Follow TV Tropes

Following

History YMMV / Arrowverse

Go To



* MisBlamed: Of the "Creator is


* MisBlamed: Of the "Creator is God" variety; while Marc Guggenheim's reputation for incompetence and AdaptationDecay is ''completely'' warranted, Andrew Kreisberg still tends to get far less criticism, even after his firing for sexual harassment. Though ''Arrow'' suffered a major SeasonalRot when Kreisberg left Guggenheim in charge, and ''The Flash'' was the MorePopularSpinoff in it's first season, it's strangely been left unacknowledged that ''Flash'' then went through SeasonalRot itself after the first season, and he was directly responsible for Iris' lack of character direction, Caitlin's inconsistent transformation into Killer Frost, and the mistreatment and mishandling of Wally West and the other speedsters. It's also ignored that, despite being VindicatedByHistory in comparison to Guggenheim's run, the first two seasons of ''Arrow'' were loaded with [[FranchiseOriginalSin their own fair share of problems]], such as Laurel's AdaptationalWimp and her and Thea's shared status as DamselScrappy, the RomanticPlotTumor, Felicity's lack of CharacterDevelopment and depth, and ''lots'' of Narm. Much of the Arrowverse's FlameBait status comes equally from Kreisberg's work, yet his name is rarely brought up outside of the sex scandal while all ire is aimed at Guggenheim.

to:

* MisBlamed: Of the "Creator is God" variety; while Marc Guggenheim's reputation for incompetence and AdaptationDecay is ''completely'' warranted, Andrew Kreisberg still tends to get far less criticism, even after his firing for sexual harassment. Though ''Arrow'' suffered a major SeasonalRot when Kreisberg left Guggenheim in charge, and ''The Flash'' was the MorePopularSpinoff in it's first season, it's strangely been left unacknowledged that ''Flash'' then went through SeasonalRot itself after the first season, and he was directly responsible for Iris' lack of character direction, Caitlin's inconsistent transformation into Killer Frost, and the mistreatment and mishandling of Wally West and the other speedsters. It's also ignored that, despite being VindicatedByHistory in comparison to Guggenheim's run, the first two seasons of ''Arrow'' were loaded with [[FranchiseOriginalSin their own fair share of problems]], such as Laurel's AdaptationalWimp and her and Thea's shared status as DamselScrappy, the RomanticPlotTumor, Felicity's lack of CharacterDevelopment and depth, and ''lots'' of Narm. Much of the Arrowverse's FlameBait status comes equally from Kreisberg's work, yet his name is rarely brought up outside of the sex scandal while all ire is aimed at Guggenheim.


* {{Supercouple}}: Barry and Iris have become this for the entirety of the Arrowverse, for many reasons. Most importantly, the popularity they have with both the fandom and critics, supported in large part by the strong chemistry Grant and Candice share. Also unlike some other couples on tv, the writers take great pains to ensure that the two sidestep or hurdle over pitfalls that usually [[RomanticPlotTumor stagnate other couples]] having the two face, aside from supervillains and issues as part of a superhero team, very real life problems head on and overcoming them together, simply by relying on one another. It came to a front that their long teased and heavily built up wedding became the focal point and catalyst of ''Series/CrisisOnEarthX''. Not to mention the fact that the two had been best friends all their lives, the heavy elements of destiny in play when it comes to their relationship and in-universe recognition as one of the Arrowverse's greatest love stories. What else can be said of a romance that has spanned multiple earths, at least three timelines and withstood death itself, supercouple indeed.

to:

* {{Supercouple}}: Barry and Iris have become this for the entirety of the Arrowverse, for many reasons. Most importantly, the popularity they have with both the fandom and critics, supported in large part by the strong chemistry Grant and Candice share. Also unlike some other couples on tv, the writers take great pains to ensure that the two sidestep or hurdle over pitfalls that usually [[RomanticPlotTumor stagnate other couples]] having the two face, aside from supervillains and issues as part of a superhero team, very real life problems head on and overcoming them together, simply by relying on one another. It came to a front that their long teased and heavily built up wedding became the focal point and catalyst of ''Series/CrisisOnEarthX''. Not to mention the fact that the two had been best friends all their lives, the heavy elements of destiny in play when it comes to their relationship and in-universe recognition as one of the Arrowverse's greatest love stories. What else can be said of a romance that has spanned multiple earths, at least three timelines and withstood death itself, supercouple indeed. This was taken UpToEleven after Crisis on Infinite Earths, with Barry's status as the Paragon of Love and Iris serving as his lightning rod in the Speed Force, meaning their love is literally a universal force in the Arrowverse.

Added DiffLines:

* MisBlamed: Of the "Creator is God" variety; while Marc Guggenheim's reputation for incompetence and AdaptationDecay is ''completely'' warranted, Andrew Kreisberg still tends to get far less criticism, even after his firing for sexual harassment. Though ''Arrow'' suffered a major SeasonalRot when Kreisberg left Guggenheim in charge, and ''The Flash'' was the MorePopularSpinoff in it's first season, it's strangely been left unacknowledged that ''Flash'' then went through SeasonalRot itself after the first season, and he was directly responsible for Iris' lack of character direction, Caitlin's inconsistent transformation into Killer Frost, and the mistreatment and mishandling of Wally West and the other speedsters. It's also ignored that, despite being VindicatedByHistory in comparison to Guggenheim's run, the first two seasons of ''Arrow'' were loaded with [[FranchiseOriginalSin their own fair share of problems]], such as Laurel's AdaptationalWimp and her and Thea's shared status as DamselScrappy, the RomanticPlotTumor, Felicity's lack of CharacterDevelopment and depth, and ''lots'' of Narm. Much of the Arrowverse's FlameBait status comes equally from Kreisberg's work, yet his name is rarely brought up outside of the sex scandal while all ire is aimed at Guggenheim.

Added DiffLines:

!!Arrowverse Shows With Their Own Pages:

* ''[[YMMV/{{Arrow}} Arrow]]''
* ''[[YMMV/TheFlash2014 The Flash]]''
* ''[[YMMV/{{Constantine}} Constantine]]''
* ''[[YMMV/{{Vixen}} Vixen]]''
* ''[[YMMV/Supergirl2015 Supergirl]]''
* ''[[YMMV/LegendsOfTomorrow Legends of Tomorrow]]''
* ''[[YMMV/FreedomFightersTheRay Freedom Fighters: The Ray]]''
* ''[[YMMV/BlackLightning2018 Black Lightning]]''
* ''[[YMMV/Batwoman2019 Batwoman]]''

----


** Season 4 of ''The Flash'' is seen as the low point of this series. To compensate for the [[SoOkayItsAverage mediocre reception of Season 3]], Todd Helbing sought to bring the comedic tone back, but fans were not pleased with the result since it was more of a juvenile DenserAndWackier tone rather than a balance between drama and humor. Other points of contention were lazy, inconsistent writing, characters lacking lives outside of S.T.A.R. Labs, Ralph Dibny becoming a SpotlightStealingSquad with an [[YoYoPlotPoint inconsistent character development]], and ''countless'' IdiotBall moments to help prop up the villain as the smartest man alive. While there are debates over whether or not this season is worse than Season 3, it is certainly a case of SeasonalRot when compared to Seasons 1 and 2.

to:

** Season 4 of ''The Flash'' is seen as the low point of this series. To compensate for the [[SoOkayItsAverage mediocre reception of Season 3]], Andrew Kreisburg & Todd Helbing sought to bring the comedic tone back, but fans were not pleased with the result since it was more of a juvenile DenserAndWackier tone rather than a balance between drama and humor. Other points of contention were lazy, inconsistent writing, characters lacking lives outside of S.T.A.R. Labs, Ralph Dibny becoming a SpotlightStealingSquad with an [[YoYoPlotPoint inconsistent character development]], and ''countless'' IdiotBall moments to help prop up the villain as the smartest man alive. While there are debates over whether or not this season is worse than Season 3, it is certainly a case of SeasonalRot when compared to Seasons 1 and 2.


** Just watch Firestorm excitedly ramble on about time travel and alternate universe. He even nicknames a super villain, much to Cisco's approval. When Rip and some of his teammates were captured by Time Pirates, he gleefully takes on the role of "Space Ranger", a comic that he loved as a child.

to:

** Just watch Firestorm Martin Stein excitedly ramble on about time travel and alternate universe. He even nicknames a super villain, much to Cisco's approval. When Rip and some of his teammates were captured by Time Pirates, he gleefully takes on the role of "Space Ranger", a comic that he loved as a child.


** The Crisis events have fans who are pretty pissed about how they drag in entire worlds form past DC installments to be killed off just to raise the stakes.

to:

** The Crisis events have fans who are pretty pissed about how they drag in entire worlds form from past DC installments to be killed off just to raise the stakes.


* FanPreferredCouple:
** Although shipping can get serious the one couple everyone seems to be behind is Cisco and Laurel. Not only do they have similar powers, but there was genuine chemistry between them when they first met.
** [=SuperArrow=], aka Oliver Queen/Kara Danvers. It initially started out a meme, as a joke ship people supported in response to their widely hated official ships on their respective show. Then came ''Series/CrisisOnEarthX'', where it became an AscendedMeme when it turned out that their Earth-X counterparts were married. Oliver-X and Kara-X had more chemistry than Olicity and Karamel ever did, and after the infamous ending to the aforementioned crossover, people started shipping [=SuperArrow=] ''seriously''.
** Inverted in the case of Olicity. Olicity in general got hit with such a powerful degree of AbandonShipping that the fans eventually stopped caring about who Oliver ended up with, as long as it was anyone ''but'' Felicity. Ultimately, the writers of ''Arrow'' weren't willing to go back on the pairing after pouring so much time into it, so after Guggenheim and Mericle were given pink slips, they settled for trying to redeem the pairing as much as they could so it would at least be tolerated when it became the endgame ship.


** Superman's suit in ''Series/{{Supergirl 2015}} was controversial due to looking too plastic, having metallic connectors for the cape, and making Superman look weak. The suit for ''Superman & Lois'' was remodelled to have better detail, use less leather, look more muscular and no longer have the metallic connectors for the cape. When it was shown in promotional pictures, fan reception was overwhelmingly positive, with the only major complaint being the Superman logo being too small.

to:

** Superman's suit in ''Series/{{Supergirl 2015}} 2015}}'' was controversial due to looking too plastic, having metallic connectors for the cape, and making Superman look weak. The suit for ''Superman & Lois'' was remodelled to have better detail, use less leather, look more muscular and no longer have the metallic connectors for the cape. When it was shown in promotional pictures, fan reception was overwhelmingly positive, with the only major complaint being the Superman logo being too small.



** Laurel Lance worked up from TheScrappy in earlier seasons to gaining more fans after becoming the Black Canary, however a fair portion of the fanbase was frustrated with her becoming an InstantExpert compared to the rest of the character's training (going from first outing to mask in barely half a season) and general recklessness endangering Team Arrow (jumping into conflicts in Season 3 and reviving Sara in Season 4). Despite becoming more sympathetic she was killed off at the end of Season 4 because Mark Guggenheim didn't want even a chance of Laurel and Oliver getting together.

to:

** Laurel Lance worked up from TheScrappy in earlier seasons to gaining more fans after becoming the Black Canary, however a fair portion of the fanbase was frustrated with her becoming an InstantExpert compared to the rest of the character's training (going from first outing to mask in barely half a season) and general recklessness endangering Team Arrow (jumping (making the entire team hide Sara's death from Quentin, jumping into conflicts in Season 3 and reviving Sara in Season 4). Despite becoming more sympathetic While she was killed off at never stopped being divisive, her death on the end latest parts of Season 4 because Mark Guggenheim didn't want even a chance of Laurel was widely panned by Laurel's fans and Oliver getting together.some of her detractors due to being seen as unnecessary and not giving a good closure to the character.



** The firing of Hartley Sawyer from the role of Ralph Dibny/The Elongated Man, after tweets from six to eleven years ago resurfaced with him making some very inappropriate jokes. While some believe that his firing was rightful, much of the fanbase rejected the decision due to the tweets being old and accused the showrunners of not acknowledging that people could change, pointing to his activism & the fact that he'd stopped making those jokes years before being cast.

to:

** The firing of Hartley Sawyer from the role of Ralph Dibny/The Elongated Man, after tweets from six to eleven years ago resurfaced with him making some very inappropriate jokes. While some believe that his firing was rightful, rightful or at least understandable, much of the fanbase rejected the decision due to the tweets being old and accused the showrunners of not acknowledging that people could change, pointing to his activism & and the fact that he'd stopped making those jokes years before being cast.


** Superman's suit in ''Series/{{Supergirl 2015}} was controversial due to looking too plastic, having metallic connectors for the cape, and making Superman look weak. The suit for ''Superman & Lois'' was remodelled to have better detail, use less leather, look more muscular and no longer have the metallic connectors for the cape. When it was shown in promotional pictures, fan reception was overwhelmingly positive, with the only major complaint being the Superman logo being too small.



** Many fans rejected the franchise being officially named [=CWVerse=], since most of them were more used to name "Arrowverse" despite being unofficial. Fans have argued that Arrowverse would make more sense for the franchise to acknowledge series ''Series/{{Arrow}}'' the origin of this franchise or Oliver Queen being the BigGood on it.

to:

** Many fans rejected the franchise being officially named [=CWVerse=], since most of them were more used to name "Arrowverse" despite being unofficial. Fans have argued that Arrowverse would make more sense for the franchise to acknowledge series ''Series/{{Arrow}}'' as the origin of this franchise or Oliver Queen being the BigGood on it.BigGood.


** As per usual, there's the traditional DC/Marvel rivalry, with fans of the Creator/{{Netflix}} Franchise/MarvelCinematicUniverse shows on the other side.

to:

** As per usual, there's the traditional DC/Marvel rivalry, with fans of the Creator/{{Netflix}} Franchise/MarvelCinematicUniverse shows on the other side.


** ''The Flash'': Parts of Seasons 2 and 3, and most of 4 and 5 (most fans agree that the second halves are the most problematic).

to:

** ''The Flash'': Parts of Seasons 2 3, 4, 5 and 3, and most of 4 and 5 (most fans agree that the second halves are the most problematic).6.



** ''Supergirl'': Season 2 ([[BrokenBase though it's more debatable among critics and fans whether or not it was an improvement over Season 1]]). Season 3 of ''Supergirl'' also left many unimpressed, [[DownplayedTrope but the fans are far more forgiving about that one]] as the remaining crew [[WritingByTheSeatOfYourPants had to completely retool its second half on the fly]] after Andrew Kreisberg was fired, not wanting to use his story plan and thus have to pay him. Season 5 also is criticized for the ArcFatigue involving Lena's plot and the RomanticPlotTumor with Kara and William.

to:

** ''Supergirl'': Season Seasons 2 ([[BrokenBase though it's more debatable among critics and fans whether or not it was an improvement over Season 1]]). Season 1]]), 3 of ''Supergirl'' also left many unimpressed, [[DownplayedTrope but the fans are far more forgiving about that one]] as the remaining crew [[WritingByTheSeatOfYourPants had to completely retool its second half on the fly]] after Andrew Kreisberg was fired, not wanting to use his story plan and thus have to pay him. Season 5 also is criticized for the ArcFatigue involving Lena's plot and the RomanticPlotTumor with Kara and William.5.



* StarTrekMovieCurse: Interestingly, the third and especially fourth seasons of both ''Arrow'' and ''The Flash'' are widely hated by fans (as mentioned in both DorkAge and SeasonalRot above). ''Legends'' averted this for its third season while ''Supergirl'' would have if it wasn't for having to completely rewrite the last few episodes (and the real life reasons behind those rewrites have made it so most of the fandom gives them a free pass for it). It was then interestingly inverted for the two shows regarding their fourth seasons, with Season 4 of ''Supergirl'' being quite well received and Season 4 of ''Legends'' getting lots of flack (although still not ''nearly'' as much as the fourth seasons of ''Arrow'' and ''The Flash'' got).

to:

* StarTrekMovieCurse: Interestingly, the third and especially fourth seasons of both ''Arrow'' and ''The Flash'' are widely hated by fans (as mentioned in both DorkAge and SeasonalRot above). ''Legends'' averted this for its third season while ''Supergirl'' would have if it wasn't for having to completely rewrite the last few episodes (and the real life reasons behind those rewrites have made it so most of the fandom gives them a free pass for it). It was then interestingly inverted for the two shows regarding their fourth seasons, with Season 4 of ''Supergirl'' being quite well received and Season 4 of ''Legends'' getting lots of flack (although still not ''nearly'' as much as the fourth seasons of ''Arrow'' and ''The Flash'' got).

Added DiffLines:

** Many fans rejected the franchise being officially named [=CWVerse=], since most of them were more used to name "Arrowverse" despite being unofficial. Fans have argued that Arrowverse would make more sense for the franchise to acknowledge series ''Series/{{Arrow}}'' the origin of this franchise or Oliver Queen being the BigGood on it.

Showing 15 edit(s) of 346

Top

How well does it match the trope?

Example of:

/

Media sources:

/

Report