DC Extended Universe

Superman is particularly silly on this; I mean, he had six friggin movies to date, with only one of them clearly confirmed to be a reboot, and the ONLY villains he had in all these movies were Luthor and Zod (not counting Nuclear Man, for obvious reasons). I mean, for Christ's sake, in the same number of movies, Batman had the Joker (only twice), the Penguin, Catwoman (twice), Two-Face, Riddler, Poison Ivy, Mr Freeze, Scarecrow, Ras'Al Ghul, Bane (twice) and Talia. Seriously, it's not like Superman had so little cool villains. What was wrong with using Metallo or Brainiac? Too much special effects?

edited 29th Jul '15 6:10:12 PM by Theokal3

They were planning on using Metallo if they chose to make Man of Steel 2 instead of Batman v Superman.

Brainiac was suppose to be Superman Lives but that didn't happen.

I hope instead of Doomsday Zod's corpse would create Bizarro. Some continuities had Bizarro be a result of cloning Kryptonians. But the only reason I don't think it would happen is because Bizarro is always a Bizarro clone of Superman.

I would prefer Doomsday for Henry Cavill's last movie and call it Death of Superman.

Oh, but how could you forget Richard Pryor! Superman's deadliest foe!

But yeah, I've heard that exact same argument before. If anything, I wonder why parasite still hasn't appeared in a Supes movie.

edited 29th Jul '15 6:52:22 PM by SciFiSlasher

In practice there is very little difference between Bizarro and Doomsday, both are basically just muscle that can rival Superman and give him a hard time. Neither are these intellectuals that can fill out the plot of a movie by themselves. Doomsday's entire claim to fame is killing Superman, but The Death Of Superman arc is 90% how the world responds to that event rather than how Doomsday kills him. Justice League managed to tell that story by removing Doomsday altogether, and gave their Doomsday the same imperfect clone origin as Bizarro. In fact if this Doomsday is a reanimated Zod corpse that is actually rather original, superhero clones are kind of overworked.

As for the Marvel movies and creative control, anytime you are called upon to direct a studio film there is an expectation that it is done according to how the studio expects it. It's basically anything with a brand on it. This can sometimes be subverted, 21 Jump Street defied all expectations and the relative obscurity of the brand helped it go as far as it did. When the director gains some clout, then we can start seeing more of the personal style bleeding into the brand they are given. And when it comes to directors personally, a novice director can churn out a decent movie if they have experienced producers and crew. But that same scenario can also have almost all creative control taken away from them and they are basically a figurehead as the movie is made without them.

With the Marvel movies, most of the directors have said (with both positive and negative connotations) that Kevin Feige is the one in charge. With such a strong center that's why the quality control is pretty uniform across all the movies, but there is no denying that the movies have a very uniform style. Tone, sense of humor, action scenes, even the color palette. There are some small variations, but you'd be forgiven if you thought the same director handled all of them. And several directors have voiced their opinion that their contribution to "their" movie was marginalized in favor of maintaining the brand.

WB seems to have at least recognized that they don't have that kind of central development, and that they really don't need to. What Snyder said was that Justice League will be the tentpole and that everyone else is free to do their own thing so long as they don't interfere with that. This is another contrast to Marvel, where every movie is basically advertising for the next one.

The article that stated that Wonder Woman will film this Fall says Justice League will film next Spring.

The only story I've read that features one of the comic Bizarros is Emperor Joker (I did really like that Bizarro, though), but I liked how STAS dealt with him as a clone and the odd kinship Superman felt with him as a result - wanting what's best for him while also realizing that he's too twisted to safely live among other people.

edited 29th Jul '15 8:35:52 PM by KnownUnknown

I am totally denying that there is a uniform style in the Marvel movies (there are worlds between Got G and each Captain America movie...the first Thor is also very distinctive). They only set the basic tone for the movies...and DC does the same. Which is important. You need some unity, or the Universe won't work.

If they want to try something new, they could make Zeus the villain in the Wonder Woman movie. I'd also like to see a quintet of Theseus, Odyseus, Achilles, Ajax and Jason as antagonists to the Amazons. Circe could show up at some time.

Personally I just hope they don't use Hades as the bad guys. I am sick to death of Everybody Hates Hades.

It's perhaps an advantage that Wonder Woman doesn't really have any particularly well-known villain. They can go crazy in this regard and write whatever they want.

True. Only question is how they will do that. Who would you guys like to see as the main villain of her first movie?

x8: I'm also going to dispute that each Marvel movie is advertising for the next one. Worded as is, that's almost completely untrue. None of the movies, with the exception of Iron Man 2, really have anything to do with the movie coming immediately after.

The worst you can say is that (most) of them plant build-up to future Avengers films.

I still think Ares would be the best choice for Wonder Woman's main antagonist. The only other well known villain she has is Cheetah and I think she'd be hard to take seriously. From what I know of him he also doesn't have to be straight up evil which is good.

Ares showed up in Injustice so he's at least known by game fans(and a Injustice 2 is in the planning stages apparently) and Cheetah showed up in JLU IIRC(didn't she have that episode where Batman pretty much seduces her after being captured?).

If I had to decide I would go with Ares and have Cheetah get an origin in the movie but not become the villain until a JL vs evil team movie.

edited 30th Jul '15 5:44:52 AM by LordofLore

Circe was in DC Universe Online.

@Theokal3 Me too. That's why I think Zeus would make a better antagonist as he is thousand times worse than his brother. And using Greek heroes as antagonists as well might give it a Wicked/Maleficent feel.

Isn't that due to Values Dissonance? Or did the ancient Greeks really think their gods were jerks?

On the subject of Wonder Woman's rogue gallery and how they can be adapted, I argue that some of her non-Greek enemies could work as being shadow arch types to the character (much like one poster explains with Superman and Batman's enemies).

-Cheetah: Based on the character's origin (including the Golden Age version) she is pretty much an ace in everything she does, just like Diana. The only difference is that while Wonder Woman use such skills to help make the world better Cheetah seems to be the best for the glory and fame it comes with. Let's not forget the whole reason for such villainous acts is due to her own jealousy over the heroine and wants to be better then her.

All they need to do is make her cheetah powers have some ties to the Greek gods (most likely Ares) and have her instigating a war among nations, and you got yourself a solid villain for the character to face.

-Giganta: Honestly her character will be tricky to portray given both of her origins seemingly having nothing to do with the story. But as an antagonist for Wonder Woman, she definetly a good foil based on her recent origins. She is a scientist, a passive and meek one for that matter, who built a device that increase the mass of anything (like the opposite of the Atom . . . maybe she should be his archenemy/love interest instead). Said device, while increasing size and stength, also have adverse psychiatry on the mind of organic subjects.

Maybe, if she is adapted for a possible sequel, she could be a fan who wishes to be as strong as Wonder Woman. If done right, Giganta can be what Electro in the Amazing Spider-Man 2 failed to be.

-Dr. Psycho: Pretty easy really. Brains to hero's brawn? Check. Represent all the ugliness of mankind to hero's pure idealism? Check. Misogynist male to hero's feminist female? This is going to pander to the SJW so hard, but definetly check.

This guy is the perfect foil to Wonder Woman! Hell, he should appear as one of the antagonists in the movie (along with Ares and Cheetah) to just fuck some shit up. Hell, I can right now see Peter Dinklage cast as this guy (since he can't play the other dwarf like DC villain, Gizmo, due to similarities to Boliver Trask).

-Dr. Poison: Another "doctor" named WW villain who could work. Mostly as a minor enemy much like Crossbones in Captain America: Winter Soldier. She(?) does seem like the opposite for Wonder Woman for using dirty coward strategy like torture and poison to get her way in contradiction to the hero's warrior code.

Honestly at this point, all the villains I mention can be in this movie as a Five Bad Band. Ares is the big bad for wanting to create war upon mankind because that's his thing. Cheetah is his dragon who serve Ares for the sake of surpassing Wonder Woman. Dr. Psycho is the evil genius who uses his mental powers to influence the countries to take part in the war that Ares want for the sake of his own misanthropic belief. Dr. Poison can by Psycho's bodyguard (like how Mercy is for Lex Luthor and Harly Quinn is for the Joker) making her the dark chick. And Giganta, who under the effect of using her powers, is influence by Ares to take part in the war using her desire to be like Wonder Woman to his advantages, making her the brute and token good teammate (since she is the least malicious of the other villains).

. . . I think I just created a potential Wonder Woman movie plot by accident.

Most likely Value Dissonance.

That's a pretty cool idea. I could envision Zeus as a bigger bad of some sorts.

It has been repeatedly shown in the comics that the Greek gods and heroes are a bit . . . douchebaggous. Especially when we compare DC's Hercules to the Marvel one; Marvel Herc may be boisterous, but at least he isn't glorified rapist who is devoid of any heroic traits.

It would be cool if the movie went with the whole origin that Hades is Wonder Woman's father like in Justice League; minus the BS where he is basically an obviously evil Satan expy. That would give some interesting character depth and irony.

edited 30th Jul '15 9:21:44 AM by BigK1337

It's not really value dissonance. The Greeks didn't think that the way the gods acted were okay. But they had a very different concept of how they should be. Christians like to see their god as perfect. The Greek gods are mostly representations of humans, only that their character flaws have far reaching consequences for mere mortals. They were more used as an explanation why human life is so shitty than a beacon of hope.

I guess though that they wouldn't have been too bothered with Zeus sleeping around.

@Big K 1337: I do like your ideas. Especially for Cheetah and Dr Psycho.

Zeus would be cool he is confirmed to be Wonder Woman's father in this universe.

I can't think of a current Comicbook Movie where the heroes parent is the villain.

Well there was the atrocious Ang Lee Hulk movie, but I wouldn't really call that "current" at this point.

Well, there is Agents of Shield...they used the "parent as villain" in the last season.

Weirdly enough, Ant-Man gives me hope for Aquaman. Anything can be cool if you treat it with dignity and put in some effort.

Then again, he'll just be Drogo, probably. So never mind effort.