The General US Politics Thread

Epic Rap Battles of History?

I just have one pragmatic question: what makes people think the GOP-majority, Mc Connell-controlled Senate, would convict the POTUS, once the latter is impeached by the House? Like, why on Earth would they do it?

Why aren't the militians in jail already?

Edited by Oruka on Apr 20th 2019 at 1:34:10 AM

Edited by akanesarumara on Apr 20th 2019 at 10:50:53 AM

I suggest maybe we not discuss impeachment again for a while here. We already got the mods warning us to tone it down.

I only needed that piece of info.

Militians, tho. Why aren't they in jail? Or cop-killed?

You wanna go kick a hornet's nest then be my guest.

It sure is easy killing unarmed compliant black men, but armed defiant white men, now that's too much, isn't it?

They tend to have body armor and be ex-police or military or at least trained by them. Much more dangerous than your average hick.

Edited by CookingCat on Apr 20th 2019 at 2:03:24 AM

These types of groups are an insurgency waiting to happen.

I don't know about you but I'd rather not have Arkansas look like Belfast circa 1972

Thing is, a lot of cops are fully aware that these assholes are a serious threat. Cops are in fact often victims of these militias.

So apparently Warren calls for impeachment. And I really like her reasoning why:

Yeah, that settles it, I will root for her during the election.

The problem is that what the militias are doing isn’t exactly against the law. New Mexico has few laws prohibiting militias, and they’re vague enough for groups like this to slip through. New Mexico also allows a lawful citizens arrest for any felony, which covers illegal entry into the country.

That’s why the governor is asking them to stop, because the cops have their hands tied with guys like these.

Quickest way to get rid of these guys is to have actual military show up and promptly ask them "Are you sure you want to this?We just finished target practise.."

Thanks to Posse Comitatus, that would most likely be illegal.

As soon as we get a Democratic trifecta, I'd like that, actually. I remember a dude named Eisenhower who kicked the hornet's nest in Arkansas for good results; what's changed in the last 60 years aside from that being made illegal by a repealable Act of Congress?

, plus, Trump isn't going to use the military against his fellow racists.

Edited by Ramidel on Apr 20th 2019 at 2:43:34 AM

> Thanks to Posse Comitatus, that would most likely be illegal.

> Federal armed forces used in accordance to the Insurrection Act, as was the case with the 1st Marine Division and 7th Infantry Division being sent to curtail the 1992 Los Angeles riots.

They wouldn't even have to fire a shot,just tell them they're part of an insurreaction in the eyes of law and they should surrender peacefully or they will use whatever means to put them down

If that ever makes it before a judge, though, there's a significant possibility of it screwing things up. Part of why the Wounded Knee incident charges went nowhere (aside from absolutely ridiculous malfeasance on the government's part - it got so bad that the defendants were making citizens' arrests on the FBI in open court) is that US troops were involved in what was seen as police business and that pissed off the judge.

Except, legally speaking, they’re not part of an insurrection. This is what keeps them legal under New Mexico’s anti-militia laws, they’re not usurping or rebelling against the US government’s authority. Rioters are rebelling against lawful order by the very nature of their actions. If they shot a police officer or something then they could be all rounded up, but these guys know the laws and how to toe the line.

And yeah, like Ramidel said I wouldn’t like that case’s chances in court.

Like with Neo-Nazis, the solution here is outreach. These groups rely on recruiting vulnerable individuals, if you cut them off from that they wither and die. It’s not a problem you can solve with blunt force.

I’ll also point out that the federal government coming down and threatening to shoot everyone is what these guys fantasize about almost 24/7. They would love that.

Edited by archonspeaks on Apr 20th 2019 at 4:11:18 AM

I don't want an insurgency in Arkansas. That's what all of them were preparing and training to do when Obama was in office and as soon as Trump is out it's what they'll go back to doing.

I don't want an insurgency in Arkansas because that's just a couple hours away.

A lot of the militias and white supremacy groups in my area aren't isolated groups. They're families, buddies, and co-workers who have formed together their own communities.

There's the cult kinds but plenty of them are local groups that GO DOWN to the Mexico-US border as weekend or vacation trips. They play soldier and carry around Tasers and fake badges for it. Their dad, their sons, and maybe some of their sons friends are wearing their camo outfits and carrying around rifles.

This is not a case of lonely depressed individuals who just need a Care Bear hug. Its a manifstation of community racism.

Neo-Nazis are gangs of outsiders while White Supremacist groups in America are very much made of the community of America. The big difference being that the latter tend to use Confderate flags and only have swaztica tattoos in places thay can be covered.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Apr 20th 2019 at 9:56:40 AM

That post actually resembles something I've been thinking about: a common argument for trying to reach to the alt-right is that many of them at their core are just depressed and disaffected youths that want to belong to something. While this may be true for some, sometimes the people being radicalized are just selfish, unempathetic prices who think they have a birthright to do and say whatever want with no consequences and without having to bear any responsibility.

Quite, that's why trying to reach out to their members to rehabilitate them should have a place but it can't be the only tool we use to dismantle their organizations. You need the stick too, legal and social pressure to make being a member of the alt-right very uncomfortable.

Oddly enough, a moment of Supergirl was really effective in this season where she discovers a Hate Group's call center where she is freaked the hell out not because of the people are a bunch of scary dangerous psychopaths with tattoos. Instead, it's the discovery the majority of the members are school teachers, fathers, and the "kind of people she rescues every day."

Which is a fictional example but a good one for remembering the worst part of American racism isn't individual—it's institutional.

The "Angry White Lady calls the police on a black child" is a normal woman in our socity, not the outlier.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Apr 20th 2019 at 9:57:24 AM

I wonder, what if in democratic stronghold areas like San Francisco, lawmakers and educational policy makers really made a point to recognize and call out racism? My hypothesis is that there would be a spillover, both from students that move away and students who graduate and go into education, and a ripple effect could have a chance to take hold.

Do you think they don't?

The Media would invite people on "both sides of the issue" to discuss whether or not it's actual racism and you'd see OP-eds on CNN and NYT decrying liberals for trying to push our political correctness on the Real Americans (TM) of Middle America and how for doing that we're the real fascists.

That isn't to say that we shouldn't push against racism, but it's not nearly as simple as this. There are so many (white) people who have a vested interest in downplaying, excusing, and advocating for racism.