Who Am I?
It's a pity, because Abe is also trying to implement some much neede domestic economic reforms.
"We learn from history that we do not learn from history."
rollin' on dubs
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
It's not low defense spending, it's having the United States Force Japan, and US Forces Korea, PACCOM and other Yanks With Tanks nearby. Because of that, the JSDF could buy: F-15's, AEGIS, SEGIS Ballistic Missile Defense, PATRIOT missiles, F-16's (by way of the F-2 fighter), AWACS (in 767 flavor), the AH-64 et al.
That said, ima guess that Abe believes that the US will pull back or that future administrations will make deeper cuts.
All night at the computer, cuz people ain't that great. I keep to myself so I won't be on The First 48
@ Culminus: Hey, I didn't keep up with every bit of Abe's antics, you know.
わからない
US Draws Own Line Over South China Sea Dispute
Washington has always said that it takes no position on competing territorial claims in the South China Sea among China, the Philippines, Vietnam, Malaysia, Taiwan, and Brunei and opposes any use of force to resolve such issues.
But U.S. Assistant Secretary of State for East Asian and Pacific Affairs Daniel Russel in effect ended the ambiguity last week when he testified before the House of Representatives Committee on Foreign Affairs, experts say.
Russel said that under international law, maritime claims in the South China Sea "must be derived from land features" and that any use of the nine-dash line by China to claim maritime rights not based on claimed land areas "would be inconsistent with international law."
The international community, he said, would welcome China to clarify or adjust its nine-dash line claim to bring it in accordance with the international law of the sea.
"I think it is imperative that we be clear about what we mean when the United States says that we take no position on competing claims to sovereignty over disputed land features" in the region, Russel said.
Article from last year
, but I just read it today.
edited 10th Feb '14 7:29:47 PM by entropy13
I'm reading this because it's interesting. I think. Whiskey, Tango, Foxtrot, over.
The Potato's Choice
V
@ Joesolo: Low? Japan is in the Top 10 Countries in the world for Defence spending.
Keep Rolling On
Organized Canine Bureau Special Agent
Agreed.
I've listened to some podcasts that comment on Japan trying to change its posture on Article 9 and said that the US should not bear the burden of defending Japan alone.
If I can only find that Cato Institute link.
"Exit muna si Polgas. Ang kailangan dito ay si Dobermaxx!"
V
Another part of it is that the US is perceived in Japannote as being an increasingly unreliable ally, especially with the recent emphasis on Afghanistan, and the various troubles with the DoD and weapons programs.
Indiana Solo
@geenmantle- I mean compared to GDP, They only spend 1% GDP, the world average is 2.5%
I'm baaaaaaack
rollin' on dubs
Again Joe, the US carries a lot of that. If USFJ was to go away next year they'd have to pick up the slack.
Vietnam and China: A Dangerous Incident.
The 2007 incident apparently resulted from an attempt by a China National Petroleum Corporation (CNPC) survey vessel to conduct what the documentary termed “normal operations” in the waters off the Western Paracel islands beginning on June 26 of that year. Such operations are seen as anything but normal by the Vietnamese, who continue to claim the islands despite China having forcefully occupied them since 1974. Hanoi dispatched a fleet consisting largely of naval auxiliary vessels to prevent the Chinese from surveying the waters. A tense standoff ensued, culminating in reckless maneuvers by Chinese CMS vessels that led to a number of serious collisions, threatening the safety of all crews.
The Vietnamese vessels initially expelled the CNPC survey vessel from the area, and the China State Oceanic Administration (SOA) responded by promptly organizing a “rights safeguarding and law enforcement” campaign, dubbed Enforcement Action Code 626. According to the documentary, such operations exist outside the scope of regular enforcement patrols, and in addition to CMS ships already in the vicinity, SOA dispatched CMS vessels numbered 83 and 51 to the area as part of the campaign. They arrived on June 29 and formed up in “alert order,” with two ships both fore and aft on either side of the CNPC vessel, attempting to escort it back into the area for the second time.
Indiana Solo
I know. That's what Im saying. They have low sending right now compared to what they 'should'.
I'm baaaaaaack
わからない
For South China Sea claimants, a legal venue to battle China
The Philippines has taken its dispute with China to arbitration under the United Nations' Convention on the Law of the Sea and its lawyers say that the tribunal has discretionary powers to allow other states to join the action.
China is refusing to participate and has already warned Vietnam against joining the case being heard at the Permanent Court of Arbitration at The Hague, sources have said. Hanoi has so far kept its options open.
Any final ruling by the court on the dispute, one of the most tense flashpoints in Asia, cannot be enforced but will carry considerable moral and political weight, analysts say.
"If a large number of countries, including members of ASEAN, speak out in support of the application of international law to resolve disputes, Beijing might conclude that flouting the ruling of the tribunal is too costly, even if China's nine-dash line is found to be illegal," said Bonnie Glaser at the Centre for Strategic and International Studies in Washington.
ASEAN, or the Association of Southeast Asian Nations, groups four of the claimants to the sea - Malaysia, the Philippines, Brunei and Vietnam - and six other countries in the region.
China, and also Taiwan, claim much of the sea through a nine-dash line on Chinese maps that encompasses about 90 percent of its 3.5 million sq km (1.35 million sq mile) waters. The sea provides 10 percent of the global fisheries catch and carries $5 trillion in ship-borne trade each year.
In an interview with the New York Times last week, Aquino compared China's claims to Germany in 1938.
"At what point do you say, ‘Enough is enough'? Well, the world has to say it — remember that the Sudetenland was given in an attempt to appease Hitler to prevent World War 2," he said.
Beijing has called the comparison outrageous.
Admiral Samuel Locklear, head of the U.S. Pacific Command, and Daniel Russel, U.S. Assistant Secretary of State for East Asia and the Pacific, both voiced support last week for the Philippines' action in seeking a peaceful, lawful solution.
The U.S. comments came after increasingly assertive moves by China in the South China Sea in recent weeks.
"There is a growing concern that this pattern of behavior in the South China Sea reflects an incremental effort by China to assert control over the area contained in the so-called "nine-dash line," despite the objections of its neighbors and despite the lack of any explanation or apparent basis under international law regarding the scope of the claim itself," Russel said in testimony to a congressional sub-committee.
The issue could also come up when Secretary of State John Kerry visits Beijing this week.
edited 12th Feb '14 7:31:02 PM by entropy13
I'm reading this because it's interesting. I think. Whiskey, Tango, Foxtrot, over.
Organized Canine Bureau Special Agent
Here's more stuff on a future Malaysian Marine Corp to be deployed on James Shoal in the Spratlys soon.
Malaysia mulls marine corps, styled on USMC model
Ridzwan Rahmat, Singapore - IHS Jane's Defence Weekly
As it looks to develop a marine corps to bolster its armed forces, Malaysia may be considering a model similar to that of the US Marine Corps, according to a Malaysian defence official.
However, Malaysia has yet to elaborate on what any such model might look like.
Malaysian Defence Minister Hishammuddin Tun Hussein said on 17 January that he extended -during a meeting with Lieutenant General Terry G Robling, commander of USMC Forces Pacific - an invitation to what he referred to as "US maritime warfare experts" to discuss the next steps to be taken. IHS Jane's has been unable to ascertain whether the "experts" to which the minister referred are civilian or military.
You know, looking through a lot of videos on Youtube about Japan's history and the like, so many commentators get praised for saying that Japan deserves to be nuked and the like for their actions in WWII. Said people also tend to be either Chinese or Korean.
Is it really that hard to let go of the past?
HGW XX/7
The Japanese don't let go, that's the thing. Plenty of them still pretend that things like the Rape of Nanking never even happened, or were exaggerated by wartime black propaganda. "One day, for no reason we can fathom, the nasty Americans dropped two atom bombs on us!" is a pretty common interpretation of the war over there. It's all well and good to tell the victims to get over the past, but they do have a point when they ask why they should forgive atrocities that their enemy pretends never happened. Forgiveness is usually given in part exchange for remorse.
V
And why the Japanese won't let go — I suspect it's so shameful to them, so shameful that it's hard to admit what they did, let alone say anything about it. Japanese culture is not strong on being direct.
Call it a more serious version of Cannot Spit It Out on a National Scale.
Keep Rolling On
Organized Canine Bureau Special Agent
For the Chinese and Koreans on their perspective, their history is mostly defined through foreign incursions that resulted in forced concessions so that the foreigners can stop harassing them.
"Exit muna si Polgas. Ang kailangan dito ay si Dobermaxx!"
V
Not so much in the Chinese case — unless you count on several of them becoming Emperors as a concession. Unless, of course you're referring to the Opium Wars.
Incidentally, see the page on Kotobagarinote .
edited 13th Feb '14 5:50:15 AM by Greenmantle
Keep Rolling On
rollin' on dubs
That's the issue. Peace can be had at a bargain price-if the countries involved would settle their disputes. China will end up making money off the South China sea in some form: labor, investment etc. Korea should be unified given the sad state of the North. Japan has every reason to make nice with it's neighbors.
Yeah, but... The "Yabbits" attack. Those nasty creatures that make life difficult:
- Japan's Yabbit is it's World War Two past. Being an island that's easy to cut off they need to make nice with China. But they keep fanning the flames. Racism, ashamed of their imperial past and fear of the Chinese juggernaut.
- South and North Korea: one if 1984 the other just recently (as of The '80s) became a democracy. At one point in The '70s, the North was better off. Now however the ROK has teh awesome economy. They Norks just have their wall, mines and Scuds. Propped up by China they scare the South and Japan and keep US troops in Asia busy.
- China, the silliest Yabbit. The PLA loves to pee in the cornflakes of the US, Japan and South Korea. The Cold War is over, but the temptation to act like a Juvenile Delinquent (or ASBO for you UK tropers) is just too much for the "Commies". The Kaiser once said "Great nations have empires, I want an empire!". The PLA says "Great nations have aircraft carriers, stealth, MIRV's, bombers, a modern networked army. We Want those!" Of course empires worked out well for the Kaiser. China, worse than South Korea, was picked on by the west and there is a streak of Who's Laughing Now? in their desire for military tech and global reach. And there is the "making Uncle Sam look like a fool" that's too easy to pass up.
edited 13th Feb '14 6:46:17 AM by TairaMai
All night at the computer, cuz people ain't that great. I keep to myself so I won't be on The First 48
You know, as much as I am frustrated that Japan still hasn't made an official apology yet, and still act dodgy about their actions (seriously, what was Prime Minister Shinzo Abe thinking when he decided to visit that shrine commemorating their Imperial soldiers lately) at least they have made ones throughout the years. Not to mention that they don't completely deny their actions. While some (mainly the ultranationalist right-wingers) do deny what they've done, many others do acknowledge stuff like Nanjing and the like, as that whole failed textbook reform that the right-wingers tried to do proved.
From the way they act on Youtube videos and comment sections, it seems as though China and South Korea still view them all as being evil monsters who refuse to acknowledge the past. Even on videos that try to get along with them. Being someone who was adopted from SK, it makes me rather ashamed of my birth country.
I'm not trying to condone Japan's past actions, and indeed some of them still deny what they did, but they have also changed since then and not of it's population lives in ignorance of their past. In that regards, I actually think less highly of present China and SK than I do present Japan, especially with the highly racist comments they make about the latter.
I can understand that China wants to improve her military capacity though and are generally afraid of appearing weak. Keep in mind how often China was humiliated and invaded by foreign powers in the last 200 years. That being said, Chinese politicians are overdoing it with some of their statements and actions. I mean are some tiny islands really worth a potential war?
As with Japan, I find the denial of the Rape of Nanking especially striking. I mean your average Japanese nationalist can choose to ignore all the evidence, but even "serious" Japanese historians are sometimes doing this despite all the existing evidence. Take the diaries of John Rabe for example, sure the American journalists might have had some motives to exaggerate (which they didn't) but as a German indirectly working for the German government, why should he have invented all those atrocities? John Rabe was even tortured and imprisoned by the Gestapo after his return, because he wrote to Adolf Hitler and asked him to intervene on behalf of the Chinese people. The argument against Rabe basically boils down to "the Japanese soldiers would have never done this, so he must be lying". For "neutral" historians, Rabe's diaries are pretty much the most believable source you could hope for, because he had first hand experience and had no reason to make things up.
edited 13th Feb '14 9:30:13 AM by Zarastro
Well hey, the problem with Japan, is that sometimes they deny far too much of their past, and don't want to face the fact that they acted like that, due to it being a shameful stain on their legacy. And it takes the Chinese to remind them of that. But sometimes China goes so far in said reminders that they become no better themselves. After all, they constantly resort to hate speech and are also unwilling to let go of the past.
China thinks that they can force Japan to see their actions their way, but only the latter can do it, at least in terms of acknowledging the past. After all, constantly throwing hate speeches and propaganda isn't going to make Japan see reason.
HGW XX/7
It's regrettably common; Marxist historians spent a good deal of the late 20th century sticking their fingers in their ears and saying "la la la Holodomor, what's that?". Russian historiography still denies or minimizes the war crimes of the Red Army in Eastern Europe, even though they're mentioned in Soviet archives. Some British historians still stick up for Cromwell.
China was not the aggressor in the Sino-Japanese War. From the Chinese perspective - and it's not an entirely unreasonable one - they lost over 15,000,000 people fighting a longer war than any other Allied power, were forced to flood vast swathes of their homeland, and, when it all was over, instead of sharing in the spoils like the US and USSR, they were denied their seat at the UN, had their erstwhile enemy rapidly re-armed and enjoy an economic miracle, were largely derided as The Load in other Allied histories, and still had to finish fighting a brutal civil war. Some recognition on Japan's part that what China was subjected to was unjustified, they find the heads of Japan's staterun broadcaster pretending it didn't happen.
edited 13th Feb '14 9:50:12 AM by Achaemenid
Schild und Schwert der Partei
I see why he's done this, but it doesn't make sense to me. Japan's very well off, and very rich, partly due to low defense spending. expanding the military won't help much of anything.
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