The General US Politics Thread

I wouldn't go so far as to say he's Democratic Trump...but yeah. He's a populist.

He kinda sorta is, the mayor different is more in content, but is not surprise a lot of sander crow can be...unconfortable to hang around.

Sanders supporters can be...yeah. Even some of the more civil ones make you feel like you're chewing on tin foil.

The leftist (which is admittedly not quite the same as Democratic) version of Trump would be someone like Marianne Williamson, I think her name is? I've heard someone explain it vaguely that, while Trump is your racist uncle, Williamson is your crazy hippy aunt.

How I'd put it that they both have their side's variants of anti-intellectualism. In general, Rightists tend to be arbitrarily skeptical ("global warming and evolution are myths!") while Leftists are arbitrarily gullible ("psionic powers exist, vaccines and GM Os are harmful!") Just a broad trend, though.

Populism fucking sucks because it allows idiots to have a say in government policy they have zero clue about when it should be left to wonks and technocrats.

I find a lot of populism criticism has an anti-public bias where they don't want the public to actually articulate their desires but merely stick to pre-existing talking points. They don't want to hear about how the poor are desperate, hurting, and in need of help. They just want them to vote for Team A not B.

The reason populist messages keep winning people over is a need for radical change exists—its just liars and monsters seem to be the onky people willing to promise it.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Feb 1st 2020 at 6:34:03 AM

Protagonist: no really, that take implies there is something intrinsic altruist in the left which is far for the truth, is just that right now there is a counterpart to trump on the left because trump aside of being a cartoon made flesh, have this naked ambition as is only value.

Now if we talk outside, I will said trump look A LOT like maduro(not chavez and thank for that, you wouldnt have a chance) both are heavy anti-intelectualist, with various gadfe at language and being memetic about it, being bully who like to die in hills they really shoudnt and are pathetic even by dictator standard.

right now, there is not much of that in US.

Compared to the right? Yes. Correct.

What did I say that implied the left is more altruistic? That wasn't an intentional statement.

What I was saying is that Williamson is anti-intellectual in the typical leftist way of believing in new age-BS, which makes her a good counterpart to someone like Trump.

Edited by Protagonist506 on Feb 1st 2020 at 6:57:03 AM

Is more a sort of false equivalence because one have belief in general and the other...dosent in general.

a left version of trump is a cynical tankie, which so far you dont have in the states as far as I know

@wisewillow: So a) is that something someone outside the US can do, and b) how was the bread?

We've got cynical tankies in the USA too, they just aren't (thankfully) running for POTUS right now.

The irony is the communist apologist Russian and Chinese assets are the Republicans nowadays.

a) If you’re a US citizen you can volunteer from anywhere with internet; b) it’s nice! I’m baking my way through Bread Illustrated; I tried the classic Italian bread again and it came out better.

Must go spread the Bernie love.

Yesssssss.

Russia is one thing, but no, the GOP still hates mainland China. Marco Rubio for one recently called out mainland China for not letting Taiwanese people stuck in Wuhan go back to Taiwan.

Someone else also linked a reddit post a while back pointing out how most of the USA politicians congratulating Tsai for her win in Taiwan against the KMT pro Beijing candidate are Republicans.

Edited by M84 on Feb 2nd 2020 at 12:36:24 AM

Only because they're a rival geopolitical power. When it comes to the CCP's actual level of societal control, Republicans have done little to indicate that they aspire to be anything different.

Reposting it:

r/Taiwan has a thread about which American politicians have congratulated Tsai for her victory.

Something that is rather worrisome is that the vast majority are Republicans or conservative Democrats. Omar, Biden, Coons, Markey, Cox, and Joaquin Castro (Julian's brother) are the only Democrat on the list so far.

This is evidence of the bizarre relationship that the GOP has with Taiwan. Despite possessing things that the party opposes in the United States (female president, universal healthcare, and gay marriage), Republicans have consistently advocated for greater support for Taiwan while the Democrats have lagged behind.

Democrats have consistently been less openly supportive of Taiwan, to the point where the Obama administration arguably swayed the 2012 election in favor of KMT president Ma Ying-jeou by criticizing Tsai as being too provocative towards China.

Most egregiously, Andrew Yang, the one actual Taiwanese-American candidate, has refused to even tweet a statement of support for Tsai when his rival non-Asian candidates like Biden have done so. IMO, the most likely reason is because he is descended from the mainland Hans who fled to Taiwan with the Nationalists, who make up the backbone of the now Chinese-friendly Kuomintang Party that Tsai defeated.

Yet another example of a Circular Firing Squad.

Tlaib expresses "regret" over booing Hillary Clinton at an event in Iowa.

At least she had enough sense to realize that it was counterproductive - after being called out on it. There's - unfortunately - enough idiots within the Party who don't realize this and that's going to be a problem down the line, irrespective of who wins the primary.

EDIT: Corrected the misleading headline. My bad.

Edited by TechPriest90 on Feb 1st 2020 at 1:15:18 PM

@Fluffy Mc Chicken

I don't really have a clue as to why there might be a support gap between the Dems and GO Ps when it comes to Taiwan. I do have a clue as to why Yang might not have tweeted anything one way or another:

He just doesn't care. I can relate, I grew up in Northern Ireland until I was six, then moved to Australia. My parents have Views, often opposing ones, regarding the political situation of Ireland, since they lived most of their lives there. I, on the other hand, only keep up with British politics so I can understand what my relatives living there are going on about.

Now, one could say that someone looking to become the leader of a country should be more involved with international politics, especially when their opponents are. But saying that someone must have an opinion on their parents country, but not their own (Yang's parents moved to the U.S. in the 1960's, Yang was born in '73), or that their (lack of) an opinion must be due to their (supposed) genetic descent is really off to me. Should I support the I.R.A. due to my fathers republican leanings? Should I have a picture of the Queen on my desk because of my mothers unionist leanings?

In short, I think trying to pin (the lack of) a stated political stance on one's descent is a little off-base. Sure, your parents can influnce your opinions and politics, but that isn't the be-all and end-all.

That was from yesterday, not 2016. She is apologizing the day after.

Edited by Parable on Feb 1st 2020 at 10:12:15 AM

https://www.themarysue.com/rashida-tlaib-boos-hillary-clinton/

Rashida Tlaib boos Hillary Clinton at Bernie rally. That's not cool, Rashida. Rise above like Spiderman.

Still glad she, Ilhan Omar and Pramila Jayapal are showing out for the Bernmeister. I think it shows they know who is the best candidate for their agenda.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Feb 1st 2020 at 10:36:48 AM

The GOP is hostile to China because of a mix of old Cold War sentiment ("communism bad!"), geopolitical rivalry and desire to be a Big Man, while the Democrats are more focused on dealing with China as it is and de-escalating the usual penis-waving contests in the South China Sea.

Which leads to the paradox that the GOP tends to be friends with the Taiwanese left, because the Pan-Greens are pro-independence and progressive-liberal, while the Pan-Blues are authoritarian capitalists who want to join the CCP.

This is technically true, but something must be deeply motivating Yang to refuse to congratulate Tsai when he's literally wasted an entire month and his rivals have already outflanked him in posting a 140 character tweet that would only take 30 seconds to type.

There may be some Values Dissonance here. I'm not too sure about the situation between Catholics and Protestants in Northern Ireland, but you can more or less draw political boundaries between ethnic groups in Taiwan. The mainland Hans whose grandparents arrived with the Nationalists after 1945 consistently support the KMT, while the Hans whose grandparents had been assimilated into Japanese culture prior to 1945 consistently support the DPP. Of course, you have splinter citizens who are a member of one group but support a party they wouldn't be expected to support, but the blood boundaries are drawn deep enough for be accurate about, IMO, 70% of the time.

Also, inversely, why people on the US left can sometimes end up cheering for foreign rightists who are more likely to champion independence movements as well as promote local customs in practice, albeit less because of opposing imperialism and racism but rather because of nationalism.

Criticism of him on this in general is fine, but I think making assumptions about Yang's family history because of his actions is stepping into some very uncomfortable territory regarding racial forms of Category Traitor. It reminds me of the Marxist claims that the reason my parents hate China must be because they were brainwashed by their own parents, or that they must be the children of rich landowners letting their resentment show. And for the record of anyone who's curious, they're not; both sides of my family were lower-middle or working class.

Edited by AlleyOop on Feb 1st 2020 at 2:22:43 PM