Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Changed line(s) 3 (click to see context) from:
** Arunis is an immortal, sociopathic, manipulative sorcerer who set most of the immediate plot (including the coming world war between superpower empires and the retrieval of an extremely dangerous ArtifactOfDoom) in motion to further his own ends. Those ends turn out to be arranging the destruction of the world as an offering to [[GodOfEvil the Night Gods]], so that they will be impressed enough to elevate him to godhood himself. In pursuit of this goal, he kills, tortures, and {{Mind Rape}}s his way across two continents, including sacrificing his own (few) loyal minions for short-term advantage, all without the slightest whiff of remorse. His in-universe [[TheDreaded reputation]] is well-earned. [[spoiler: He even manages to make trouble post-mortem, with his ghost mind raping one man to the point of completely destroying his personality while trying to possess him. Guy was an AssholeVictim, but ''still'']].
to:
** Arunis is an immortal, sociopathic, manipulative sorcerer who set most of the immediate plot (including the coming world war between superpower empires and the retrieval of an extremely dangerous ArtifactOfDoom) in motion to further his own ends. Those ends turn out to be arranging the destruction of the world as an offering to [[GodOfEvil the Night Gods]], so that they will be impressed enough to elevate him to godhood himself. In pursuit of this goal, he kills, tortures, and {{Mind Rape}}s his way across two continents, including sacrificing his own (few) loyal minions for short-term advantage, all without the slightest whiff of remorse. His in-universe [[TheDreaded reputation]] is well-earned. [[spoiler: He even manages to make trouble post-mortem, with his ghost mind raping one man to the point of completely destroying his personality while trying to possess him. Guy was an AssholeVictim, but ''still'']].him]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
removing an unapproved addition to a Magnificent Bastard write up
Deleted line(s) 5,6 (click to see context) :
* MagnificentBastard: Sandor Ott. However much you may think you've figured him out, he's always at least five steps ahead of you.
** Comes back to bite him later on, though- the Secret Fist was so dependent on his cunning and charisma to operate that when the Third Sea War comes and he's still away on ''Chathrand'' they completely fall apart.
** Comes back to bite him later on, though- the Secret Fist was so dependent on his cunning and charisma to operate that when the Third Sea War comes and he's still away on ''Chathrand'' they completely fall apart.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Badass is no longer a trope.
Changed line(s) 1 (click to see context) from:
* AntiClimaxBoss: After four books of build-up, [[spoiler: the Shaggat]] is dealt with summarily when [[spoiler: Neda snaps his neck with a well-placed kick while he's chained up but gloating]]. However, the fact that [[spoiler: she]] ''does'' kill the most feared and hated man in recent Mzithrini history so casually basically causes all the ''other'' Mzithrini to regard [[spoiler: her]] as a certified {{Badass}}.
to:
* AntiClimaxBoss: After four books of build-up, [[spoiler: the Shaggat]] is dealt with summarily when [[spoiler: Neda snaps his neck with a well-placed kick while he's chained up but gloating]]. However, the fact that [[spoiler: she]] ''does'' kill the most feared and hated man in recent Mzithrini history so casually basically causes all the ''other'' Mzithrini to regard [[spoiler: her]] as a certified {{Badass}}.badass.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
unfortunate implications need citations
Deleted line(s) 7 (click to see context) :
* UnfortunateImplications: Bolutu, the one black character in the first two books, [[spoiler:is not human at all, but a dlomu, an alien-looking creature with coal-black skin.]] Lessened by the fact that Bolutu is generally a very positive, intelligent, principled character [[spoiler: and is one of the ones who manages to survive the voyage ''and'' get a happy ending]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Changed line(s) 2 (click to see context) from:
* CompleteMonster: ''Literature/TheChathrandVoyages'' has mostly morally ambiguous conflict between basically decent people trying to do the right thing, [[WellIntentionedExtremist extremely ruthless people]] trying to do [[MyCountryRightOrWrong the right thing]], and bad people who [[FreudianExcuse are driven by deep-seated personal trauma]]. That said, there are two characters, [[SiblingRivalry brother and sister]] {{Evil Sorcerer}}s whom ''everyone'' else agrees are completely evil:
to:
* CompleteMonster: ''Literature/TheChathrandVoyages'' has mostly morally ambiguous conflict between basically decent people trying to do the right thing, [[WellIntentionedExtremist extremely ruthless people]] trying to do [[MyCountryRightOrWrong the right thing]], and bad people who [[FreudianExcuse are driven by deep-seated personal trauma]]. That said, there are two characters, [[SiblingRivalry brother and sister]] {{Evil Sorcerer}}s Sorcerer}}s, whom ''everyone'' else agrees are completely evil:
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Changed line(s) 2 (click to see context) from:
* CompleteMonster: ''Literature/TheChathrandVoyages'' has mostly morally ambiguous conflict between basically decent people trying to do the right thing, [[WellIntentionedExtremist extremely ruthless people]] trying to do [[MyCountryRightOrWrong the right thing]], and bad people who [[FreudianExcuse are driven by deep-seated personal trauma]]. That said, there are two characters ''everyone'' else agrees are completely evil:
to:
* CompleteMonster: ''Literature/TheChathrandVoyages'' has mostly morally ambiguous conflict between basically decent people trying to do the right thing, [[WellIntentionedExtremist extremely ruthless people]] trying to do [[MyCountryRightOrWrong the right thing]], and bad people who [[FreudianExcuse are driven by deep-seated personal trauma]]. That said, there are two characters characters, [[SiblingRivalry brother and sister]] {{Evil Sorcerer}}s whom ''everyone'' else agrees are completely evil:
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Changed line(s) 2,4 (click to see context) from:
* CompleteMonster: The Shaggat Ness. His goal is no less than the complete extermination of anyone who doesn't believe that he's a god. Plus he sets fire to his own sons while they sleep, until they refuse to wear anything but loose robes that can be removed in a hurry.
** Arunis is hardly better, claims of being a WellIntentionedExtremist aside. There's a ''reason'' he and the Shaggat got along. [[spoiler: And it's later revealed that the Shaggat was a harmless CloudCuckooLander before Arunis came along and convinced him he was a god, so all the Shaggat's crimes can be laid at Arunis' feet as well]].
** Macadra is so horrible that her own men are willing to desert in droves after being stuck on a ship with her for weeks on end. [[spoiler: Of course, she is Arunis' sister]].
** Arunis is hardly better, claims of being a WellIntentionedExtremist aside. There's a ''reason'' he and the Shaggat got along. [[spoiler: And it's later revealed that the Shaggat was a harmless CloudCuckooLander before Arunis came along and convinced him he was a god, so all the Shaggat's crimes can be laid at Arunis' feet as well]].
** Macadra is so horrible that her own men are willing to desert in droves after being stuck on a ship with her for weeks on end. [[spoiler: Of course, she is Arunis' sister]].
to:
* CompleteMonster: The Shaggat Ness. His goal is no less than CompleteMonster: ''Literature/TheChathrandVoyages'' has mostly morally ambiguous conflict between basically decent people trying to do the complete extermination of anyone right thing, [[WellIntentionedExtremist extremely ruthless people]] trying to do [[MyCountryRightOrWrong the right thing]], and bad people who doesn't believe that he's a god. Plus he sets fire to his own sons while they sleep, until they refuse to wear anything but loose robes that can be removed in a hurry.
[[FreudianExcuse are driven by deep-seated personal trauma]]. That said, there are two characters ''everyone'' else agrees are completely evil:
** Arunis ishardly better, claims an immortal, sociopathic, manipulative sorcerer who set most of being a WellIntentionedExtremist aside. There's a ''reason'' he the immediate plot (including the coming world war between superpower empires and the Shaggat got along. retrieval of an extremely dangerous ArtifactOfDoom) in motion to further his own ends. Those ends turn out to be arranging the destruction of the world as an offering to [[GodOfEvil the Night Gods]], so that they will be impressed enough to elevate him to godhood himself. In pursuit of this goal, he kills, tortures, and {{Mind Rape}}s his way across two continents, including sacrificing his own (few) loyal minions for short-term advantage, all without the slightest whiff of remorse. His in-universe [[TheDreaded reputation]] is well-earned. [[spoiler: And it's later revealed that He even manages to make trouble post-mortem, with his ghost mind raping one man to the Shaggat point of completely destroying his personality while trying to possess him. Guy was a harmless CloudCuckooLander before Arunis came along and convinced him he was a god, so all the Shaggat's crimes can be laid at Arunis' feet as well]].
an AssholeVictim, but ''still'']].
** Macadra is Arunis's rival, on-and-off co-conspirator, peer in age, power, and wickedness, and his sister. She wants the same ArtifactOfDoom he does, though she intends to conquer the world rather than destroy it. Her handiwork is mostly plainly visible in the fate of the Empire of Bali Adro, whose throne she subverted centuries ago, in the process turning it from a prosperous, enlightened society to a totalitarian hellhole (much to the horror of the time-displaced Bali Adrans traveling with the protagonists). Like her brother, she's TheDreaded and a BadBoss, and she drives her soldiers sohorrible hard in pursuit of the heroes across the last book that her own men are willing to desert they end up deserting in droves after being stuck on a ship with her for weeks on end. as soon as they have the opportunity. After Arunis [[spoiler: Of course, is killed]] at the end of the third book, she is Arunis' sister]].takes over as the most visible threat to the ''Chathrand'' and the world in the fourth and final volume.
** Arunis is
** Macadra is Arunis's rival, on-and-off co-conspirator, peer in age, power, and wickedness, and his sister. She wants the same ArtifactOfDoom he does, though she intends to conquer the world rather than destroy it. Her handiwork is mostly plainly visible in the fate of the Empire of Bali Adro, whose throne she subverted centuries ago, in the process turning it from a prosperous, enlightened society to a totalitarian hellhole (much to the horror of the time-displaced Bali Adrans traveling with the protagonists). Like her brother, she's TheDreaded and a BadBoss, and she drives her soldiers so
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
* AntiClimaxBoss: After four books of build-up, [[spoiler: the Shaggat]] is dealt with summarily when [[spoiler: Neda snaps his neck with a well-placed kick while he's chained up but gloating]]. However, the fact that [[spoiler: she]] ''does'' kill the most feared and hated man in recent Mzithrini history so casually basically causes all the ''other'' Mzithrini to regard [[spoiler: her]] as a certified {{Badass}}.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Changed line(s) 6 (click to see context) from:
* UnfortunateImplications: Bolutu, the one black character in the first two books, [[spoiler:is not human at all, but a dlomu, an alien-looking creature with coal-black skin.]]
to:
* UnfortunateImplications: Bolutu, the one black character in the first two books, [[spoiler:is not human at all, but a dlomu, an alien-looking creature with coal-black skin.]]]] Lessened by the fact that Bolutu is generally a very positive, intelligent, principled character [[spoiler: and is one of the ones who manages to survive the voyage ''and'' get a happy ending]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
* UnfortunateImplications: Bolutu, the one black character in the first two books, [[spoiler:is not human at all, but a dlomu, an alien-looking creature with coal-black skin.]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Changed line(s) 6 (click to see context) from:
* TheWoobie: Felthrup. However you feel about rats, you ''will'' want to give him a hug every time he appears.
to:
* TheWoobie: Felthrup. However you feel about rats, you ''will'' want to give him a hug every time he appears.appears.
** JerkassWoobie: Taliktrum can be pretty horrible, but it's hard not to feel sorry for him once it's plain how badly he's backed himself into a corner with his people and just wants to be free of the theatrical "prophet" character he's become trapped in. [[spoiler: He does manage to find redemption, thoguh]].
** JerkassWoobie: Taliktrum can be pretty horrible, but it's hard not to feel sorry for him once it's plain how badly he's backed himself into a corner with his people and just wants to be free of the theatrical "prophet" character he's become trapped in. [[spoiler: He does manage to find redemption, thoguh]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** Macadra is so horrible that her own men are willing to desert in droves after being stuck on a ship with her for weeks on end. [[spoiler: Of course, she is Arunis' sister]].
Added DiffLines:
** Comes back to bite him later on, though- the Secret Fist was so dependent on his cunning and charisma to operate that when the Third Sea War comes and he's still away on ''Chathrand'' they completely fall apart.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
* CompleteMonster: The Shaggat Ness. His goal is no less than the complete extermination of anyone who doesn't believe that he's a god. Plus he sets fire to his own sons while they sleep, until they refuse to wear anything but loose robes that can be removed in a hurry.
** Arunis is hardly better, claims of being a WellIntentionedExtremist aside. There's a ''reason'' he and the Shaggat got along. [[spoiler: And it's later revealed that the Shaggat was a harmless CloudCuckooLander before Arunis came along and convinced him he was a god, so all the Shaggat's crimes can be laid at Arunis' feet as well]].
* MagnificentBastard: Sandor Ott. However much you may think you've figured him out, he's always at least five steps ahead of you.
* TheWoobie: Felthrup. However you feel about rats, you ''will'' want to give him a hug every time he appears.
** Arunis is hardly better, claims of being a WellIntentionedExtremist aside. There's a ''reason'' he and the Shaggat got along. [[spoiler: And it's later revealed that the Shaggat was a harmless CloudCuckooLander before Arunis came along and convinced him he was a god, so all the Shaggat's crimes can be laid at Arunis' feet as well]].
* MagnificentBastard: Sandor Ott. However much you may think you've figured him out, he's always at least five steps ahead of you.
* TheWoobie: Felthrup. However you feel about rats, you ''will'' want to give him a hug every time he appears.
