Lost in Space
What makes them tropes is the fact that they are unusual and thus almost always carry some narrative significance, as a deliberate choice made by the work's creator(s). They may not stay unusual as culture marches on, but that doesn't change the fact that having a bi or trans character in a work used to be very rare and is still uncommon.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
So, just being bisexual/transsexual qualifies a character for being an example of Bi The Way / Transsexual?
Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
Lost in Space
No, the work ought to call attention to it in some way or other. Most works make a point of having their non-cis/het characters display some stereotypical trait associated with their identity, be treated differently by the story, have a role in the plot based on their identity, or something like that. It's a very rare work that doesn't do this — the only one I can think of offhand is Alien: Covenant, and it's a gay male couple.
Edited to add: If you're totally strapped for context, describing how the work portrays that they are bi or trans will get you at least halfway to your goal.
edited 16th Dec '17 9:09:33 AM by Fighteer
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
But we do have separate tropes for stereotypical depictions of bisexuals (and probably transsexuals), like Depraved Bisexual for bisexuality as a sign of a character's evilness, or Anything That Moves for the stereotype of bisexuals having exceedingly low to no standards on who they get attracted to.
Let me put it this way: If the only non-ambiguous indication of a character being bisexual is that a member of the creative team said so, it doesn't count as an example of Bi The Way, whereas Sylvie from Bubblegum Crisis mentioning in passing during the story that a person's sex isn't an important factor for whether or not she may get attracted to said person counts as an example of said trope?
edited 16th Dec '17 3:34:15 PM by MarqFJA
Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
Lost in Space
Word of God doesn't establish anything about the portrayal of a character in the story. To be a trope, it has to happen within the work, not outside it.
I can't speak about the Bubblegum Crisis example, as I'm not familiar with the work. Bi The Way covers situations where a character is revealed to be bi in passing, when that fact has not been established on-screen prior and doesn't seem to affect their behavior. The article image shows such an example.
If you're suggesting that this shouldn't actually be a trope, then feel free to take it to TRS and make a cogent case for it. We're pretty full there, though.
edited 16th Dec '17 5:26:47 PM by Fighteer
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
edited 16th Dec '17 6:05:20 PM by MarqFJA
Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
...
I know this is two years old but it's relevant to a TLP of mine
that might be considered chairs. Are tropes like asexuality, hermaphrodite, transgender, and Bi The Way chairs?
Lost in Space
What matters for any trope is not the raw physical or psychological trappings but the effect it has on a story, be it to the plot, setting, characterization, etc.
People Sit on Chairs is a statement that the fact being troped is so trivial or meaningless that it confers no useful information. "Scene 23A is set in a room. The room has chairs. Some people sit on the chairs."
It would strike me as odd for a work to have an intersex character and it not be significant in some way. However, it needs more context than just: "Alice is intersex." This is true of any trope, under any circumstance. That fact must have some impact on some aspect of the story, and the impact must be described in the example.
Similarly, a trope must be distinct enough to have its own identity. If, hypothetically, every example of an intersex character can also fit on Transgender, Hermaphrodite, or something else, then it's not a distinct trope. Note that this is not about real life terminology, but how it is used in the work.
If you can find enough examples that are distinct and have significance, then you can make a case for your trope.
Edited by Fighteer on Oct 22nd 2019 at 2:33:18 PM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Just to clarify, what is the actual definition of Bi The Way? The majority of examples seem to just use "character is bisexual".
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
See also this ATT thread.
Lost in Space
The intent of Bi The Way is that a character is bisexual "in passing". It is defined by that fact being given casual mention without the character being seen doing anything to demonstrate it. It is rooted in a phenomenon called "bi erasure", in which media maintains the fiction that people can only be gay or straight, but not both. Bi The Way is a means by which to have one's cake and eat it too: establish bi representation but not offend anyone who insists on binary sexuality. At least that's the gist I get.
In a work, it occupies similar territory to Sorry, I'm Gay, when a character given no outward indication of their orientation declares it out of nowhere in a "tell, don't show" fashion.
In other words, if the character is overtly bi, it's not Bi The Way; they are just bisexual, carrying no more weight than being straight or gay.
Another way to put it is that being straight, gay, bi, or any other orientation is not a trope in and of itself; it must have some meaning inherently tied to that fact. Thus, Camp Gay, Straight Gay, Butch Lesbian, etc.
By that standard, Intersex cannot be a trope by itself any more than "male" or "female" are tropes; it must have some implicit connotation. Are all, or most, intersex characters portrayed in a particular way? Is there a common story told by their inclusion? If so, that is the trope.
Edited by Fighteer on Oct 22nd 2019 at 2:57:57 PM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
So what you're saying is that Bi The Way is a trope because No Bisexuals is so damn prevalent that the mere identification of a character in-story as bisexual is deemed noteworthy. Makes me wonder why No Bisexuals has an example list, though; if it's practically nigh-omnipresent (at least until "recent" times), then what's the point of listing straight examples?
Also, what counts as "overtly bi"? Is actively hitting on someone(s) in addition to being (self-)identified as bisexual enough to qualify? (Now that I think about it, wouldn't a character assuming that someone is straight/gay for one reason or another and then being proven wrong when said character hits on them/someone else be tropeable?)
Oh, and I'm still waiting for a response to this post.
Edited by MarqFJA on Oct 22nd 2019 at 1:18:00 PM
Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
How is Bi The Way different from But Not Too Bi? The definition given makes them sound the same. Also, if that's the definition the trope requires a massive clean-up, as the vast majority of examples list characters that are shown dating both men and women.
Lost in Space
[shrug] I'm about to give up on figuring that one out.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
The way I see it, Bi The Way is for when a character is casually or briefly mentioned to be bisexual, but I think most people apply it to any character that's bisexual. As for But Not Too Bi, based off the trope page, it's for a character that's bisexual but prefers partners of one gender more than the other. Again, that's my interpretation based off of the trope page. There does seem to be a lot of overlap between the two tropes. If I had to guess what makes them different, Bi The Way is for when the character's bisexuality is incidental whereas But Not Too Bi is for when bisexuality is supposed to be an established part of their character.
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
I still think Bi The Way needs some TRS action.
Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
Yeah. I've noticed some examples of people using Bi The Way to describe characters who display a lot of Ho Yay and Les Yay, kind of similar to Ambiguously Gay and Ambiguously Bi.
...
Should transgender and hermaphrodite be remamed or are they under Grandfather Clause? It was mentioned in the intersex TLP that their names are chairsy. But, if the former was renamed, wouldn't it be redundant with Trans Tribulations?
There is no Planet B
Re: Bi The Way:
Yes, they do. I've seen it a lot, and to be fair, it didn't occur to me that it's misuse.
TRS sounds about right. (But we do need to close some threads before a new one is opened.)
Edited by XFllo on Dec 10th 2019 at 3:59:34 PM
I'm pretty sure there are a few others too, but those are the two that leap out to me. They seem like People Sit On Chairs to me. What's the difference? What makes them tropes or character devices?