Trying too hard: Char Clone

Thats what the second paragraph is for

The original or the sandboxed version?

When you guys get to cleaning up the examples, it makes sense to cut anything that was made before Mobile Suit Gundam was even made unless it is known to have inspired Char's character directly. How can it be a clone if the thing it was cloned from wasn't even around when it was made? That's just coincidence if they happen to be similar.

edited 26th May '11 7:12:33 PM by NoirGrimoir

- I haven't actually looked at the examples yet besides Vader.... More focused on the write up. However something with all the connotations of the trope before it was popularized by Char seems like worth a entry.

edited 26th May '11 9:28:16 PM by Raso

Courtesy sandbox link for the new page: Char Clone

As you said, b) Describe the character. There's very little of that.

Right now the Trope page reads too much like a page for Gundam fans by Gundam fans.

Ok...

How is this a problem? Thats the description of his character!

Coz it's not the first Paragraph. As Fast Eddie himself as said countless time, the first paragraph should explain the trope. Not be about trivial background info about how much people like gundam.

And sometimes thats not going to obtain.

The trope is "expies inspired by Char Aznable from the Gundam franchise." Then you can go into detail about what makes Char Char.

Exactly. The paragraph in question is probably fine, but it's in the wrong place in the description.

What? How?

First paragraph explains the trope, second explains specifically who Char is. Thats the order they need to be in. It would be silly to start with the description of Char.

Order of paragraphs is something like:

[Image]

[quote]

Definition (can be split into two paragraphs, one set up and one blunt definition if the trope requires specific background events to occur).

[Further elaboration] (1-3 paragraphs is generally more than enough)

[Real Life comparison] (if it's a Hollywood X or something similar)

[Name origin] (if it's named after something)

Related tropes paragraph.

Examples

Things in brackets are option and should be added as needed, but should be kept shorter than the unbracketed ones since those have "as long as they need to be to get the point across" status.

I think this order of the paragraphs makes the most sense, that's just a slightly awkward transition from the first to second paragraph. What would honestly make it sound better is moving the last sentence from the paragraph to after the second paragraphs, but then the trope doesn't get explained until halfway down the page. >.<

I think you should explain where the term Char Clone comes from in the first sentence just to get it out of the way and then you won't have to do much of anything to the rest.

Right, you have to explain that first, otherwise people won't know why they're being subjected to a paragraph summary of a character's plot arc across two TV series and a movie.

I retooled the description a bit: Char Clone. What do you think?

I think it's ready to roll.

Looks great to me.

Agreed. I approve.

I'm fine with it. Not sure about that "Real Life example", though.

Oh, yeah, the Real Life example is a Cosplay, not an Expy, so it's no good.

Looks good — a casual reader can leave at the end of paragraph one knowing what it means. But those who follow it through get the interesting details. I'd suggest turning the second paragraph into two.

It would be appropriate to move the big "Note: only list an example if the character is a deliberate Char clone." banner to an editor-only comment: most readers aren't editors.

edited 31st May '11 2:46:18 AM by Camacan

Done and done. We can go ahead and lock this thread.

Hello, I just would like to share my opinion. While some would say that this trope is too centered on Gundam, I have appreciated many characters from anime and other shows and even from other forms of medium that fall under this trope, inside Gundam and outside. I even like the current Real Life example. And because of that I believe that this has become a true trope even outside Gundam. But also because of that, I feel uncomfortable with the name "Char Clone," especially when I think of the characters and even the real life example that came before Char. I don't deny that Char, by being Char and by his becoming Quatro, have very much encompassed the roles of the kind of character this trope covers, from being the rival to the mentor, having his own agenda that makes him switch sides, and so on. In fact I myself believe that he has become the symbol of this trope. So I don't have any problems with the "Char" part. My real problem is the "Clone" part. For me it does not give honor to the examples. It gives me the feel of "copycat" or "rip-off" or "nothing more." It kinda dulls/undermines the examples for me. Sure, many of these examples were inspired by Char. But there were those that/who weren't. And for those that were inspired by Char aren't really flat cardboard Char Aznable cut-outs. So I have a suggestion; can we rename this with the (in)famous line, "He is a Char!" For me it recognizes how Char defined the trope, but it gives the examples a feeling of honor for being part of this trope. Also, the line would be fun and poetic, playing with The Reveal that usually comes with this character, whether it really was a big surprise to the audience or a confirmation of their suspicions while it was a shock to the characters in the story, or whether even the in-story characters already suspected and the reveal was just the confirmation for them. For me it's more fun to exclaim, especially in playful mock-surprise, "Gasp, this character! He is a Char!" than exclaiming "Hey, he's a Char Clone!" Anyway, I just thought I may be able to contribute by adding some more fun for this trope. Thanks very much for your time!

Wall... of... text...

That's not how renames work around here. Does anyone else have a reason not to lock this thread?

@ianpatph: You need to hit your Enter key twice between paragraphs, not once.