History DethroningMoment / MassEffect

* {{Tropers/Bronnt}}: Much of the underlying principles from the original Mass Effect were on the harder side of science fiction, and many of the codexes written for ME2 followed this, so it was a great disappointment when they retconned Quarians with less than a handwave. In ME1, it was stated that they'd spent generations on completely sterile ships, causing them to evolve with weakened immune systems, which is simple and logical. In ME2, Quarians were changed to alwayswear suits, and it's a "sign of intimacy" between Quarians to link up their suits. There's talk about allergic reactions thrown in that contradicts the principal that they have compromised immune systems, and it takes several codexes and some DLC to try to justify this change that was completely unnecessary to the story.

* Tropes/{{cricri3007}}: Adding Archangel being Garrus since it's a microcosm of everything that was wrong with Mass Effect 2. Doesn't make any sense? Check (A Paragon Shepard spent the whole first game telling Garrus that, while rules were often a pain in the ass, you ''had'' to follow them and the last conversation with him had Garrus admit you were right and saying he would return to C-Sec). Needlessly DarkerAndEdgier? Check. A wasted opportunity to have a new character in your team? Check. Him not having a problem in the slightest that you now work for an organisation that, the last time he saw it, was a racist [[Franchise/ResidentEvil Umbrella]] apart from a single conversation? Check. Him not surprised ''at all'' that Shepard literally came BackFromTheDead (not asking how they did it, if there is an afterlife, etc,...)? Check.
* {{Tropers/Bronnt}}: Much of the underlying principles from the original Mass Effect were on the harder side of science fiction, and many of the codexes written for ME2 followed this, so it was a GREAT disappointment when they retconned Quarians with less than a handwave. In ME1, it was stated that they'd spent generations on completely sterile ships, causing them to evolve with weakened immune systems, which is simple and logical. In ME2, Quarians were changed to ALWAYS wear suits, and it's a "sign of intimacy" between Quarians to link up their suits. There's talk about allergic reactions thrown in that contradicts the principal that they have compromised immune systems, and it takes several codexes and some DLC to try to justify this change that was completely unnecessary to the story.

* Tropers/{{cricri3007}}: So, this is a new game, in a new galaxy, a new beginning and... what's that? Cerberus rears its head again? [[ScrewThisImOuttaHere Fuck this]]. I was already annoyed by the Cerberus PlotTumor in 2 and 3, and I hoped this game truly was a new beginning for the series. Add to that that you can't just shoot those two asholes scientists and that, for some reason, deciding to kill them is only doable by making their victims' mental state worse to force some GreyAndGreyMorality.

* Tropers/manofwarb: Thane's recruitment mission seems hastily contrived. Nassana Dantilus was a morally grey character from the first game, who used you and lied to you, but ultimately accomplished a good thing in removing her slaver sister. Apparently in the span of two years, she's gone completely mad and turned into a paranoid BadBoss. She has apparently decided to just throw away that prestigious diplomatic job in the Citadel - a job she killed her sister to save - and move to Illium to start up an EvilInc. Was she just thrown in as the BigBad of that quest, just to avoid making a new character? And then there's the whole shoot your way through an entire building of mercenaries just to reach him! Why not try to intercept him before? Or catch up with him after? There just isn't that compelling motive to do this mission, except to just acquire Thane. And when you finally get him, you find out he's a sniper with respiratory problems. Did nobody take the time to actually research snipers, and figure out that breath control is an essential part of the job?

* Riley1sCool: Suicide Mission. It was {{Badass}} and I loved it. Except for one little bit... namely, the part where I took the time to do one mission before I made the jump through the Omega 4 Relay. [[VideogameCaringPotential Legion's]] loyalty mission, as I had just gotten him before the Collectors attacked. I arrived, and we broke the crew out. I breathed a sigh of relief... until I realized it was half the crew, and received a rant by Dr. Chakwas about how "I should have gotten there sooner". Well, bitch, I am sorry I wanted my whole squad to survive this, and I am sorry the game didn't even give me a whole mission before they killed off half of the people I had grown to love over the course of the game. I spent resources on upgrades, just to ensure my whole crew survived. On the other hand, [[AwesomeMoments I beat the mission, first try, 11 squad members alive.]] I made the game pay for its attempts to guilt-trip me.

*** Umbrage: Agreed. There is absolutely no point to Refusal other than to allow the devs to get back at the players. "You don't like our endings? Fine, then YOU LOSE!!!" Although I didn't like the original endings, I didn't hate BioWare for making them and saw it as a forgivable mistakes. But Refusal was just insulting, a childish reaction to deserved criticism. It doesn't make sense with the rest of the games. If they didn't want to give us the chance for a different ending, fine, but this was a petty move, intentionally ruining the game just to spite the players.

** XSpectreGreyX: The endings singlehandedly ruined the entire trilogy for me. Not just the endings, but the final mission altogether and how it disregards player choices. It doesn't matter what resources you have, as long as you got the number. But the ending itself basically disregards everything you've done up until that point, and even things you didn't influence. Also, why would shooting at a machine turn it on? Why would jumping into the green beam do anything?! If synthetics are doomed to betray their creators, then won't the reapers betray you?! Better yet, won't you betray your creators ([[spoiler:turns out you did]])? And let's not even get into the science behind the space magic. [[BlatantLies The follow-up from BioWare didn't help either.]]

* Tropers/Umbrage :* I actually liked ME3, and for the most part I liked the Citadel DLC. There were a few cringe-worthy moments of blatant fanservice, but it was still really good overall. But one scene was just inexcusably bad. For those who don't know, Blasto was a joke in ME2 where you'd hear a commercial for a Franchise/DirtyHarry parody starring a typically well-spoken Hanar. The joke was popular enough to be repeated in ME3, where you could find a poster for Blasto 6 and listen to clips from the fake film. It wasn't particularly funny, but was still a nice little easter egg. By this point the fandom had made bunch of Chuck Norris style jokes about Blasto and turned him into something of a meme. Kind of dumb, but still just typical fandom stuff. The DmoS comes when BioWare decided to put a scene in the game where Shepard and Javik visit the set of a Blasto movie. Even in a DLC designed to be fanservice, this was particularly awful. Shepard and the actor playing Blasto got into a pissing match, which served only to pointlessly derail Shepard's character into an insecure ass arguing with an B-tier actor. Javik also came off poorly, going from the best new character to an idiot.

* Tropes/{{cricri3007}}: Withdrawing my previous [=DMoS=] for adding Archangel being Garrus. Doesn't make any sense? Check (A paragon Shepard spent the whole first game telling Garrus that, while rules were often a pain in the ass, you ''had'' to follow them and the last conversation with him had Garrus admit you were right and saying he would return to C-Sec). Needlessly DarkerAndEdgier? Check. A wasted opportunity to have a new character in your team? Check. Him not having a problem in the slightest that you now work for an organisation that, the last time he saw it, was a racist [[Franchise/ResidentEvil Umbrella]] apart from a single conversation? Check. Him not surprised ''at all'' that Shepard literally came BackFromTheDead (not asking how they did it, if there is an afterlife, etc,...)? Check.

* Tropes/{{cricri3007}}: withdarwing my previous DMoS for adding Archangel being Garrus. Doesn't make any sense? Check (A paragon Shepard spent the whole first game telling Garrus that, while rules were often a pain in the ass, you ''had'' to follow them and the last conversation with him had Garrus admit you were right and saying he would return to C-SEC). Needlessly DarkerAndEdgier? Check. A wasted opportunity to have a new character in your team? Check. Him being not bothered in the slightest that you now work for an organisation that, the last time he saw it, was a racist [[Franchise/ResidentEvil Umbrella]] apart from a single conversation? Check. Him not surprised in the slightest that Shepard literally came BackFromTheDead (not asking how they did it, if there is an afterlife, etc,...)? Check.

* Tropes/{{cricri3007}}: Shepard dying. It's never brought up that they ''died'' (until a few short scenes and a cut one in the third game), the implications of Cerberus being able to bring people back from the dead (the kind of knowledge that would be needed, how they did it, etc,...) are not explored apart from a brief "It's always about ressources" by TIM in the third game and it's a brutal GenreShift toward some DarkerAndEdgier plot that, while appreciated, wasn't needed at all.

* Tropers/Bronnt: Much of the underlying principles from the original Mass Effect were on the harder side of science fiction, and many of the codexes written for ME2 followed this, so it was a GREAT disappointment when they retconned Quarians with less than a handwave. In ME1, it was stated that they'd spent generations on completely sterile ships, causing them to evolve with weakened immune systems, which is simple and logical. In ME2, Quarians were changed to ALWAYS wear suits, and it's a "sign of intimacy" between Quarians to link up their suits. There's talk about allergic reactions thrown in that contradicts the principal that they have compromised immune systems, and it takes several codexes and some DLC to try to justify this change that was completely unnecessary to the story.

** StormKensho: I object to calling the original endings anything close to Bittersweet. They were out-and-out {{Downer Ending}}s. There is absolutely nothing in them that suggests that Galactic Civilization was going to recover. Absolutely no hope that anything turned out alright for any of the crew or Shepard. A BittersweetEnding would be more along the lines of what the Extended Cut endings somewhat succeeded in making them: The losses were great, many planets will likely never recover from the devastation the Reapers wreaked upon them(see: Earth), and there will always be scars to remind the galaxy of what was lost. But, the galaxy's population, at least, was able to be spared the brunt of the Reapers' wrath, and the Reapers' defeat and the gaining of much of their technological knowledge can only mean a far brighter future than any preceding civilization. That would have been a BittersweetEnding: A reflection on what was lost but hope was still present in what was won.

** Oris: For me, it wasn't necessarilly the content of the endings themselves (though that was still pretty bad) so much as the sudden derailment of Shepard's character. Yes, sure, it's a character you get to help shape over the course of three games, but some traits are pretty damn consistent - namely, the refusal to give up. If the war and physical trauma has worn Shepard down to the point where he/she has at last abandoned that trait, fine. Drama. Woo. But you have to draw some attention to that fact, you have to have some kind of obvious meltdown related to it - maybe with Anderson and TIM, or during the conversation with the Catalyst. The passive way Shepard just kind of stands there and nods while his/her greatest enemy gives what sounds, from an in-game perspective, like a completely bullshit speech just seems stupid. Especially since it comes on the heels of potentially talking down TIM. Without the knowledge that you are sitting there playing a video game, the scenarios Shepard is presented with seem so suspect that the Refuse ending - the worst ending - looks like the most logical choice, since all other options come from an apparent AI who insists that all AI will try to wipe out organic life, so you have to let him wipe out organic life, because it's the only way to save organic life. If you are going to present information that convoluted, at least provide a trustworthy source, rather than a totally new character who is apparently a genocidal lunatic. How does Shepard even know that anything he/she does will do what the Catalyst says it will? It's possible - likelier, even, than the truth - that the who Crucible was a trap and everything he/she could do would just be hitting a 'make the Reapers even stronger' switch. We - the player - know it probably isn't, but that kind of slip-up sort of defeats the whole purpose of roleplaying in the first place.

** Tropers/DrZulu2010: What's even worse, we have to agree with the Catalyst on his claims even if the bastard is the biggest fucking hypocrite of the whole galaxy. Because 1. He creates the reapers so we can be saved from the synthetics rebelling against the organics... by killing the organics, 2. He believes that, despite evidence to the contrary (ie: the geth and the quarians), we can't go to peace with the synthetics, and 3. His logic is fully flawed. If he created the reapers and that "the created will always rebel against the creators", doesn't that mean that the reapers might rebel against him? I always hated that when they introduced a character at the last minute, worse if it an important one. Because that they make this for a cheap plot twist. Sorry Bioware but this is hardly better than Creator/MNightShyamalan.

** Tropers/DrZulu2010: What's even worse, we have to agree with the Catalyst on his claims even if the bastard is the biggest fucking hypocrite of the whole galaxy. Because 1. He creates the reapers so we can be saved from the synthetics rebelling against the organics... by killing the organics, 2. That, despise the contrary (ie: The geth and the quarians), we can't go to peace with the synthetics, and 3. His logic is fully flawed. If he created the reapers and that "the created will always rebel against the creators", doesn't that mean that the reapers might rebel against him? I always hated that when they introduced a character at the last minute, worse if it an important one. Because that they make this for a cheap plot twist. Sorry Bioware but this is hardly better than Creator/MNightShyamalan.

** atrasicarius: Ditto, but for me, it's because the ending makes no sense, is completely contrary to the themes of the games, and makes all the things you did in the games completely irrelevant. I mean, you get pretty much exactly the same ending no matter which option you pick or how any war assets you have. That is not what they promised us the endings would be like.

** IsaiahXII: The very existence of the Catalyst completely invalidates the main plot of the first game and causes the entire story of the trilogy to collapse in on itself. Remember that the Citadel had a hidden mass relay to dark space (Dark Relay for short) which the reapers used to enter the galaxy in previous cycles. In the last cycle, the last protheans sacrificed themselves to sabotage the connection between the reapers and the keepers to give Shepard's cycle a chance. All of Sovereign's actions prior to and during [=ME=]1 including: Indoctrinating the Rachni, Recruiting the Geth Heratics, Indoctrinating Saren and Liara's mom and more were all part of an attempt to regain control of the Citadel to continue the original plan. This directly leads to Shepard's rise as a hero and eventually becoming the single greatest hope for the galaxy. But if the Catalyst controls the reapers, created the reapers and the citadel, lives on the citadel, the citadel is part of him and he is the collective consciousness of all reapers...then why didn't he just activate the Dark Relay himself? Ultimately, any answer only leads to one of two answers: A) He Can't or B) He won't. Neither answer makes any sense in the context of the presentation and information concerning the Catalyst and that makes that little Starbrat a walking plothole.

* Tropers/{{cricri3007}}: The Kid. My [=DMoS=] was the first second where he appeared because, i immediatly knew that he would die and only serve as a (poor) attempt at guilt on the player part when it wasn't needed (I felt bad for having to choose between [[spoiler:Kaidan and Ashley, for Mordin's sacrifice, for Legion's...]]. That and the Handwave of "but he represent Shepard's guilt over not saving Earth" dosen't make any sense with a colonist Shepard, who lived much, ''much'' worse.

* GlitteringWolf: What really bugged me was that, even though I made all the right choices and got all the stupid assets that I could possibly get, I still got pretty much the crappiest ending because I didn't do downloadable content or play the multiplayer stuff (I didn't have X Box Live at the time and it wouldn't let me do anything)It's frustrating to still do so bad when I worked my ass off trying to make everything okay.

* Tropers/{{cricri3007}}: The Kid. My DMoS was the first second where he appeared because, i immediatly knew that he would die and only serve as a (poor) attempt at guilt on the player part when it wasn't needed (I felt bad for having to choose between [[spoiler:Kaidan and Ashley, for Mordin's sacrifice, for Legion's,...]]. That and the Handwave of "but he represent Shepard's guilt over not saving Earth" dosen't make any sense with a colonist Shepard, who lived much, ''much'' worse.

* Tropers/BattleMaster: Right at the very beginning of the game, when Shepard finds out that they were brought back by Cerberus. The entire last game's secondary plot was basically telling us that Cerberus was the bastard love child of [[WesternAnimation/GIJoe: Cobra]] and [[Franchise/ResidentEvil: The Umbrella Corporation]]- they were responsible for the deaths of entire colonies for their sick experiments, they kidnapped and attempted to kill a high ranking Alliance admiral (who apparently committed suicide first), they were responsible for your squad getting killed by Thresher Maws if you had the Sole Survivor background, and I could go on. And all of this is pretty much completely glossed over as Shepard happily joins up with them.

* I actually liked ME3, and for the most part I liked the Citadel DLC. There were a few cringe-worthy moments of blatant fanservice, but it was still really good overall. But one scene was just inexcusably bad. For those who don't know, Blasto was a joke in ME2 where you'd hear a commercial for a Franchise/DirtyHarry parody starring a typically well-spoken Hanar. The joke was popular enough to be repeated in ME3, where you could find a poster for Blasto 6 and listen to clips from the fake film. It wasn't particularly funny, but was still a nice little easter egg. By this point the fandom had made bunch of Chuck Norris style jokes about Blasto and turned him into something of a meme. Kind of dumb, but still just typical fandom stuff. The DmoS comes when BioWare decided to put a scene in the game where Shepard and Javik visit the set of a Blasto movie. Even in a DLC designed to be fanservice, this was particularly awful. Shepard and the actor playing Blasto got into a pissing match, which served only to pointlessly derail Shepard's character into an insecure ass arguing with an B-tier actor. Javik also came off poorly, going from the best new character to an idiot.