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--> '''Skrull:''' The reason we knew you could be switched for one of us... is that of all the people in the world... we discovered that no one on this entire planet cares enough about you to notice you at all. And of all the things that went wrong with our invasion... that was the one thing we were absolutely right about.
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* AuthorsSavingThrow: The first issue of Spider-Woman took care of the UnfortunateImplications of her possibly crimefighting while pregnant: while she does TRY to, she does so only with special tech Carol gave her to protect the baby, and is talked out of that for her and the child's saftey early into a pregnancy.
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* OlderThanTheyThink: Most of the people who complain about changing her suit tend to cite the fact she's only ever had one costume and so it makes no sense to change it. This is true...in that its her only ''superhero'' outfit; as she spent time as a non-costumed crime fighter, in fact almost half her existence of her character's existence was as one (with exception of one single return, she spent ''17'' years in RealLife without a costume, starting 11 years into her existence, and only returned to a costume in 2005 (and even there, technically it was a Skrull in her place for the first four years)). Similar to the '[[ComicBook/MsMarvel Carol Danvers shouldn't use the codename Captain Marvel because she was Ms Marvel for decades' criticism[[note]]hint, not the case, as she went by Binary and later Warbird for most of her existence[[/note]], these seem to be a case of fans who only know of their original and recent adventures, and not the stuff in between.

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* OlderThanTheyThink: Most of the people who complain about changing her suit tend to cite the fact she's only ever had one costume and so it makes no sense to change it. This is true...in that its her only ''superhero'' outfit; as she spent time as a non-costumed crime fighter, in fact almost half her existence of her character's existence was as one (with exception of one single return, she spent ''17'' years in RealLife without a costume, starting 11 years into her existence, and only returned to a costume in 2005 (and even there, technically it was a Skrull in her place for the first four years)). Similar to the '[[ComicBook/MsMarvel criticism that [[ComicBook/MsMarvel Carol Danvers Danvers]] shouldn't use the codename Captain Marvel because she was Ms Ms. Marvel for decades' criticism[[note]]hint, not decades[[note]]not the case, as she went by Binary and later Warbird for most of her existence[[/note]], these seem to complaints might be a case of from fans who only know of their original and recent adventures, and not the stuff in between.
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* OlderThanTheyThink: Most of the people who complain about changing her suit tend to cite the fact she's only ever had one costume and so it makes no sense to change it. This is true...in that its her only ''superhero'' outfit; as she spent time as a non-costumed crime fighter, in fact almost half her existence of her character's existence was as one (with exception of one single return, she spent ''17'' years in RealLife without a costume, starting 11 years into her existence, and only returned to a costume in 2005 (and even there, technically it was a Skrull in her place for the first four years)). Similar to the '[[MsMarvel Carol Danvers shouldn't use the codename Captain Marvel because she was Ms Marvel for decades' criticism[[note]]hint, not the case, as she went by Binary and later Warbird for most of her existence[[/note]], these seem to be a case of fans who only know of their original and recent adventures, and not the stuff in between.

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* OlderThanTheyThink: Most of the people who complain about changing her suit tend to cite the fact she's only ever had one costume and so it makes no sense to change it. This is true...in that its her only ''superhero'' outfit; as she spent time as a non-costumed crime fighter, in fact almost half her existence of her character's existence was as one (with exception of one single return, she spent ''17'' years in RealLife without a costume, starting 11 years into her existence, and only returned to a costume in 2005 (and even there, technically it was a Skrull in her place for the first four years)). Similar to the '[[MsMarvel '[[ComicBook/MsMarvel Carol Danvers shouldn't use the codename Captain Marvel because she was Ms Marvel for decades' criticism[[note]]hint, not the case, as she went by Binary and later Warbird for most of her existence[[/note]], these seem to be a case of fans who only know of their original and recent adventures, and not the stuff in between.

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Combined two Broken Base comments into one entry with both views.


* WTHCostumingDepartment: Pretty much everyone agrees that Jessica's old costume looked [[http://www.writeups.org/img/fiche/1811.jpg absolutely ridiculous]]. Thankfully for her new ongoing Marvel decided to give her [[http://i1.cdnds.net/14/51/618x435/comics-spider-woman-02.jpg a new costume]] that's frequently described by fans as "something an actual human being would wear".
** [[BrokenBase Of course,]] some argue this for the new suit, feeling that while the new outfit looks good, it doesn't really fit a superhero.
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* WTHCostumingDepartment: Pretty much everyone agrees that Jessica's old costume looked Some say this in regards to the [[http://www.writeups.org/img/fiche/1811.jpg absolutely ridiculous]]. Thankfully for her new ongoing Marvel decided to give her old suit]], saying it looks ridiculous while [[BrokenBase others]] say this about [[http://i1.cdnds.net/14/51/618x435/comics-spider-woman-02.jpg a new costume]] that's frequently described by fans as "something an actual human being would wear".
** [[BrokenBase Of course,]] some argue this for
the new suit, feeling that while the new outfit looks good, costume]], saying it doesn't really fit a superhero.
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superhero.
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* OlderThanTheyThink: Most of the people who complain about changing her suit tend to cite the fact she's only ever had one costume and so it makes no sense to change it. This is true...in that its her only ''superhero'' outfit; as she spent time as a non-costumed crime fighter, in fact almost half her existence of her character's existence was as one (with exception of one single return, she spent ''17'' years in RealLife without a costume, starting 11 years into her existence, and only returned to a costume in 2005 (and even there, technically it was a Skrull in her place for the first four years)). Similar to the '[[MsMarvel Carol Danvers shouldn't use the codename Captain Marvel because she was Ms Marvel for decades' criticism[[note]]hint, not the case, as she went by Binary and later Warbird for most of her existence[[/note]], these seem to be a case of fans who only know of their original and recent adventures, and not the stuff in between.
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Personally I don\'t see how the old outfit is any more ridiculous than Spider-Man or Wolverine\'s.

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** [[BrokenBase Of course,]] some argue this for the new suit, feeling that while the new outfit looks good, it doesn't really fit a superhero.
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** Archenemy Morgan le Fay consistently attempts to possess Jessica's body. She claims said body is a battery of Elder God Chthon's magical energies. Morgan also later goes after Scarlet Witch for the same reason. No particular interest yet in Quicksilver who is also infected with said magics but is male. Though these days, Morgan seems to have a thing for SelfDemonstrating/DoctorDoom.

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** Archenemy Morgan le Fay consistently attempts to possess Jessica's body. She claims said body is a battery of Elder God Chthon's magical energies. Morgan also later goes after Scarlet Witch for the same reason. No particular interest yet in Quicksilver who is also infected with said magics but is male. Though these days, Morgan seems to have a thing for SelfDemonstrating/DoctorDoom.Doctor Doom.

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not ymmv


* FanDisservice: Applies regardless of one's opinion of the new costume introduced in 2015: it eliminates the sexy aspect previously in place (i.e. the fanservice), which is welcomed by some readers, and not by others.

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* TheyChangedItSoItSucks: There's a segment of fans who ''hate'' the new costume and accuse it of this; complaints include it looking too much like either [[ComicBook/{{Batgirl 2011}} Batgirl's new costume]], ComicBook/{{Mockingbird}}, or [[ComicBook/{{Hawkeye}} Kate Bishop]] rather than Jess, and the weird narmy mask!glasses. There's also fans that just think the old costume was a classic and shouldn't have been messed with. See Broken Base, above.



** TheyChangedItSoItSucks: That said there's a segment of fans who ''hate'' the new costume and accuse it of this; complaints include it looking too much like either [[{{Batgirl 2011}} Batgirl's new costume]], ComicBook/{{Mockingbird}}, or [[ComicBook/{{Hawkeye}} Kate Bishop]] rather than Jess, and the weird narmy mask!glasses. There's also fans that just think the old costume was a classic and shouldn't have been messed with. See Broken Base, above.
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* WinBackTheCrowd: When first unvailed, Jess's current ongoing earned a lot of criticism due to the creative team attached (Dennis Hopeless, known mostly for ''AvengersArena'' and its sequel, and Greg Land, known mostly for tracing porn) and a variant cover for the first issue drawn by Milo Manara that many felt was so over-sexualized it crossed into misogyny and FanDisservice, resulting in a number of fans, particularly female and/or feminist fans, to complain. Than preview for issue 5 came out, revealing Jess would get a new, better artist and a new, practical costume, and that Greg Land and the first four issues were just a tie-in to ''Spider-Verse'' that the creators had to get out of the way. Suffice to say, many who'd complained now praise what happened with the book, even if they still think the launch was handled terribly.

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* WinBackTheCrowd: When first unvailed, Jess's current ongoing earned a lot of criticism due to the creative team attached (Dennis Hopeless, known mostly for ''AvengersArena'' ''ComicBook/AvengersArena'' and its sequel, and Greg Land, known mostly for tracing porn) and a variant cover for the first issue drawn by Milo Manara that many felt was so over-sexualized it crossed into misogyny and FanDisservice, resulting in a number of fans, particularly female and/or feminist fans, to complain. Than preview for issue 5 came out, revealing Jess would get a new, better artist and a new, practical costume, and that Greg Land and the first four issues were just a tie-in to ''Spider-Verse'' that the creators had to get out of the way. Suffice to say, many who'd complained now praise what happened with the book, even if they still think the launch was handled terribly.

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* FanDisservice: Applies regardless of one's opinion of the new costume introduced in 2015: it eliminates the sexy aspect previously in place (i.e. the fanservice), which is welcomed by some readers, and not by others.



** TheyChangedItSoItSucks: That said there's a segment of fans who ''hate'' the new costume and accuse it of this; complaints include it looking too much like either [[{{Batgirl 2011}} Batgirl's new costume]], ComicBook/{{Mockingbird}}, or [[ComicBook/{{Hawkeye}} Kate Bishop]] rather than Jess, and the weird narmy mask!glasses. There's also fans that just think the old costume was a classic and shouldn't have been messed with.

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** TheyChangedItSoItSucks: That said there's a segment of fans who ''hate'' the new costume and accuse it of this; complaints include it looking too much like either [[{{Batgirl 2011}} Batgirl's new costume]], ComicBook/{{Mockingbird}}, or [[ComicBook/{{Hawkeye}} Kate Bishop]] rather than Jess, and the weird narmy mask!glasses. There's also fans that just think the old costume was a classic and shouldn't have been messed with. See Broken Base, above.
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** Jess' upcoming pregnancy. A single mother superhero ''is'' a fun and interesting idea, but the cover art implies that [[WhatAnIdiot she'll still be superheroing while heavily pregnant]] and many feel they could have just brought back Julia, who is already a single mother with spider powers, for the idea.
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Hate Dumb is not to be used on work pages


* HateDumb: The people complaining about Jessica's new costume. Lets just say it's really hard to be critical of her book for any other reason, like thinking Dennis Hopeless is a horrible writer, without fear of being put into one bag with these people.
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* HateDumb: The people complaining about Jessica's new costume. Lets just say it's really hard to be critical of her book for any other reason, like thinking Dennis Hopeless is a horrible writer, without fear of being put into one bag with these people.
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* WinBackTheCrowd: When first unvailed, Jess's current ongoing earned a lot of criticism due to the creative team attached (Dennis Hopeless, known mostly for ''AvengersArena'' and its sequel, and Greg Land, known mostly for tracing porn) and a variant cover for the first issue drawn by Milo Manara that many felt was so over-sexualized it crossed into misogyny and FanDiservice, resulting in a number of fans, particularly female and/or feminist fans, to complain. Than preview for issue 5 came out, revealing Jess would get a new, better artist and a new, practical costume, and that Greg Land and the first four issues were just a tie-in to ''Spider-Verse'' that the creators had to get out of the way. Suffice to say, many who'd complained now praise what happened with the book, even if they still think the launch was handled terribly.

to:

* WinBackTheCrowd: When first unvailed, Jess's current ongoing earned a lot of criticism due to the creative team attached (Dennis Hopeless, known mostly for ''AvengersArena'' and its sequel, and Greg Land, known mostly for tracing porn) and a variant cover for the first issue drawn by Milo Manara that many felt was so over-sexualized it crossed into misogyny and FanDiservice, FanDisservice, resulting in a number of fans, particularly female and/or feminist fans, to complain. Than preview for issue 5 came out, revealing Jess would get a new, better artist and a new, practical costume, and that Greg Land and the first four issues were just a tie-in to ''Spider-Verse'' that the creators had to get out of the way. Suffice to say, many who'd complained now praise what happened with the book, even if they still think the launch was handled terribly.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* WinBackTheCrowd: When first unvailed, Jess's current ongoing earned a lot of criticism due to the creative team attached (Dennis Hopeless, known mostly for ''AvengersArena'' and its sequel, and Greg Land, known mostly for tracing porn) and a variant cover for the first issue drawn by Milo Manara that many felt was so over-sexualized it crossed into misogyny and FanDiservice, resulting in a number of fans, particularly female and/or feminist fans, to complain. Than preview for issue 5 came out, revealing Jess would get a new, better artist and a new, practical costume, and that Greg Land and the first four issues were just a tie-in to ''Spider-Verse'' that the creators had to get out of the way. Suffice to say, many who'd complained now praise what happened with the book, even if they still think the launch was handled terribly.
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* [[HoYay Les Yay]]: Jessica herself has a lot of this with her partner Lindsay. However, she later saved Carol Danvers/Ms. Marvel after being drained by [[ComicBook/XMen Rogue]], which was the beginning of their "friendship", later culminating in Carol hugging the real Jessica in relief after the latter got out of the Skrull ship.

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* [[HoYay Les Yay]]: Jessica herself has a lot of this with her partner Lindsay. However, she later saved Carol Danvers/Ms. Marvel after being drained by [[ComicBook/XMen Rogue]], ComicBook/{{Rogue}}, which was the beginning of their "friendship", later culminating in Carol hugging the real Jessica in relief after the latter got out of the Skrull ship.
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Holy crap, I just realized that isn\'t even remotely the same trope, and is just Creator Bashing.


* [[WTHCastingAgency WTH, Marvel Editorial?]]: The general reaction to giving Jessica's 2014 ongoing to Dennis Hopeless (who's fairly unpopular amongst some Marvel fans after ''ComicBook/AvengersArena'' and ''ComicBook/AvengersUndercover'') and Greg Land (infamously accused multiple times of tracing from pornography). Especially since Creator/KellySueDeConnick of [[ComicBook/MsMarvel Captain Marvel]] fame expressed interest in writing it. That said pretty much everyone is happy that Jessica is getting a new costume that actually looks halfway sensible.
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LOL gained a reputation where? 4chan? Tumblr? Don\'t just throw that out there.


* [[WTHCastingAgency WTH, Marvel Editorial?]]: The general reaction to giving Jessica's 2014 ongoing to Dennis Hopeless (who's fairly unpopular amongst many Marvel fans after ''ComicBook/AvengersArena'' and ''ComicBook/AvengersUndercover'' and has gained a reputation of being a misogynist, [[FlameBait whether he deserved it or not]]) and Greg Land (infamously accused multiple times of tracing from pornography). Especially since Creator/KellySueDeConnick of [[ComicBook/MsMarvel Captain Marvel]] fame expressed interest in writing it. That said pretty much everyone is happy that Jessica is getting a new costume that actually looks halfway sensible.

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* [[WTHCastingAgency WTH, Marvel Editorial?]]: The general reaction to giving Jessica's 2014 ongoing to Dennis Hopeless (who's fairly unpopular amongst many some Marvel fans after ''ComicBook/AvengersArena'' and ''ComicBook/AvengersUndercover'' and has gained a reputation of being a misogynist, [[FlameBait whether he deserved it or not]]) ''ComicBook/AvengersUndercover'') and Greg Land (infamously accused multiple times of tracing from pornography). Especially since Creator/KellySueDeConnick of [[ComicBook/MsMarvel Captain Marvel]] fame expressed interest in writing it. That said pretty much everyone is happy that Jessica is getting a new costume that actually looks halfway sensible.

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** Arana as well, if only because of [[spoiler: her father dying]].



** TheyChangedItSoItSucks: There's actually a large (or at least, [[VocalMinority loud]]) segment of fans who ''hate'' the new costume and accuse it of this; largely the more rational complaints about it looking too much like either [[{{Batgirl 2011}} Batgirl's new costume]], ComicBook/{{Mockingbird}}, or [[ComicBook/{{Hawkeye}} Kate Bishop]] rather than Jess, and the weird narmy mask!glasses, but there's also some criticisms that can get fairly misogynistic in their nature or just generally irrational, often with praise on how 'classic' the old costume was.

to:

** TheyChangedItSoItSucks: There's actually That said there's a large (or at least, [[VocalMinority loud]]) segment of fans who ''hate'' the new costume and accuse it of this; largely the more rational complaints about include it looking too much like either [[{{Batgirl 2011}} Batgirl's new costume]], ComicBook/{{Mockingbird}}, or [[ComicBook/{{Hawkeye}} Kate Bishop]] rather than Jess, and the weird narmy mask!glasses, but there's mask!glasses. There's also some criticisms fans that can get fairly misogynistic in their nature or just generally irrational, often with praise on how 'classic' think the old costume was.was a classic and shouldn't have been messed with.
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* BrokenBase:
** As noted bellow, there's a notable split between people's thoughts on her new costume; its either a welcomed change that perfectly fits the new direction her character is going in, or a dull, unsexy and pointless change that doesn't fit her character at all.
** Similarly, and in contrast, her ''old'' suit has a similar split on views; either its an ugly and dull outfit that was in need of an update and the frequent [[PaintedOnPants body paint-looking design]] would lead to FetishRetardant whenever a bad artist got ahold of her (which has happened frequently), or its a classic, simple outfit that could perfectly balance sexiness and creepiness when needed, and just didn't need changing.
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** TheyChangedItSoItSucks: There's actually a large (or at least, [[VocalMinority loud]]) segment of fans who ''hate'' the new costume and accuse it of this; largely the more rational complaints about it looking too much like either [[{{Batgirl 2011}} Batgirl's new costume]], ComicBook/{{Mockingbird}}, or [[ComicBook/{{Hawkeye}} Kate Bishop]] rather than Jess, and the weird narmy mask!glasses, but there's also some criticisms that can get fairly misogynistic in their nature or just generally irrational, often with praise on how 'classic' the old costume was.

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* [[WTHCastingAgency WTH, Marvel Editorial?]]: In some corners of internet it's popular reaction to giving Jessica 2014 ongoing, especially after Creator/KellySueDeConnick of [[ComicBook/MsMarvel Captain Marvel]] fame expressed interest in writing it, to Dennis Hopeless (who, after people on internet started pointing out UnfortunateImplications in ''Avengers Arena'' and ''Avengers Undercover'', [[FlameBait whenever he deserved it or not]], gained, [[NeverLiveItDown reputation]] of a misogynist) and Greg Land (infamously accused multiple times of tracing from pornography).

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* [[WTHCastingAgency WTH, Marvel Editorial?]]: In some corners of internet it's popular The general reaction to giving Jessica Jessica's 2014 ongoing, especially ongoing to Dennis Hopeless (who's fairly unpopular amongst many Marvel fans after ''ComicBook/AvengersArena'' and ''ComicBook/AvengersUndercover'' and has gained a reputation of being a misogynist, [[FlameBait whether he deserved it or not]]) and Greg Land (infamously accused multiple times of tracing from pornography). Especially since Creator/KellySueDeConnick of [[ComicBook/MsMarvel Captain Marvel]] fame expressed interest in writing it, it. That said pretty much everyone is happy that Jessica is getting a new costume that actually looks halfway sensible.
* WTHCostumingDepartment: Pretty much everyone agrees that Jessica's old costume looked [[http://www.writeups.org/img/fiche/1811.jpg absolutely ridiculous]]. Thankfully for her new ongoing Marvel decided
to Dennis Hopeless (who, after people on internet started pointing out UnfortunateImplications in ''Avengers Arena'' and ''Avengers Undercover'', [[FlameBait whenever he deserved it or not]], gained, [[NeverLiveItDown reputation]] of give her [[http://i1.cdnds.net/14/51/618x435/comics-spider-woman-02.jpg a misogynist) and Greg Land (infamously accused multiple times of tracing from pornography).new costume]] that's frequently described by fans as "something an actual human being would wear".
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this is \"fan\" nickname and hatedom is Flame Bait


* FanNickname: More like "hater nickname", but creative team of Jessica's 2014 series got nicknamed "Hopeless Land". According to their combined [[{{Hatedom}} Hatedoms]] this is where this book is going, both quality and sales-wise.

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* FanNickname: More like "hater nickname", but creative team of Jessica's 2014 series got nicknamed "Hopeless Land". According to their combined [[{{Hatedom}} Hatedoms]] this is where this book is going, both quality and sales-wise.




to:

* [[WTHCastingAgency WTH, Marvel Editorial?]]: In some corners of internet it's popular reaction to giving Jessica 2014 ongoing, especially after Creator/KellySueDeConnick of [[ComicBook/MsMarvel Captain Marvel]] fame expressed interest in writing it, to Dennis Hopeless (who, after people on internet started pointing out UnfortunateImplications in ''Avengers Arena'' and ''Avengers Undercover'', [[FlameBait whenever he deserved it or not]], gained, [[NeverLiveItDown reputation]] of a misogynist) and Greg Land (infamously accused multiple times of tracing from pornography).
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added example

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*** There was also Nekra Sinclair, who wanted to kill Jessica because she stirred up funny feelings...
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* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: After Clint cheated on Jessica, some people lost sympathy for her when she slapped him twice and tried for a third. It doesn't help that he clearly had no idea they were serious or exclusive (given she's referred to as his 'friend-girl' rather than girlfriend) or that she has super strength while he's not, meaning those slaps would have been like being hit by

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* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: After Clint cheated on Jessica, some people lost sympathy for her when she slapped him twice and tried for a third. It doesn't help that he clearly had no idea they were serious or exclusive (given she's referred to as his 'friend-girl' rather than girlfriend) or that she has super strength while he's not, meaning those slaps would have been like being hit by a truck.
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* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: After Clint cheated on Jessica, some people lost sympathy for her when she slapped him twice and tried for a third.

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* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: After Clint cheated on Jessica, some people lost sympathy for her when she slapped him twice and tried for a third. It doesn't help that he clearly had no idea they were serious or exclusive (given she's referred to as his 'friend-girl' rather than girlfriend) or that she has super strength while he's not, meaning those slaps would have been like being hit by
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Moving to un-hyphenated title.

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* FoeYay:
** Archenemy Morgan le Fay consistently attempts to possess Jessica's body. She claims said body is a battery of Elder God Chthon's magical energies. Morgan also later goes after Scarlet Witch for the same reason. No particular interest yet in Quicksilver who is also infected with said magics but is male. Though these days, Morgan seems to have a thing for SelfDemonstrating/DoctorDoom.
** The relationship between Jessica and Gypsy Moth, a lady villain, is also a bit peculiar. In ''Spider-Woman'' vol. 1 #10, 48, 50, Jessica always tries to befriend the mutant because of their perceived similarities. On the other hand, the Moth's main power is to psychokinetically manipulate fibers. Her favorite moves are either stripping opponents of their clothing or binding them in it. Guess how this looks in battles against Jessica. Worth noting that Gypsy Moth is confirmed [[BiTheWay as being bisexual]] by WordOfGod. That would seem to say a lot about the FoeYay between her and Spider-Woman.
* [[HoYay Les Yay]]: Jessica herself has a lot of this with her partner Lindsay. However, she later saved Carol Danvers/Ms. Marvel after being drained by [[ComicBook/XMen Rogue]], which was the beginning of their "friendship", later culminating in Carol hugging the real Jessica in relief after the latter got out of the Skrull ship.
* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: After Clint cheated on Jessica, some people lost sympathy for her when she slapped him twice and tried for a third.
* TheWoobie: Jessica was captured and impersonated by the Skrull Queen for two years, and when she's rescued, she's hated. And that's not even after getting into her DarkAndTroubledPast. Poor woman.

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