is-awesome moment - which works because of course May is awesome.

And you kind of forget that that that whole cult all touched the staff as well, and none of them started fighting each other.

In fact, Ward was the only one that came close to turning on his own people. Why? Because they *weren't* his people.

At the time, it was written off as Ward having a large amount of anger issues under the surface.

And that May just had a better way of dealing with said issues.

Oh, they dropped a BUNCH of hints that Ward wasn't what he pretended to be, while also distracting the audience from said hints. The anger issue were from the get go just a distraction, but once you take a step back, Ward being a traitor made so much sense. It explained why he positioned himself so badly in the bridge episode, despite being such a competent agent, thus allowing Coulson to be taken. In the Yes, Men episode he actually still tries to kill May a split second after the thrall is already broken. He conveniently kills off the fake clairvoyant. And then there are multiple conversations which hint in the direction, too.

The writers are pretty good about that...hell this season one of Robyn's pictures showed May and Coulson at the beach at the very beginning. We just didn't know its meaning yet.

Anyway, here a list of Stuff I want from season 6:

1. More Deke! I don't care about their BS, I want Deke back!

2. A second wedding (eventually). And this time, they better put Fitz into a Kilt. (btw, it is possible the Jemma is already pregnant? That would be kind of funny.....)

3. More Enok!

4. Some sort of Infinity War tie in.

5. And I finally want to know what happened to the damned cocoon on the bottom of the ocean.

6. And what exactly is the deal with Davis again? Anyway, I want Mike to make an appearance.

edited 19th May '18 1:32:01 PM by Swanpride

They got 13 eps to wrap up that one, so we might see it after all.

I'm curious about that and how Daisy managed to jettison Talbot into orbit. I mean, the man controls gravity. Specifically the force that keeps people from doing that. I have to assume he didn't react in time but it's really odd saying that the man who controls gravity was beaten by getting space-tossed.

Someone said Talbot got Kars'd (Ah, I get what you meant in the Jojo thread now, Rob) - but the thing is Kars got screwed because he kept getting distracted, and by the time he thought to propel himself back it was too late.

I didn't watch most of this season but, this Centipede serum super-charges enhances people's super powers now? I don't remember it doing that. I thought it was a super-unstable super strength serum.

When Coulson said that Daisy was the only one who could stop Talbot I figured, "right, she vibrates things, that's probably the only thing on Earth right now you know besides the Avengers who could deal with him. Did he slip The Juice into her glove or was it already there as a Plan B? I guess since she told him to take it once he got back to base she must have thought they still had it - plus Simmons went looking for it later. Didn't they need this same stuff to cure him in the first place? Yo-yo was distraught when May broke it, or another vial of it, and I thought the tension in that scene was that they only had enough left to cure Coulson.

Alright, I got lost in the sauce there.

Was Fitz split from the waist down, or was the sheet of rubble just so deep they had no chance of carrying him? Damn. I feel like, had May gone in alone then present!Fitz might still be alive.

That ending on the Zephyr caught me by surprise. There's another Fitz just floating around in space waiting to be found in a future that no longer exists? Well, I can't wait to go back through the season and find out what's up with that.

All of that aside, this isn't the Graviton I wanted but at last my Agents of SHIELD bucket list is finally complete.

• Saw Ward become a good person? Check.
• Major Marvel character who wasn't Fury on the show? Check.
• LMD's? Check.
• Gravitonium followed up on, resulting in a crazy guy with gravity powers? Check.
• Talbot frozen in space? Check. Hope he says hi to Lincoln and Hive while he's up there.
• Romantic tension between Coulson and May? Not that I really wanted this, but check.

I wonder if Davis and Piper will be series regulars next season.

Personally I thought Deke skipping out was kinda cheap on the writers' part. His presence is supposed to show that nothing will happen to Jemma and Fitz. Deke leaving pretty much ensures one of them won't make it by the end of the episode.

How's Talbot's son gonna take the news his father is dead now? Will he have any kind of ill will towards Daisy?

You specifically wanted Talbot frozen in space?

Say, does anyone have any photos of the drawings Robin made? Because I found this one◊ and it serves to kinda foreshadow Graviton a bit, interestingly enough.

All the pictures paid off eventually, and yes, that is the Graviton picture.

Honestly, the Fitz thing was solved extremely clever. His past version hasn't forcefully operated on Daisy yet and hasn't had the Doctor personality let take control of him.

Ok, and he technically isn't married to Jemma yet, but that's semantics

But if they get the past version of him, won't that create a time paradox cancelling them escaping from that old future?.... which doesn't exist anyway... God, this is confusing!

Anyway, what do you guys think they'll do for season 6? Will they let Coulson actually die, or find some way to prevent his death again?^^

If they would, that would be extremely cheap and unworthy of the series.

I hope they let him die. It respects his decision; and for the last season, it would be interesting to see how the team works without him.

I still don't get how there can be two of Fitz (I skipped that episode). How could he have both frozen himself and sent himself to the future?

He didn't send himself into the future. He waited it out. Literally. The Fitz that we have been following the last few episodes is technically well over a century old. He froze himself in the Lighthouse and woke up 83 years after everything was destroyed.

(Though I for one must have missed the part where the pod was somehow lost in space?)

It's not lost but they don't know the exact location. Fitz never told them.

So here's a thought; would finding out what happened be more or less traumatic for Fitz than waking up and finding the woman you love has married your future self already?

Even worse, waking up expecting to have to rescue your team only to discover that they have already been rescued.

Though I can imagine Fitz waking up, seeing Jemma and immediately saying "marry me".

Btw, it is also possible that this Fitz has less brain problems without the freezing process messing it up even more.....

So Fitz has sort of become like or adjacent to Major Victory

I feel like Fitz and Strange would have a long conversation about quantum mechanics.

edited 21st May '18 6:56:33 PM by Soble

The Fitz who's alive never did any of those things. The Fitz who did do those things paid for it with his life. I'd say karma's pretty square on that.

I'm actually feeling pretty proud because I totally called this with Fitz. I'm disappointed at how childishly simple it wound up to beat the time loop, but I'm happy with what was done with Fitz. I pointed out as soon as he showed up cryogenically frozen way back at the start of the season that Fitz was now narratively expendable. They could kill him off at any moment, because once the time loop's broken, they can just crack open the spare and continue having a Fitz.

I've been waiting for Fitz to die all season. Figured it'd be the finale that did it.

Nope. Whether or not the model of time travel depicted here utilizes Multiverse Theory, the version of Fitz floating around in space in this timeline would never land in that timeline anyway.

Incidentally, Deke should similarly still be around unless we're using really stupid Arbitrary Paradox mechanics. Even if the timeline he originated from no longer exists, he has ontological inertia. For Deke to blink out of existence with his timeline to make sense, he would need to blink out retroactively, altering the timeline by removing his involvement in every event up to this point.

"Blink out of existence because the future was changed" is, and always has been, the stupidest time travel plot point in existence and the sooner it blinks out, the better off time travel narratives will be.

edited 22nd May '18 6:06:20 PM by TobiasDrake

It seems like they wrote him out just so they wouldn't have to answer the question

I like to imagine he's in a bar somewhere trying to drink away the existential horror

And then the next morning wishing he would never existed oh god existence is terrible

He's at the bar drinking Zimas again, probably.

Thinking on it a little, this season and last season kinda both were a touch anti-climactic, no? Aida gets offed by Coulson Rider, which is kinda quick and I did recall people complaining about her being taken down too easily. With Graviton, while I admit his death was funny (literally punched into space, probably hanging with Squidward and Squid Ward's ashes), the entire change to the timeline that was built up amounted to...Coulson putting something in Daisy's glove. What was this about him figuring out the pieces or whatever?

I think the general idea is that accepting Coulson's death let him give the Centipede serum to Daisy in the crucial moment, and only by not clinging to the past were they able to create a new future.

So in a sense, Coulson did put the "pieces" back together, just not directly.

The problem is that it's totally what they did the last time around too. In the "last time anyone saw Daisy Johnson alive" video, she turns around and yells at Coulson just like she did in this go-round. Previous iterations of Coulson died too, so presumably they would also have given Daisy the centipede serum.

This is the problem with introducing a stable time loop. It means that you gotta come up with some serious shit to justify breaking them. "They just did things differently this time" isn't a very good excuse, because all the previous iterations of them would have been acting on the exact same logic they used to make the choices they made this time. All variables being exactly the same should result in the same outcome, and that includes the choices made as a result of those variables.

I'd suggest that what they did was in the previous timelines, Daisy didn't look in her glove and realize what was in there...but that'd be fucking stupid and a really minuscule change.