Main Relationship Sue Discussion

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11:22:18 AM Sep 13th 2013
I wonder if Justin in Queer as Folk is this for Brian, since he already had Mike pining for him since their childhood, but suddenly comes Justin and Brian instantly falls for him and completely changes for him.
02:36:23 PM Aug 7th 2011
Okay, I took Rose Tyler off for the same reason I took her off in the past - she's not a damn Mary Sue. Being a love interest for the Doctor is not nearly enough of a qualification (good lord, she wasn't even the first person he kissed on camera - nor the last.) She did far more on the show than just boink the Doctor, which to be a Relationship Sue, she would have to exist for no other reason than to be his love interest. Same for River Song. If we're suggesting Rose being a considered by Davies to be a "good companion" is enough, well, everyone that's hopped into that TARDIS is a Relationship Sue, because the entire point of the Companions on that show is to be a surrogate for the audience so the Doctor can explain the plot or show aspects of his character off.
09:59:35 PM Jun 29th 2011
Not sure if this is the place for it, but in the section that says that a Relationship Sue almost never has the quality of gaining the attention of their love interest...what exactly does that mean? It says that she could "kill her beloved's pet kitty and mail it back to them and they'd still tell everyone how in love they are with her for her modesty", but I'm a little confused here on what that example is supposed to explain.
11:20:18 AM Sep 13th 2013
I guess the Sue is loved baselessly, Loving a Shadow way.
06:00:03 AM Aug 26th 2010
edited by Orihime

Putting it here in case someone can try re-writing it without the anti-Ginny bias. Tv Tropes has become a breeding ground for Ginny hate, considering some entries and edits in many pages, which reek of "Ginny whore, how dare she not letting Hermione get Harry, JKR SUUUUCKS GINNY IS A MARY SUUUUUEEEE!" to different degrees. And considering the chilling hate she gets in other places... huh.
06:36:08 PM Sep 15th 2010
Exactly how is that "Anti-Ginny" it starts out with a "Your Mileage May Vary" just because the idea of mentioning her would result in justifying edits and, surprisingly enough, people wanting to delete it.
04:40:58 PM Oct 18th 2010
The thing about 'relationship sue' is that the character exists only for being in a relationship with said character. Can this really be said about Ginny, when she actually plays an important part in why Ron is they way he is? He is jelouse of her because he felt his mother kept popping out kids until she got her ideal girl. There are many other examples one could possibly come up with.

The reason that is 'anti-ginny' is because whoever wrote it, picked out the fact that Rowling said she planned on them being an ideal match, but overlooked the fact that Rowling never said that was the only reason that Ginny was in fact created. I think it REALLY jumps the gun to assume that just because someone says they intended two characters to be paired together and have a great bond that one or more of the characters is a Mary Sue.

Someone might bring up Twilight into this arguement, so before they do, I'll say, the difference between the two is, Twilight is ALL about the love between Bella and Edward and how perfect it is. Harry Potter, well... the story is about a whole complex storyline. Relationships didn't start really growing until the later books.

I really think that Ginny was placed here simply because people didn't agree with Rowlings choice in the matter. Who ever wrote this, tried to indicate that the backlash comes from 'Die For Our Ship' is minor, and that this is the real reason why fans disagree. I have to say this is untrue, and this comes from parusing forum threads, not to mention fan history of the HP fandom,

'Die For Our Ship' plays a HUGE role in the Ginny hate. A lot of the people who were not happy with the pairing due in fact happen to be Harry/Hermione shippers. Some of them, typically the ones who are most vocal, happen to be rabbid shippers who payed no attention to canon WHEN they wrote their fanfics.

They were so vocal, there REALLY was a petition as of the sixth book to boycott any future HP franchize, and to get Emma Watson canned from the HP movies for her mispotrayal of Hermione Granger, as she showed she had an obvious crush on Ron in the movie. They also advocated a book return, simply because they disagreed with the pairing.

That makes up MOST of the anti-Ginny settiment out there. The rest of it, well... from the fact that certain people argue and call her a whore because she dated three different guys, none of them simultaniously, before getting with the character. Or they argue she was a rather boring character as for the reason they didn't like her. And because someone doesn't like her, that is the arguement as to why she is a Relationship Sue.
10:24:50 AM Oct 20th 2010
The problem is, you're categorizing any opposing opinion as "Well It's just Die for Our Ship." On a trope that even starts with a "Your Milage May Vary" it's going to be a given that there will be opposing opinions.

No where in the description does it say anything about Ginny being a bad character or "This Character" being a far better match for Harry. No, it points out how hastily put together the couple was. Hell, even on the main page this is mentioned; "...this character has everything in the plot conspiring to enforce this One True Pairing." That line is what is described; Ginny's off-screen character development, Harry's sudden feelings for her, etc.

Are there people who hate the pairing just because it got in the way of their OTP, yeah. But claiming majority of the contrary sentiment is because of that is plain shortsighted.
07:31:47 PM Oct 21st 2010
I think Ginny is a Relationship Sue (but nowhere near as bad as Tonks... Yes, I added that example), but I also think Harmione is a really bad ship. (Just my opinion; I think Hermione shouldn't have ended up with Ron, either. I was actually pulling for her and Neville.) I'm with Lionheart: There's nothing particularly hateful or DFOS in the Ginny example; it just points out that her development was too fast and not visible enough for the readers. (That being said, the most rabid Harmione shippers would have had their Ginny hate hard-ons anyway; what'cha gonna do about them? *shrug* Let 'em have their RAEG, it's not hurting anyone, and at the end of the day they only have themselves to deal with.)
03:30:42 PM Jan 2nd 2011
I think though, there needs to be more to it then fan speculation and simply being hastily put together. While it does say,"...this character has everything in the plot conspiring to enforce this One True Pairing" it also says "they don't really become a Relationship Sue unless it becomes obvious that character exists, first and foremost, to be in a relationship with another character." Ginny was not only in the books to be in a relationship with Harry.
  • She happened to play a big role in the events that transpired in the second book.
  • She also happens to be part of the reason Ron gets so easily jelouse.
Not to mention, I think for this one, "everything in the plot consipring to enforce this One True Pairing", simply having hints at a certain pairing doesn't count. If you want something that REALLY fits this trope, try one of the characters from 11eyes.
02:21:31 AM Aug 5th 2010
Am I the only one thinking Sam Manson from DP?
05:54:17 PM Jul 13th 2010
What's the page image from? Doesn't mean a whole lot without context.
03:50:20 AM Jul 28th 2010
I'm not the one who put this image, but if I'm not mistaken, it's from "Izumo 1", a H-Game of Studio e-go!. Recognize it because I have another game from Studio e-go! with the same art style, "Castle Fantasia" on PS2. That said, don't ask me info about this game, I haven't played it, sorry. :(
05:26:29 PM Mar 16th 2010
Taking this out.

  • Also, Rin gets turned into "Older Rin", a character that does not exist in the series and has absolutely nothing in common with the actual Rin-and exists for no other reason that to be the fangirl's wish-fulfillment, self-insert, extremely idealized version of the author's view of their perfect self/Sesshomaru's Twu Wuv. Particularly disturbing since it is actually very possible to brainwash a girl Rin's age to grow up to be whatever you think they should be and to serve your own selfish desires (that is actually the reason why children are used as soldiers/servants in some countries-they are much easier to brainwash than adults who already have set ideals). It's like these girls are nothing more than baby-making factories-usually for Sesshomaru-with no importance, lives, personalities or anything of their own.

My problem with this snippet is how absolutely biased and hate filled it is towards the Sess/Rin couple, and having the "author" scream its hate of it in SEVERAL pages (Shipping Goggles, Anti Goggles, Star-Crossed Lovers - OHGOD, look at the epic splooge it caused in the last one's old Discussion page). Can someone rewrite it into something more neutral, please?
04:08:06 PM Oct 18th 2010
While that comment was biased, I think they do have a point...
06:50:46 AM May 21st 2011
Even if it did, the bias and the ship bashing make it painful to read. If someone can rewrite it into less Sess/Rin hate (and less Sess Kagura pushing, seeing the other examples), please do so.
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