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** Another hint at Kur not being so bad: the Flute of Gilgamesh. Despite being the story's "Hero," Gilgamesh was more like a Villain Protagonist, with the Gods spending much of the story trying to punish Gilgamesh for his insults, terrible actions, and bad rulership. Unlike other, more morally upright protagonists, Gilgamesh in particular being possibly linked to a weapon fatal to Kur implies the possibility that Kur's enemies - whoever truly used the weapon (for a name does not necessarily mean a genuine connection; some artifacts are named just because of a cultural relation, assumption, or bias, rather than an historical connection) were also not quite morally upright.
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** This theory of Kur's relationship with the Sumerians lines up with historical fact and becomes FridgeBrilliance when you consider where the show's writers got the name Kur. Kur is alternatively used in Sumerian writings to describe: 1). An anthropomorphized concept of the Underworld, 2). the actual word for the underworld itself, and 3). the title for the king of that underworld (Sumerians often referred to political leaders by the lands they ruled). This underworld association actually works well with the show's mythology, if you know how Sumerians seemed to have interpreted the underworld. Going by the funerary artifacts they left behind, the Sumerian underworld appears to have been conceived as a topsy-turvery place where monsters dwelled, feasting was done, and animals were as intelligent, developed, and skillful as people. This could, in the show's context, be interpreted as different depictions of Kur's subjects, the cryptids. And Argost's insistence that Kur is an ancient being that "existed before time began" could mean that Kur ''did'' perpetuate himself by reincarnating as different beings, which would definitely associate him with death and the afterlife to ancient peoples. Also, "Kur" as a title further implies the possibility of a succession of Kurs, reincarnation-style. So to the ancient mind, it'd be easy to view Kur as a deity of the underworld and assume his subjects, the cryptids, came from there - and the fact that these underworld creatures obeyed him would obviously make him the king of the underworld in their eyes. Kur's supposed power over death, or at least his known ability to reincarnate, also explains why he was locked within the Kur stone: his enemies expected that otherwise, he would have just been reborn. Of course, this also further implies that it was Kur's enemies who killed him, and it was they, not his subjects, hid the Kur stone and set up the deadly RedHerring tomb map. Which further explains why Kur's "tomb" is a Meso-American temple and not an ancient Sumerian burial in the middle east.

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** This If true, this theory of Kur's relationship with the Sumerians lines up with historical fact and becomes FridgeBrilliance when you consider where the show's writers got the name Kur. Kur is alternatively used in Sumerian writings to describe: 1). An anthropomorphized concept of the Underworld, 2). the actual word for the underworld itself, and 3). the title for the king of that underworld (Sumerians often referred to political leaders by the lands they ruled). This underworld association actually works well with the show's mythology, if you know how Sumerians seemed to have interpreted the underworld. Going by the funerary artifacts they left behind, the Sumerian underworld appears to have been conceived as a topsy-turvery place where monsters dwelled, feasting was done, and animals were as intelligent, developed, and skillful as people. This could, in the show's context, be interpreted as different depictions of Kur's subjects, the cryptids. And Argost's insistence that Kur is an ancient being that "existed before time began" could mean that Kur ''did'' perpetuate himself by reincarnating as different beings, which would definitely associate him with death and the afterlife to ancient peoples. Also, "Kur" as a title further implies the possibility of a succession of Kurs, reincarnation-style. So to the ancient mind, it'd be easy to view Kur as a deity of the underworld and assume his subjects, the cryptids, came from there - and the fact that these underworld creatures obeyed him would obviously make him the king of the underworld in their eyes. Kur's supposed power over death, or at least his known ability to reincarnate, also explains why he was locked within the Kur stone: his enemies expected that otherwise, he would have just been reborn. Of course, this also further implies that it was Kur's enemies who killed him, and it was they, not his subjects, hid the Kur stone and set up the deadly RedHerring tomb map. Which further explains why Kur's "tomb" is a Meso-American temple and not an ancient Sumerian burial in the middle east.

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[[WMG: Kur is not one entity, but a series of reincarnations ala [[WesternAnimation/AvatarTheLastAirbender]].

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[[WMG: Kur is not one a single past entity, but a series of reincarnations ala [[WesternAnimation/AvatarTheLastAirbender]].''WesternAnimation/AvatarTheLastAirbender''.]]
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** Kur, by all rights, ''must'' have had a good relationship with humans; otherwise, human-ruled civilizations wouldn't have flourished in the same citystate he lived in and ruled cryptids from. Given that Kur clearly reincarnates, it's also possible that Zak isn't the first time Kur has reincarnated as a human.
[[WMG: Kur is not one entity, but a series of reincarnations ala [[WesternAnimation/AvatarTheLastAirbender]].
Given that Kur can reincarnate and seems to have preferred such a diverse group of subjects, it's possible there wasn't ''one'' Kur, but many. Kur had previously reincarnated as many of the sentient species seen throughout the show.
** This theory of Kur's relationship with the Sumerians lines up with historical fact and becomes FridgeBrilliance when you consider where the show's writers got the name Kur. Kur is alternatively used in Sumerian writings to describe: 1). An anthropomorphized concept of the Underworld, 2). the actual word for the underworld itself, and 3). the title for the king of that underworld (Sumerians often referred to political leaders by the lands they ruled). This underworld association actually works well with the show's mythology, if you know how Sumerians seemed to have interpreted the underworld. Going by the funerary artifacts they left behind, the Sumerian underworld appears to have been conceived as a topsy-turvery place where monsters dwelled, feasting was done, and animals were as intelligent, developed, and skillful as people. This could, in the show's context, be interpreted as different depictions of Kur's subjects, the cryptids. And Argost's insistence that Kur is an ancient being that "existed before time began" could mean that Kur ''did'' perpetuate himself by reincarnating as different beings, which would definitely associate him with death and the afterlife to ancient peoples. Also, "Kur" as a title further implies the possibility of a succession of Kurs, reincarnation-style. So to the ancient mind, it'd be easy to view Kur as a deity of the underworld and assume his subjects, the cryptids, came from there - and the fact that these underworld creatures obeyed him would obviously make him the king of the underworld in their eyes. Kur's supposed power over death, or at least his known ability to reincarnate, also explains why he was locked within the Kur stone: his enemies expected that otherwise, he would have just been reborn. Of course, this also further implies that it was Kur's enemies who killed him, and it was they, not his subjects, hid the Kur stone and set up the deadly RedHerring tomb map. Which further explains why Kur's "tomb" is a Meso-American temple and not an ancient Sumerian burial in the middle east.
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**You could also look at [[spoiler:Zak Saturday's]] Kur powers and compare the them to [[spoiler:Zak Monday's]] Anti-Kur powers. Kur's power can only influence a cryptid but not outright control them, meaning that couldn't force a cryptid to do something they absolutely didn't want to do but the Anti-Kur powers instead drive them into a frenzy and force them to attack even when they don't want to,[[note]] the last part is especially evident when you look at Fisk, Zon and Komodo's faces when freed from [[spoiler:Zak Monday's ]] control[[/note]] and considering that the two would be complete opposites the Anti-Kur could have some kind of VillainWithGoodPublicity.
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[[WMG:The etchings on the Kur stone were carved to be a death trap wild goose chase for anyone searching for Kur's power.]]
Possibly by someone (coughGilgameshcough) who didn't realize that Kur's essence was inside the rock, or maybe through circumstances they DID know and were trying to protect his reincarnation from corrupting influences, or maybe it WAS Kur that put the etchings in in order to hide/protect his reincarnation, but hear me out:

The first part of the Kur stone's gauntlet involve collecting several items...from several very nasty locations. The horn of an aggressive lake monster, a nesting crystal from inside an active volcano, a map to the Tomb of Kur guarded by the Owlman, a medallion given to the king of the undersea Kumari Kandam (as a gift from the Sumerians - in other words, humans). In the 5000, 6000 BC (or older!) that the Kur stone's etchings were made, heat-resistant bodysuits and submarines weren't really...a thing. If that wasn't enough, the Tomb of Kur was guarded by a particularly ferocious cryptid, which Argost felt the need to stage an entire cryptid fighting ring in order to get rid of it.

If, somehow, someone was able to gather these items and make it past the guardian on the outside without dying, once within the tomb they would find...a relief of a Lemurian on the wall. The Lemurians who are self-proclaimed "guardians of the world against Kur." Who were "scattered across this world and beyond." So, not only likely impossible to find, but, in the event that one was found, then very likely to try to stop whoever was searching for Kur.

And, finally, if somehow this hypothetical person searching for Kur managed to track a Lemurian willing to help (or else otherwise coerced it into using its instincts to help)...said instincts would point this person to Antarctica, where the biggest and angriest creature yet slept in deep freeze. Since it didn't attempt to fly until after Argost took control, it could be feasible that on its own it wouldn't know how; thus, if it WERE woken up by this hypothetical person, and said person was much less prepared than Argost, they would likely die to it and then the beast would go straight back to sleep, stuck on the frozen pole as it were.

Self-sustaining death trap!

(Also very interesting to note...Fisk never says himself that Antarctica is where Kur will be found - just that his instincts have been forcing him to make the divining rod. In fact, at the beginning of Shadows of Lemuria, when Zak is spinning a globe on his finger and asks Fisk to use his instincts to point out where Kur is...

...Fisk points so hard that his finger goes through the globe. Towards Zak.)

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** The Lemurians, as mentioned above, obviously didn't like him, but we don't know anything about ''them'' either. It's quite possible they were combative enemies with Sumer when Kur was in power or even were the ones who had Kur killed. For all we know, they could have been giving themselves good publicity and defaming their enemy in one go. After all, in history the only thing the future knows about you is usually whatever label sticks longest, and if you've got an enemy who outlives you, chances are they're going to do their best to make sure that label's a nasty one. (Example: Napoleon was actually slightly taller than average for a man in his times, but the British liked drawing him short in political cartoons because it was harder to take him seriously that way. Guess what stuck?) In fact, later generations of Lemurians could have honestly believed these things their elder generations told them, and became genuinely terrified of Kur returning (Ditto for the Nagas, who could have heard these tales as well and ''liked'' what they heard, particularly sense they seem to have had at least some contact with the Lemurians given the room decor in "The Kur Guardian"). If that's the case, their belief that Kur was evil and fear of him resurrecting makes perfect sense. He's their ultimate political enemy that they turned into [[TheDreaded the Bogeyman]].
My point is, Kur appears to have been a warlord king, just like every other king in his time. And looking back, a lot of them were cruel, but rarely were they truly evil. So Kur could have truly been evil, but he also could have just been morally normal king for his time, because who Kur actually was [[TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot is never explored in the show]]. The fact that characters who claim to be the best in the fields of science and history just accept the ruling that Kur was 'evil' despite never actually presenting anything about him or what he actually did in his life ''and'' despite insisting they need to be "scientific" and "unbiased" about their investigations... makes them all look genuinely terrible at their jobs.

to:

** The Lemurians, as mentioned above, obviously didn't like him, but we don't know anything about ''them'' either. It's quite possible they were combative enemies with Sumer when Kur was in power or even were the ones who had Kur killed. For all we know, they could have been giving themselves good publicity and defaming their enemy in one go. After all, in history the only thing the future knows about you is usually whatever label sticks longest, and if you've got an enemy who outlives you, chances are they're going to do their best to make sure that label's a nasty one. (Example: Napoleon was actually slightly taller than average for a man in his times, but the British liked drawing him short in political cartoons because it was harder to take him seriously that way. Guess what stuck?) In fact, later generations of Lemurians could have honestly believed these things their elder generations told them, and became genuinely terrified of Kur returning (Ditto for the Nagas, who could have heard these tales as well and ''liked'' what they heard, particularly sense they seem to have had at least some contact with the Lemurians given the room decor in "The Kur Guardian"). If that's the case, their belief that Kur was evil and fear of him resurrecting makes perfect sense. He's their ultimate political enemy that they turned into [[TheDreaded the Bogeyman]].
Bogeyman]], and they may well have been the ones to assassinate him the first time around.
My point is, Kur appears to have been ruled over Cryptids as a warlord king, just like every other king in his time. And looking back, a lot of them were cruel, but rarely were they truly evil. The standard of justice was "eye for an eye"--kings who overdid this looked cruel, but kings who didn't ascribe to this kind of justice looked weak. So Kur could have truly been evil, but he also could have just been morally normal king for his time, because who Kur actually was [[TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot is never explored in the show]]. The fact that characters who claim to be the best in the fields of science and history just accept the ruling that Kur was 'evil' despite never actually presenting anything about him or what he actually did in his life ''and'' despite insisting they need to be "scientific" and "unbiased" about their investigations... makes them all look genuinely terrible at their jobs.
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* Kur, while having the unusual ability to reincarnate, seems to have been a quasi-mortal being. He was likely mainly active, as noted above, in Mesopotamia during the golden age of Sumer, because he's never mentioned in relation to any other historic time periods. Somehow, he clearly died--whether during the time of Sumeria or after--and his soul entered the Kur stone. Possibly, he was killed and sealed inside it, and like we saw in the show, when the Kur's soul is removed from his body, he dies. The fact that he had a tomb implies that even after his death, he was respected enough by whatever civilization he lived among then to be laid to rest inside his temple complex which became his tomb. After all, with Kur dead and his soul and powers inside the Kur stone, he would have no remaining magical influence over the actions of the Cryptids and people he ruled over, yet they still willingly put him to rest respectfully. Even more, they used his SoulJar to create a world-encompassing map back to where his remains were. Both the Secret Scientists and Argost assumed the map led to some way of getting ultimate power, but it didn't: it just led to his mundane, non-powerful tomb. The only thing useful that came out of it was a detail about Kur's life: that the Lemurians were his enemies. And details about the deceased's life being painted on the tomb walls is pretty standard for ancient burials.

to:

* Kur, while having the unusual ability to reincarnate, seems to have been a quasi-mortal being. He was likely mainly active, as noted above, in Mesopotamia during the golden age of Sumer, because he's never mentioned in relation to any other historic time periods. Somehow, he clearly died--whether during the time of Sumeria or after--and his soul entered the Kur stone. Possibly, he was killed and sealed inside it, and like we saw in the show, when the Kur's soul is removed from his body, he dies. The fact that he had a tomb implies that even after his death, he was respected enough by whatever civilization he lived among then to be laid to rest inside his temple complex which became his tomb. After all, with Kur dead and his soul and powers inside the Kur stone, he would have no remaining magical influence over the actions of the Cryptids and people he ruled over, yet they still willingly put him to rest respectfully. Even more, they used his SoulJar to create a painstakingly world-encompassing map back to where his remains were. Both the Secret Scientists and Argost assumed the map led to some way of getting ultimate power, which was why it was so complicated, but it didn't: it just led to his mundane, non-powerful tomb. The only thing useful that came out of it was a detail about Kur's life: that the Lemurians were his enemies. And details about the deceased's life being painted on the tomb walls is pretty standard for ancient burials.
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* The Sumerians respected Kur enough to worship him as a deity and build him temples, suggesting that he may have been considered at least a patron god somewhere (in Sumerian religion, cities usually declared one or more of the gods as patron deities of their city in hopes that they would extend favors of protection to the people, a practice also done famously in Ancient Greece). But regardless of what kind of relationship he had with them, Kur is constantly referred to as a Sumerian god, meaning he had a part in their culture and was definitely important enough to them that they went to extreme measures to protect his temple complex. That he had a functioning place in human society despite being a Cryptid that ruled primarily over other Cryptids is telling. Even more so is the fact that he chose to live in Sumer in the first place, the cradle of human civilization, when he could have picked anywhere else and never had to deal with humans.

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* The Sumerians respected Kur enough to worship him as a deity and build him temples, suggesting that he may have been considered at least a patron god somewhere (in Sumerian religion, cities usually declared one or more of the gods as patron deities of their city in hopes that they would extend favors of protection to the people, a practice also done famously in Ancient Egypt and Greece). But regardless of what kind of relationship he had with them, Kur is constantly referred to as a Sumerian god, meaning he had a part in their culture and was definitely important enough to them that they went to extreme measures to protect his temple complex. That he had a functioning place in human society despite being a Cryptid that ruled primarily over other Cryptids is telling. Even more so is the fact that he chose to live in Sumer in the first place, the cradle of human civilization, when he could have picked anywhere else and never had to deal with humans.

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* Kur, while having the unusual ability to reincarnate, seems to have been a quasi-mortal being. He was likely mainly active, as noted above, in Mesopotamia during the golden age of Sumer, because he's never mentioned in relation to any other historic time periods. Somehow, he clearly died--whether during the time of Sumeria or after--and his soul entered the Kur stone. Possibly, he was killed and sealed inside it, and like we saw in the show, when the Kur's soul is removed from his body, he dies. The fact that he had a tomb implies that even after his death, he was respected enough by whatever civilization he lived among then to be laid to rest inside his temple complex which became his tomb. After all, with Kur dead and his soul and powers inside the Kur stone, he would have no remaining magical influence over the actions of the Cryptids and people he ruled over, yet they still willingly put him to rest respectfully. Even more, they used his SoulJar to create a world-encompassing map back to where his remains were. Both the Secret Scientists and Argost assumed the map led to some way of getting ultimate power, but it didn't: it just led to his mundane, non-powerful tomb. The only thing useful that came out of it was a detail about Kur's life: that the Lumerians were his enemies. And details about the deceased's life being painted on the tomb walls is pretty standard for ancient burials.
** The Lemurians, as mentioned above, obviously didn't like him, but we don't know anything about ''them'' either. It's quite possible they were combative enemies with Sumer when Kur was in power or even were the ones who had Kur killed. For all we know, they could have been giving themselves good publicity and defaming their enemy in one go. After all, in history the only thing the future knows about you is usually whatever label sticks longest, and if you've got an enemy who outlives you, chances are they're going to do their best to make sure that label's a nasty one. (Example: Napoleon was actually slightly taller than average for a man in his times, but the British liked drawing him short in political cartoons because it was harder to take him seriously that way. Guess what stuck?) In fact, later generations of Lemurians could have honestly believed these things their elder generations told them, and became genuinely terrified of Kur returning (Ditto for the Nagas, who could have heard these tales as well and liked what they heard). If that's the case, their belief that Kur was evil and fear of him resurrecting makes perfect sense.

to:

* Kur, while having the unusual ability to reincarnate, seems to have been a quasi-mortal being. He was likely mainly active, as noted above, in Mesopotamia during the golden age of Sumer, because he's never mentioned in relation to any other historic time periods. Somehow, he clearly died--whether during the time of Sumeria or after--and his soul entered the Kur stone. Possibly, he was killed and sealed inside it, and like we saw in the show, when the Kur's soul is removed from his body, he dies. The fact that he had a tomb implies that even after his death, he was respected enough by whatever civilization he lived among then to be laid to rest inside his temple complex which became his tomb. After all, with Kur dead and his soul and powers inside the Kur stone, he would have no remaining magical influence over the actions of the Cryptids and people he ruled over, yet they still willingly put him to rest respectfully. Even more, they used his SoulJar to create a world-encompassing map back to where his remains were. Both the Secret Scientists and Argost assumed the map led to some way of getting ultimate power, but it didn't: it just led to his mundane, non-powerful tomb. The only thing useful that came out of it was a detail about Kur's life: that the Lumerians Lemurians were his enemies. And details about the deceased's life being painted on the tomb walls is pretty standard for ancient burials.
** The Lemurians, as mentioned above, obviously didn't like him, but we don't know anything about ''them'' either. It's quite possible they were combative enemies with Sumer when Kur was in power or even were the ones who had Kur killed. For all we know, they could have been giving themselves good publicity and defaming their enemy in one go. After all, in history the only thing the future knows about you is usually whatever label sticks longest, and if you've got an enemy who outlives you, chances are they're going to do their best to make sure that label's a nasty one. (Example: Napoleon was actually slightly taller than average for a man in his times, but the British liked drawing him short in political cartoons because it was harder to take him seriously that way. Guess what stuck?) In fact, later generations of Lemurians could have honestly believed these things their elder generations told them, and became genuinely terrified of Kur returning (Ditto for the Nagas, who could have heard these tales as well and liked ''liked'' what they heard).heard, particularly sense they seem to have had at least some contact with the Lemurians given the room decor in "The Kur Guardian"). If that's the case, their belief that Kur was evil and fear of him resurrecting makes perfect sense. He's their ultimate political enemy that they turned into [[TheDreaded the Bogeyman]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


My point is, Kur appears to have been a warlord king, just like every other king in his time. And looking back, a lot of them were cruel, but rarely were they truly evil. So Kur could have been evil, but he also could have just been morally normal king for his time, because who Kur actually was [[TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot is never explored in the show]]. The fact that people who claim to be the best in the fields of science and history just accept the ruling that Kur was 'evil' despite never actually finding anything about him or what he actually did in his life ''and'' despite insisting they need to be "scientific" and "unbiased" about their investigations... is pretty bad, actually.

to:

My point is, Kur appears to have been a warlord king, just like every other king in his time. And looking back, a lot of them were cruel, but rarely were they truly evil. So Kur could have truly been evil, but he also could have just been morally normal king for his time, because who Kur actually was [[TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot is never explored in the show]]. The fact that people characters who claim to be the best in the fields of science and history just accept the ruling that Kur was 'evil' despite never actually finding presenting anything about him or what he actually did in his life ''and'' despite insisting they need to be "scientific" and "unbiased" about their investigations... is pretty bad, actually.
makes them all look genuinely terrible at their jobs.

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* The Sumerians respected Kur enough to worship him as a deity and build him temples, suggesting that he may have been considered at least a patron god somewhere (in Sumerian religion, cities usually declared one or more of the gods as patron deities of their city in hopes that they would extend favors of protection to the people, a practice also done famously in Ancient Greece). But regardless of what kind of relationship he had with them, Kur is constantly referred to as a Sumerian god, meaning he had a part in their culture and was definitely important enough to them that they went to extreme measures to protect his temple complex. That he had a functioning place in human society despite being a Cryptid that ruled primarily over other Cryptids is telling.
* Kur, while having the unusual ability to reincarnate, seems to have been a quasi-mortal being. He was likely mainly active, as noted above, in Mesopotamia during the golden age of Sumer, because he's never mentioned in relation to any other historic time periods. Somehow, he clearly died, and his soul entered the Kur stone. Possibly, he was killed and sealed inside it, and like we saw in the show, when the Kur's soul is removed from his body, he dies. The fact that he had a tomb implies that even after his death, he was respected enough to be laid to rest inside his temple complex which became his tomb. After all, with Kur dead and his soul and powers inside the Kur stone, he would have no remaining magical influence over the actions of the Cryptids and people he ruled over, yet they still willingly put him to rest respectfully. Even more, they used his SoulJar to create a map back to where his remains were. Both the Secret Scientists and Argost assumed the map led to some way of getting ultimate power, but it didn't: it just led to his mundane, non-powerful tomb. The only thing useful that came out of it was a detail about Kur's life: that the Lumerians were his enemies. And details about the deceased's life being painted on the tomb walls is pretty standard for ancient burials.
** The Lemurians, as mentioned above, obviously didn't like him, but we don't know anything about ''them'' either. It's quite possible they were combative enemies with Sumer when Kur was in power or even were the ones who killed Kur in the first place. For all we know, they could have been giving themselves good publicity and defaming their enemy in one go. After all, in history the only thing the future knows about you is usually whatever label sticks longest, and if you've got an enemy who outlives you, chances are they're going to do their best to make sure that label's a nasty one. (Example: Napoleon was actually slightly taller than average for a man in his times, but the British liked drawing him short in political cartoons because it was harder to take him seriously that way. Guess what stuck?) In fact, later generations of Lemurians could have honestly believed these things their elder generations told them, and became genuinely terrified of Kur returning (Ditto for the Nagas, who could have heard these tales as well and liked what they heard). If that's the case, their belief that Kur was evil and fear of him resurrecting makes perfect sense.
My point is, Kur appears to have been a warlord king, just like every other king in his time. And looking back, a lot of them were cruel, but rarely were they truly malicious or evil. So Kur could have been evil, but he also could have just been morally normal king for his time, because who Kur actually was [[TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot is never explored in the show]]. The fact that people who claim to be the best in the fields of science and history just accept the ruling that Kur was 'evil' despite never actually knowing anything about him or what he actually did in his life ''and'' despite insisting they need to be "scientific" and "unbiased" about their investigations... is pretty bad, actually.

to:

* The Sumerians respected Kur enough to worship him as a deity and build him temples, suggesting that he may have been considered at least a patron god somewhere (in Sumerian religion, cities usually declared one or more of the gods as patron deities of their city in hopes that they would extend favors of protection to the people, a practice also done famously in Ancient Greece). But regardless of what kind of relationship he had with them, Kur is constantly referred to as a Sumerian god, meaning he had a part in their culture and was definitely important enough to them that they went to extreme measures to protect his temple complex. That he had a functioning place in human society despite being a Cryptid that ruled primarily over other Cryptids is telling.
telling. Even more so is the fact that he chose to live in Sumer in the first place, the cradle of human civilization, when he could have picked anywhere else and never had to deal with humans.
* Kur, while having the unusual ability to reincarnate, seems to have been a quasi-mortal being. He was likely mainly active, as noted above, in Mesopotamia during the golden age of Sumer, because he's never mentioned in relation to any other historic time periods. Somehow, he clearly died, and died--whether during the time of Sumeria or after--and his soul entered the Kur stone. Possibly, he was killed and sealed inside it, and like we saw in the show, when the Kur's soul is removed from his body, he dies. The fact that he had a tomb implies that even after his death, he was respected enough by whatever civilization he lived among then to be laid to rest inside his temple complex which became his tomb. After all, with Kur dead and his soul and powers inside the Kur stone, he would have no remaining magical influence over the actions of the Cryptids and people he ruled over, yet they still willingly put him to rest respectfully. Even more, they used his SoulJar to create a world-encompassing map back to where his remains were. Both the Secret Scientists and Argost assumed the map led to some way of getting ultimate power, but it didn't: it just led to his mundane, non-powerful tomb. The only thing useful that came out of it was a detail about Kur's life: that the Lumerians were his enemies. And details about the deceased's life being painted on the tomb walls is pretty standard for ancient burials.
** The Lemurians, as mentioned above, obviously didn't like him, but we don't know anything about ''them'' either. It's quite possible they were combative enemies with Sumer when Kur was in power or even were the ones who killed had Kur in the first place.killed. For all we know, they could have been giving themselves good publicity and defaming their enemy in one go. After all, in history the only thing the future knows about you is usually whatever label sticks longest, and if you've got an enemy who outlives you, chances are they're going to do their best to make sure that label's a nasty one. (Example: Napoleon was actually slightly taller than average for a man in his times, but the British liked drawing him short in political cartoons because it was harder to take him seriously that way. Guess what stuck?) In fact, later generations of Lemurians could have honestly believed these things their elder generations told them, and became genuinely terrified of Kur returning (Ditto for the Nagas, who could have heard these tales as well and liked what they heard). If that's the case, their belief that Kur was evil and fear of him resurrecting makes perfect sense.
My point is, Kur appears to have been a warlord king, just like every other king in his time. And looking back, a lot of them were cruel, but rarely were they truly malicious or evil. So Kur could have been evil, but he also could have just been morally normal king for his time, because who Kur actually was [[TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot is never explored in the show]]. The fact that people who claim to be the best in the fields of science and history just accept the ruling that Kur was 'evil' despite never actually knowing finding anything about him or what he actually did in his life ''and'' despite insisting they need to be "scientific" and "unbiased" about their investigations... is pretty bad, actually.
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[[WMG:Kur was actually [[TheGoodKing a good king/god]].]]

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[[WMG:Kur was actually [[TheGoodKing a good king/god]].not as terrible as the show made him sound.]]
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My point is, Kur as a king appears to have been a warlord king, just like every other king in his time. And looking back, all of them were cruel, but rarely were they truly malicious or evil. So Kur could have been evil, but he also could have just been morally normal king for his time, because who Kur actually was [[TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot is never explored in the show]]. The fact that people who claim to be the best in the fields of science and history never question the truthfulness of the legends surrounding Kur, despite insisting they need to be "scientific" and "unbiased" about their investigations, is pretty... bad, actually.

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My point is, Kur as a king appears to have been a warlord king, just like every other king in his time. And looking back, all a lot of them were cruel, but rarely were they truly malicious or evil. So Kur could have been evil, but he also could have just been morally normal king for his time, because who Kur actually was [[TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot is never explored in the show]]. The fact that people who claim to be the best in the fields of science and history just accept the ruling that Kur was 'evil' despite never question the truthfulness of the legends surrounding Kur, actually knowing anything about him or what he actually did in his life ''and'' despite insisting they need to be "scientific" and "unbiased" about their investigations, investigations... is pretty... pretty bad, actually.
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[[WMG:Kur was actually a good king/god.]]

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[[WMG:Kur was actually [[TheGoodKing a good king/god.king/god]].]]
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[[WMG:Kur was actually a good king/god.]]
We don't learn much about Kur in the show, other than that he's apparently [[InformedAttribute the evilest evil]] [[UpToEleven to ever evil]] [[{{Overkill}} the idea of evil.]] But where did anyone get that idea? Sure, he's ''powerful'', and most certainly dangerous, but so is ever other character and Cryptid in the show, even if Kur is unusually moreso. In the present Kur isn't well thought of, because for some reason every scientist and historian in the show 100% ascribes to the never-explained [[ShroudedInMyth legends surrounding him]], but in the past it seems he was actually well-respected. Clues:
* The Sumerians respected Kur enough to worship him as a deity and build him temples, suggesting that he may have been considered at least a patron god somewhere (in Sumerian religion, cities usually declared one or more of the gods as patron deities of their city in hopes that they would extend favors of protection to the people, a practice also done famously in Ancient Greece). But regardless of what kind of relationship he had with them, Kur is constantly referred to as a Sumerian god, meaning he had a part in their culture and was definitely important enough to them that they went to extreme measures to protect his temple complex. That he had a functioning place in human society despite being a Cryptid that ruled primarily over other Cryptids is telling.
* Kur, while having the unusual ability to reincarnate, seems to have been a quasi-mortal being. He was likely mainly active, as noted above, in Mesopotamia during the golden age of Sumer, because he's never mentioned in relation to any other historic time periods. Somehow, he clearly died, and his soul entered the Kur stone. Possibly, he was killed and sealed inside it, and like we saw in the show, when the Kur's soul is removed from his body, he dies. The fact that he had a tomb implies that even after his death, he was respected enough to be laid to rest inside his temple complex which became his tomb. After all, with Kur dead and his soul and powers inside the Kur stone, he would have no remaining magical influence over the actions of the Cryptids and people he ruled over, yet they still willingly put him to rest respectfully. Even more, they used his SoulJar to create a map back to where his remains were. Both the Secret Scientists and Argost assumed the map led to some way of getting ultimate power, but it didn't: it just led to his mundane, non-powerful tomb. The only thing useful that came out of it was a detail about Kur's life: that the Lumerians were his enemies. And details about the deceased's life being painted on the tomb walls is pretty standard for ancient burials.
** The Lemurians, as mentioned above, obviously didn't like him, but we don't know anything about ''them'' either. It's quite possible they were combative enemies with Sumer when Kur was in power or even were the ones who killed Kur in the first place. For all we know, they could have been giving themselves good publicity and defaming their enemy in one go. After all, in history the only thing the future knows about you is usually whatever label sticks longest, and if you've got an enemy who outlives you, chances are they're going to do their best to make sure that label's a nasty one. (Example: Napoleon was actually slightly taller than average for a man in his times, but the British liked drawing him short in political cartoons because it was harder to take him seriously that way. Guess what stuck?) In fact, later generations of Lemurians could have honestly believed these things their elder generations told them, and became genuinely terrified of Kur returning (Ditto for the Nagas, who could have heard these tales as well and liked what they heard). If that's the case, their belief that Kur was evil and fear of him resurrecting makes perfect sense.
My point is, Kur as a king appears to have been a warlord king, just like every other king in his time. And looking back, all of them were cruel, but rarely were they truly malicious or evil. So Kur could have been evil, but he also could have just been morally normal king for his time, because who Kur actually was [[TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot is never explored in the show]]. The fact that people who claim to be the best in the fields of science and history never question the truthfulness of the legends surrounding Kur, despite insisting they need to be "scientific" and "unbiased" about their investigations, is pretty... bad, actually.
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[[WMG:Zon is actually ''not'' an ''Ornithocheirus'' but an entirely new species of ornithocheirid pterosaur]]
She lives in about the right geological location (ornithocheirid fossils [[ShownTheirWork have indeed been found in South America]], mostly in the Santana Formation of Brazil) for species to have lived there in the past, but she's shown living in the Amazon rainforest instead of living out at sea like other ornithocheirids. Perhaps her kind persisted to the modern day by adapting to the climate changes, eventually becoming forest dwellers with an appetite for freshwater fish instead of saltwater ones.
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* Years later, in my theory, the case reopens, and Epsilon takes the case, against his people's will. From there, he tries find out the truth. The ghosts responsible for it, not wanting the truth to come up, decides to [[Main/GasLighting torment him]], from making the old artwork become gruesome at random moments (the changing portraits) to repainting his portrait (The Hanged Man from the corridor of doors) to making him see his brother age and decay at a rapid rate (the Master of the House portrait). On one night, everything goes freaky, and [[Main/DrivenToMadness he loses his remaining sanity]] and [[Main/DrivenToSuicide hanged himself]], and, well, [[Main/KillEmAll you know the rest]]. Just as they hid the incident at Gracey Manor, his people sealed the room he hung in and claimed he disappeared. It remains an "unsolved case" to this day.

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* Years later, in my theory, the case reopens, and Epsilon takes the case, against his people's will. From there, he tries find out the truth. The ghosts responsible for it, not wanting the truth to come up, decides to [[Main/GasLighting torment him]], from making the old artwork become gruesome at random moments (the changing portraits) to repainting his portrait (The Hanged Man from the corridor of doors) to making him see his brother age and decay at a rapid rate (the Master of the House portrait). On one night, everything goes freaky, and [[Main/DrivenToMadness he loses his remaining sanity]] and [[Main/DrivenToSuicide hanged himself]], and, well, [[Main/KillEmAll you know the rest]]. Just as they hid the incident at Gracey Manor, his people sealed the room he hung in and claimed he disappeared. It remains an "unsolved case" to this day.day.

[[WMG:All Cryptids are the progeny of Kur.]]
If you remember correctly, [[Main/WordofGod Jay Stephens said himself]] that "cryptids are to normal animals as the X-Men are to humans". The implication in the series is that Kur was the first Cryptid, and the one that all the others are descended from. That is why Kur can control them all (he is, technically, their "father").
* The only known exceptions are the swamp monsters from "The Ghost in the Machine" (normal creatures who were [[Main/MixAndMatchCritters fused together]]), and Komodo (who was genetically engineered).
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* Years later, in my theory, the case reopens, and Epsilon takes the case, against his people's will. From there, he tries find out the truth. The ghosts responsible for it, not wanting the truth to come up, decides to [[Main/GasLighting torment him]], from making the old artwork become gruesome at random moments (the changing portraits) to repainting his portrait (The Hanged Man from the corridor of doors) to making him see his brother age and decay at a rapid rate (the Master of the House portrait). On one night, everything goes freaky, and [[Main/DrivenToMadness he loses his remaining sanity]] and [[Main/DrivenToSuicide hanged himself]], and, well, [[Main/KillEmAll you know the rest]. Just as they hid the incident at Gracey Manor, his people sealed the room he hung in and claimed he disappeared. It remains an "unsolved case" to this day.

to:

* Years later, in my theory, the case reopens, and Epsilon takes the case, against his people's will. From there, he tries find out the truth. The ghosts responsible for it, not wanting the truth to come up, decides to [[Main/GasLighting torment him]], from making the old artwork become gruesome at random moments (the changing portraits) to repainting his portrait (The Hanged Man from the corridor of doors) to making him see his brother age and decay at a rapid rate (the Master of the House portrait). On one night, everything goes freaky, and [[Main/DrivenToMadness he loses his remaining sanity]] and [[Main/DrivenToSuicide hanged himself]], and, well, [[Main/KillEmAll you know the rest].rest]]. Just as they hid the incident at Gracey Manor, his people sealed the room he hung in and claimed he disappeared. It remains an "unsolved case" to this day.
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...[[Franchise/TheHauntedMansion the Ghost Host]]. Or rather, He's the man that becomes the Ghost Host. He was born as one of a pair of twins into the Gracey Family, destined to be the heir to the Manor. However, he left home for some reason, leaving his brother to be the heir. This brother was betrothed, wife died, he died, [[Main/KillEmAll everyone else but Epsilon died'', the end for that leg. His people [[Main/GasLeakCoverup made a cover-up]] to prevent word from coming out.
* Years later, in my theory, the case reopens, and Epsilon takes the case, against his people's will. From there, he finds out the truth. Before he knew it, the more malicious ghosts [[Main/Gaslighting torment his psyche]] from making the old artwork become gruesome at random moments (the changing portraits) to repainting his portrait (The Hanged Man from the corridor of doors) to making him see his brother age and decay at a rapid rate (the Master of the House portrait). On one night, everything goes freaky, and he loses it and [[Main/DrivenToSuicide hanged himself]], and, well, you know the rest. Just as they hid the incident at Gracey Manor, his people sealed the room he hung in and claimed he disappeared. It remains an "unsolved case" to this day.

to:

...[[Franchise/TheHauntedMansion the Ghost Host]]. Or rather, He's the man that becomes the Ghost Host. He was born as one of a pair of twins into the Gracey Family, destined to be the heir to the Manor. However, he left home for some reason, leaving his brother to be the heir. This brother was betrothed, wife died, he died, [[Main/KillEmAll everyone else but Epsilon died'', died]], the end for that leg. His people [[Main/GasLeakCoverup made a cover-up]] to prevent word from coming out.
* Years later, in my theory, the case reopens, and Epsilon takes the case, against his people's will. From there, he finds tries find out the truth. Before he knew it, the more malicious The ghosts [[Main/Gaslighting responsible for it, not wanting the truth to come up, decides to [[Main/GasLighting torment his psyche]] him]], from making the old artwork become gruesome at random moments (the changing portraits) to repainting his portrait (The Hanged Man from the corridor of doors) to making him see his brother age and decay at a rapid rate (the Master of the House portrait). On one night, everything goes freaky, and [[Main/DrivenToMadness he loses it his remaining sanity]] and [[Main/DrivenToSuicide hanged himself]], and, well, [[Main/KillEmAll you know the rest.rest]. Just as they hid the incident at Gracey Manor, his people sealed the room he hung in and claimed he disappeared. It remains an "unsolved case" to this day.

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...[[Franchise/TheHauntedMansion the Ghost Host]]. Or rather, He's the man that becomes the Ghost Host. He was born as one of a pair of twins into the Gracey Family, destined to be the heir to the Manor. However, he left home for some reason, leaving his brother to be the heir. This brother was betrothed, wife died, he died, everyone else but Epsilon died, the end.

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...[[Franchise/TheHauntedMansion the Ghost Host]]. Or rather, He's the man that becomes the Ghost Host. He was born as one of a pair of twins into the Gracey Family, destined to be the heir to the Manor. However, he left home for some reason, leaving his brother to be the heir. This brother was betrothed, wife died, he died, [[Main/KillEmAll everyone else but Epsilon died, died'', the end.end for that leg. His people [[Main/GasLeakCoverup made a cover-up]] to prevent word from coming out.
* Years later, in my theory, the case reopens, and Epsilon takes the case, against his people's will. From there, he finds out the truth. Before he knew it, the more malicious ghosts [[Main/Gaslighting torment his psyche]] from making the old artwork become gruesome at random moments (the changing portraits) to repainting his portrait (The Hanged Man from the corridor of doors) to making him see his brother age and decay at a rapid rate (the Master of the House portrait). On one night, everything goes freaky, and he loses it and [[Main/DrivenToSuicide hanged himself]], and, well, you know the rest. Just as they hid the incident at Gracey Manor, his people sealed the room he hung in and claimed he disappeared. It remains an "unsolved case" to this day.
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...[[Franchise/TheHauntedMansion the Ghost Host]]. Or rather, He's the man that becomes the Ghost Host.

to:

...[[Franchise/TheHauntedMansion the Ghost Host]]. Or rather, He's the man that becomes the Ghost Host. He was born as one of a pair of twins into the Gracey Family, destined to be the heir to the Manor. However, he left home for some reason, leaving his brother to be the heir. This brother was betrothed, wife died, he died, everyone else but Epsilon died, the end.
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* The only known exceptions are the swamp monsters from "The Ghost in the Machine" (normal creatures who were [[Main/MixAndMatchCritters fused together]]), and Komodo, though the latter's debatable (who knows who worked on him?).

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* The only known exceptions are the swamp monsters from "The Ghost in the Machine" (normal creatures who were [[Main/MixAndMatchCritters fused together]]), and Komodo, though the latter's debatable (who knows who worked on him?).him?).

[[WMG:The identity of the first Epsilon is...]]
...[[Franchise/TheHauntedMansion the Ghost Host]]. Or rather, He's the man that becomes the Ghost Host.
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If you remember correctly, [[Main/WordofGod Jay Stephens said himself]] that "cryptids are to normal animals as the X-Men are to humans". [[TabletopGame/DemonTheDescent Demon the Descent]] states that cryptids are the result of normal animals bestowed with power by the God Machine. Thus, in my theory, every cryptid known in the series, from the bunyips to Kur himself, had been encountered by the God Machine at one point.

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If you remember correctly, [[Main/WordofGod Jay Stephens said himself]] that "cryptids are to normal animals as the X-Men are to humans". [[TabletopGame/DemonTheDescent Demon the Descent]] states that cryptids are the result of normal animals bestowed with power by the God Machine. Thus, in my theory, every cryptid known in the series, from the bunyips to Kur himself, had been encountered by the God Machine at one point. It also could explain the origins of the cryptid's powers -- few animals evolve a [[Main/WindsOfDestinyChange luck-changing]] aura like the blue tiger, aquatic protists that can [[Main/MakingASplash manipulate water]] is naturally improbable at best, and [[Main/MadeOfExplodium no organism,]] [[Main/MadeOfExplodium even a snake,]] [[Main/MadeOfExplodium can explode!]]
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If you remember correctly, [[Main/WordofGod Jay Stephens said himself]] that "cryptids are to normal animals as the X-Men are to humans". [[TabletopGame/DemonTheDescent Demon the Descent]] states that cryptids are the result ofnormal animals bestowed with power by the God Machine. Thus every cryptid known in the series, from the bunyips to Kur himself, had been encountered by the God Machine at one point.

to:

If you remember correctly, [[Main/WordofGod Jay Stephens said himself]] that "cryptids are to normal animals as the X-Men are to humans". [[TabletopGame/DemonTheDescent Demon the Descent]] states that cryptids are the result ofnormal of normal animals bestowed with power by the God Machine. Thus Thus, in my theory, every cryptid known in the series, from the bunyips to Kur himself, had been encountered by the God Machine at one point.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
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* The only known exceptions are the swamp monsters from "The Ghost in the Machine" (normal creatures who were [[Main/Mix-and-Match Critters fused together]]), and Komodo, though the latter's debatable (who knows who worked on him?).

to:

* The only known exceptions are the swamp monsters from "The Ghost in the Machine" (normal creatures who were [[Main/Mix-and-Match Critters [[Main/MixAndMatchCritters fused together]]), and Komodo, though the latter's debatable (who knows who worked on him?).
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* It explains the mutations, their hostility with each other (If you aren't emotionally attached to someone, it's a lot easier to attack them if they turn into an out of control monster) and the general negativity of their world. Since Ben, Rex, and Zak are all the same age, it puts Zak Monday's world before Rex was curing [=EVOs=]. Also, the antimatter thing was supposed, not proven. It could easily be caused by Zak vs Zak and their powers colliding.

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* It explains the mutations, their hostility with each other (If you aren't emotionally attached to someone, it's a lot easier to attack them if they turn into an out of control monster) and the general negativity of their world. Since Ben, Rex, and Zak are all the same age, it puts Zak Monday's world before Rex was curing [=EVOs=]. Also, the antimatter thing was supposed, not proven. It could easily be caused by Zak vs Zak and their powers colliding.colliding.
[[WMG:All Cryptids have encountered a [[TabletopGame/NewWorldOfDarkness certain]] [[Main/DeusEstMachina mechanical]] [[TabletopGame/DemonTheDescent being]].]]
If you remember correctly, [[Main/WordofGod Jay Stephens said himself]] that "cryptids are to normal animals as the X-Men are to humans". [[TabletopGame/DemonTheDescent Demon the Descent]] states that cryptids are the result ofnormal animals bestowed with power by the God Machine. Thus every cryptid known in the series, from the bunyips to Kur himself, had been encountered by the God Machine at one point.
* The only known exceptions are the swamp monsters from "The Ghost in the Machine" (normal creatures who were [[Main/Mix-and-Match Critters fused together]]), and Komodo, though the latter's debatable (who knows who worked on him?).
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* It explains the mutations, their hostility with each other (If you aren't emotionally attached to someone, it's a lot easier to attack them if they turn into an out of control monster) and the general negativity of their world. Since Ben, Rex, and Zak are all the same age, it puts Zak Monday's world before Rex was curing EVOs. Also, the antimatter thing was supposed, not proven. It could easily be caused by Zak vs Zak and their powers colliding.

to:

* It explains the mutations, their hostility with each other (If you aren't emotionally attached to someone, it's a lot easier to attack them if they turn into an out of control monster) and the general negativity of their world. Since Ben, Rex, and Zak are all the same age, it puts Zak Monday's world before Rex was curing EVOs.[=EVOs=]. Also, the antimatter thing was supposed, not proven. It could easily be caused by Zak vs Zak and their powers colliding.
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[[WMG:The Monday Family are [[WesternAnimation/GeneratorRex EVOs]], and their animatter world is in fact the Generator Rex world]]
* It explains the mutations, their hostility with each other (If you aren't emotionally attached to someone, it's a lot easier to attack them if they turn into an out of control monster) and the general negativity of their world. Since Ben, Rex, and Zak are all the same age, it puts Zak Monday's world before Rex was curing EVOs. Also, the antimatter thing was supposed, not proven. It could easily be caused by Zak vs Zak and their powers colliding.

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