History Main / CircularReasoning

* Literature/TheLittlePrince encounters a tippler on his way to Earth. When asked why he drinks, the tippler explains that he wants to forget. When asked what he wants to forget, he says that he wants to forget that he is ashamed. When asked about that, he explains that he is ashamed of drinking.

* In 8oo10cdc, while discussing tapeworms, Sean Lock claimed you can only get a tapeworm from pork. When asked where the pigs get them, he responded that they get them from other pigs.

** One suggested solution was to take the "volunteers that visit people in prison"-program, that has people from all walks of life get a scheduled visit with a random prisoner. After about fifty visits, they would be given a "potential Breivik" stamp in their folder. Authorities would then go through the Breivik-stamps, go through their background and political affiliation. After they have cleared that they would be put on the actual Breivik-list and would then be randomly selected to visit Breivik and talk with him while prison guards listened in on every word that is said (and the person chosen would of course always have the choice to say "Thanks, but no thanks", after which they would move on the next person on the list).

** In the same vein, much of the "proof" that any given religion's holy book is true -- and a traditional, time-honored defense of them -- is because it says so.

* As mentioned above, a logic loop is kind of like circular reasoning but in the other way. Instead of A is true '''because''' B is true because C is true because A is true (circular reasoning) it's A is true '''Therefore''' B is true therefore C is true therefore A is true. While not a fallacy,[[note]]Since A is assumed/ proven to be true by data outside the loop[[/note]] a logic loop is a LogicBomb and its best to steer machines away from them. Most humans will recognize the futility of the exercise once one loop has been completed but most machines can't.

BeggingTheQuestion used recursively. A is true because B is true. B is true because C is true. C is true because A is true. The proof simply circles around and around, with nothing in it that isn't being proved by itself. This is a {{logical fallac|ies}}y, because it disallows the possibility that ''all three'' are false and, like BeggingTheQuestion, presupposes the truth of the thing it's supposed to be providing an argument to prove the truth of. To summarize, the one using it thinks that their claim proves itself; any argument that uses circular reasoning can be boiled down to "it's true because it's true."

-->(Though to be fair, there were other clues that pointed to the limp being psychosomatic. Putting weight on it without noticing for example.)\\

* STIs (Sexually Transmitted Infections) are transferred sexually. If someone has an STI, they got it through sexual contact. So, where did the first STIs come from?

** In "[[http://xkcd.com/1052/ Every Major's Terrible]]" song, a theology major can be seen writing a proof that goes "X, therefore there exists X".
** [[https://xkcd.com/2451/ "AI Methodology"]]: The research group's AI-based methodology has been questioned, but they used AI to prove it's a good methodology.

* In ''Webcomic/{{Freefall}}'', Florence is given a direct order to [[GettingSmiliesPaintedOnYourSoul like the mayor, trust her, and want to make her happy]]. [[http://freefall.purrsia.com/ff2700/fc02615.htm Much later]], when asked if she wants the order canceled, she refuses, stating that she trusts the mayor and removing the order would not make her happy. It's removed anyway, on the grounds that she's "obviously hit a limit in self-diagnostics".

* In ''Series/{{Noob}}'' there seems to be little of this going on in Master Zen's situation and it comes up when Omega Zell gives him advice along the lines of "How about you stop harassing us and get yourself a hobby other than the {{MMORPG}} we're all playing?". Master Zen's reply can be paraphrased as "I can't keep myself busy with anything else than the {{MMORPG}} because I can't leave my hiding place. I escaped jail to be able to harass you guys on the game, remember?".

* As mentioned above, a logic loop is kind of like circular reasoning but in the other way. Instead of A is true '''because''' B is true because C is true because A is true (circular reasoning) it's A is true '''Therefore''' B is true therefore C is true therefore A is true. While not a fallacy[[note]]Since A is assumed/ proven to be true by data outside the loop[[/note]], a logic loop is a LogicBomb and its best to steer machines away from them. Most humans will recognize the futility of the exercise once one loop has been completed but most machines can't.

* In the ''VideoGame/FalloutNewVegas'' mod ''VideoGame/AutumnLeaves'', this why [[spoiler: Arthur believes that HumansAreBastards because they kill to survive and are savages. Why are they savages? Because they have no knowledge or culture for themselves. If you ask him about the library being used to turn people into cultured human beings, Arthur states that the people of the Mojave don't deserve said knowledge because they are... well, savages. Pointing out this flawed reasoning actually fails the conversation- you're meant to prove that his paranoid personality core is the root of his problems.]]

* [[https://xkcd.com/2451/ "AI Methodology"]]: The research group's AI-based methodology has been questioned, but they used AI to prove it's a good methodology.

* In the ''Webcomic/{{xkcd}}'' "[[http://xkcd.com/1052/ Every Major's Terrible]]" song, a theology major can be seen writing a proof that goes "X, therefore there exists X".

Though to be fair, there were other clues that pointed to the limp being psychosomatic. Putting weight on it without noticing for example.

-->'''Hortense Inglesbee''': If you have wealth, you're successful, and if you're successful, you must have earned it. Honestly, it's a simple concept.

* In the ''Series/{{Porridge}}'' episode "Rough Justice", Judge Stephen Rawley, convicted of corruption, gets out on appeal. Fletcher notes that Mackay is now calling him ''Mister'' Rawley (he only refers to prisoners by their surname).

** In practice, the usual definition of monarch is "ruler who gained his/her position by virtue of his/her bloodline", i.e. being the head of the nation's royal family. This distinguishes a monarchy (in which rulership is hereditary) from a republic (in which rulership is granted by a voting body). The question now becomes how the royal family gained the status of "royal family" in the first place, and the answer to that question can only be found in the very beginning of the civilization in question (or the most recent coup d'etat). Furthermore, either a monarchy or a republic can devolve into a dictatorship, the key aspect of that being a ruler seeking to gain, exert, and maintain effectively absolute power. (Many modern dictatorships are republics-in-name-only where elections are blatantly rigged so that only the current ruler has any chance whatsoever of winning (usually by means of anyone who doesn't vote for the current ruler being hunted down and slaughtered), Iraq under the rule of Saddam Hussein being a textbook example.)

* [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axiom Axioms]] are considered self-evidently valid, and thus are accepted as true because they are true. (For example, “A = A” or “The whole is greater than the part”, or "If A = B and B = C then A = C.") This is not fallacious because axioms form the basis for ''other'' logical arguments. We're not trying to prove axioms; we're using them to prove other things.

* A fundamental part of any conspiracy is that [[AbsenceOfEvidence the evidence supporting the theory doesn't exist]] because the ones responsible are suppressing the evidence. The lack of evidence proves their guilt, because if they weren't guilty, they wouldn't have any reason to hide the evidence.

** The circular reasoning here isn't actually that the fundamentalist is right because God is right, but rather that God is right because He's God. The "I'm right because I do things in God's name" clause is a separate logical fallacy. Of course, theologians throughout history have come up with any number of elaborate and sophisticated arguments concerning this, but TheFundamentalist is rarely a very good theologian.

* A common frustration with many science majors is monomers and polymers. Monomers are described as "units of polymers" while polymers are "chains of monomers"

* [[MoralGuardians Lt. Col. Dave Grossman]] has published several reports linking video game violence to desensitization of real-world violence, citing numerous government studies as evidence of the charge. In his book "Myths, Lies & Downright Stupidity", investigative reporter John Stossel examined the citations on many of the studies Grossman has used and discovered that several of them listed ''Lt. Col. Grossman himself'' as a primary source. In other words, here are a bunch of studies that bolster my argument, using information I supplied for them.