Joker should have gotten the death penalty a long time ago, the insanity defense doesn't work when you clearly show yourself conscious of your actions and your body count is in the thousands.
Whatever eldritch horrors that lay beneath Gotham wouldn’t allow that.
Every accusation by the GOP is ALWAYS a confession.
The Head of the Hydra
New issue of Batman: The Knight, issue 4.
Batman encounters a young Ghost-Maker here and kudos to Zdarsky he actually makes the character work.
His friendship with Bruce feels genuine while setting up his own non-altruistic motivation.
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Meanwhile, Catwoman gets the death penalty for killing terrorists who bomb orphanages and the only thing that saves her from the electric chair is revealing that she didn't actually kill them.
Why do they write the Joker in an annoying manner in the first place? They didn't have to make him such an extreme mass murderer that people wonder why the evil jerk isn't dead yet. I like the theory that anyone that kills the Joker becomes a new Joker. Because of the Gotham eldritch horrors. Or it's a contagious issue. They should focus more on the rest of the massive Batman rogue gallery though. It's boring to have only Joker stories.
Surrounded by weirdoes
Because they turned the whole thing into an escalating contest to see what kinda crap will the clown pull next time, without remembering that being a clown means that he is supposed to be kind of funny. And Batman is kind of plagued with mindless attempts at deconstruction which ends up feeding the issues.
Wake me up at your own risk.
The Head of the Hydra
Remember how varied Joker's schemes were in BTAS?
Joker was more about screwing with people in general more than anything.
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Another way of looking at it that I saw and kind of agree with is that Batman has become The Superhero over the course of the 80s 90s and 2000s, between the films, DCAU, Arkham games and other adaptations, and so on, so now the Joker can't just be the Joker, a very specific take on the supervillain, he has to be the The Final Boss of The Superhero.
Team Rocket Boss.
That's sort of why I can accept the Joker's role in Arkham as always the final boss.
It's like Dr. Wily from Mega Man.
I'll teach you a lesson about just how cruel the world can be. That's my job, as an adult.
So this video essay appeared in my YouTube feed recently:
It's essentially a critique on the modern Batman comics complaining that Batman has lost its gothic horror roots in the modern day. According to the author, new villains have no staying power, the comics aren't scary or gripping anymore, and there are few new enduring stories likely to be remembered. He believes that Batman needs to be rooted in horror to be effective and the lighter takes where he has more allies and Gotham is less of an eldritch Genius Loci are damaging to the mythos.
Personally, I strongly disagree with a lot of the takes in the essay, namely that Batman shouldn't be allowed to be happy or have his crusade make any kind of larger impact, but what do you guys think?
On the previous discussion, I agree that Joker has stopped being funny some time ago and is just a Monster Clown with barely any of the clown left in him. I wish stories would make him more whimsical again as a reminder that he's the Joker, not just a mass murderer.
Edited by reppuzan on Apr 20th 2022 at 2:11:42 AM
Starform
The gothic horror stuff came in the 1980s/1990s, so it's not the be-all and end-all of Batman. I agree that Gotham should be allowed to improve and Bruce should be allowed to be happy. I think the last time the Joker was funny was when he showed up in Tomasi's Detective run. I agree that Tynion's Joker can't seem to bother to joke. Scott Snyder's Joker did joke, but all of the jokes were very, very morbid and it wouldn't hurt to mix in some lighter ones (heck, they'd make the morbid ones pop out more).
The contention that new Batman villains aren't sticking is an interesting one, and worthy of discussion. The Court of Owls have stuck in that since their big Scott Snyder story they've become go-to villains in Batman-adjacent stuff. (Tim Seeley's Nightwing, the "guest-starring-Batman" issue of Benjamin Percy's Green Arrow run, James Tynion's The Joker, etc.) They haven't shown up in Bruce's own solo books in ages, but they've successfully become a fixture of the mythos. Other than that, though, I don't think any "created in the 2010s/2020s" Batman villain has caught on. I don't think it's because the new villains aren't scary. The Court is scary (because their influence pops up in sudden, unexpected ways), but so is Mr. Bloom, and he's only returned in a zombie book. Tomasi's Astrid Arkham has a fairly limited motivation that makes it hard to reuse her without the story feeling like a rehash of the arc she debuted in. I have no clue if Chip Zdarsky / Ram V will use Mariko Tamaki's villains. Tom King didn't bother to create any villains.
A lot of old-school Batman villains aren't popular because they're scary, they're popular because they have weird quirks or pathos-filled motivations or cool fighting styles/character designs.
Edited by StarformDCX on Apr 20th 2022 at 6:00:52 AM
The five best Superman writers are Dan Jurgens, Jeph Loeb, Geoff Johns, Kurt Busiek, and Peter J. Tomasi.
Isn't there many different ways Batman can be portrayed? They're usually darker than Superman stories but don't have to be horror stories. I'd like more lighter stories so I'll stick to those.
The Head of the Hydra
He can, he's just stuck in a rut where people believe he can only be portrayed or is best portrayed as ultra-gritty realistic.
Like most recently with Batman: The Imposter and the new movie.
Which is actually different from gothic because that involves a level of stylization that realism doesn't allow.
Edited by slimcoder on Apr 20th 2022 at 4:02:21 AM
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
The guy has enough Plot Armor to make him invincible. Not very realistic.
To play devil's advocate, I do sometimes feel like the Bat-Family has grown too big, resulting in the characters sort of stepping on each other's toes. Of course, this may just be my "back in my day" talking, as I came of age when the family was Bruce, Alfred, Dick, Tim, Babs, and Cass. I don't think you need Harley Quinn, and Clayface feels like it's only a matter of time until a writer wants him to be a villain again (like when Sandman was a reserve Avenger).
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The Head of the Hydra
That reminds me of a comment I read during a review during the recent Detective Comics Shadow of the Bat event which centered on the Batfam operating sans Batman.
And its a pretty negative one towards the Batfam.
This is the best representation of what the Batfamily has been for me, in recent years. A bunch of leeches, a bunch of incompetent, ungrateful f***ing leeches that often criticize the main character, while hipocritcally wearing his symbol or associating themselves with him. F*ck the Batfamily.
I realize this is harsh and I'm aware of the importance of family for Batman's growth as a character. But the good times have passed and there's only one man right now that I trust to write a good batfamily book and it's Tomasi.
I don't know if I'd go that far, but I do sorta find the family at odds with the writers who want to portray Bruce as miserable or wondering if he can ever be happy. Like... Bruce! How are you not happy? Look at all these kids who adore you! A more well-adjusted Batman, like the one from the 70s or 80s, or the early BTAS, makes more sense as a family man.
I haven't read the comics surrounding Jason Todd's return, so can anyone explain to me why he's gotten to play Punisher without Batman throwing his butt in jail?
The very best, like no one ever was. Check out my Spider-Man fanfic here! [1]
The Head of the Hydra
Now that I think about it, it does tie into the mindless deconstruction nature by constantly portraying the Batfam to be in perpetual conflict with each other.
Just about everyone has a problem with Batman, writing having them constantly arguing with him only to then largely portray Bruce as still the most competent member always saving their asses. It leads to a lot of mixed messages where everyone looks bad.
Shadows of the Bat actually ends with Nighting held hostage and almost died falling off a building, only saved by the timely arrival of Batman into the story. Which is a common complaint of the story from what I hear of it, despite being a Batfam centered event they are portrayed as the most part failure heroes and only start actually making decent progress and success when Batman arrives in the lat 2 issues.
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
I'm behind on modern Batman, so I can't agree or disagree with that, but I do like the Bat-Family overall. It just seems like too much of a good thing. I'm excited for Zdarsky to focus on the Bruce-Tim duo and I want to get some trades of the current Nightwing run, plus the Morrison Batman & Robin with Dick as Batman.
The very best, like no one ever was. Check out my Spider-Man fanfic here! [1]
I thought Dick stopped being a Distressed Dude when he became Nightwing?
Robins was a recent good run that showed the Bat Family as fairly functional, along with having genuine care and respect for Bruce. It did run into the trap where some of them had to be captured/sidelined since there are just so many of them.
They fought a bit, but what families don't?
@reppuzan This guy's argument is that modern Batman comics aren't scary enough? I'm guessing he loved the arc about the Joker cutting off his own face.
I thought Batman comics were more sad than scary. At least the old batman stories were sadder than the superman stories in the old world's finest book from before it became a team up book.
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
He did actually, while complaining that Gotham under every mainline writer since Snyder was "too beautiful" rather than a location designed to fill you with existential dread.
RE: Bruce and Arkham. I recall that in the Arkham Asylum games, that Bruce paid for a lot of security upgrades for the asylum.
That Joker broke through in a matter of minutes.
Granted, it was all planned out and took months to get ready, but ehhh.
I'll teach you a lesson about just how cruel the world can be. That's my job, as an adult.