Strong Female Characters

Hey guys!

Been working on my idea for a while, and one thing I'm hoping to include is a female character who doesn't suck. I've written them before, never very well, so this time I'm making 'Moira' a Lieutenant in a Mercenary Band. Now, there's a few things to know. Again, this is Late Medieval, early Renaissance-esque era, so female soldiers are not common.

My idea was that Moira was allowed to exist in the Company because the Lord uses her to keep his other two Lieutenants, men whom he fears because they're in turns smarter and more charismatic than him, in line. Oh yes, and she's basically the best fighter in the band. My problem is avoiding going off the deep-end and making her basically a man who occasionally says "Remember my ovaries?" while at the same time avoiding making her some prissy swordswoman whose an insult to the gender. A point to make is that she's afraid of the Lord because the guy is a very, very dirty fighter, while she has a code of honour.

Can you guys give me some help? I've always worried about writing women to take centre stage in story through fear of fucking it up, but I really would like to give this a try; characterisation, ideas, explanations for her being in the band, all are welcome. Just don't go saying War isn't traumatic - it won't float.

edited 17th Jun '12 1:15:34 PM by Minister

You might want to try writing some of it, and getting feedback.

My way of writing a Strong Female Character is to think up a Strong Character and then make her Female. Part of the problems that men find with writing female characters is because they're aware that the character is a woman, but the character herself really shouldn't be thinking about it.

As a rule, we don't think about our girl-bits that much. When you spend age 13 onward living with boobs and bleeding for a few days a month, you just... accept it. Hell, I barely think about myself at all unless That Time Of The Month feels particularly hellish. If nothing's wrong with us and we're not actively trying to attract/repel men, there's nothing to comment on.

But so many men DO think about our girl-bits (and in such painstaking detail) that since Most Writers Are Male, people think that women mention our WYMYN-NESS to ourselves every three sentences when most only think about it once a month, if even that.

And then characters who don't go "LOL I BE A WYMYN" every three sentences get branded as "a man with girl-bits."

Those are good reasons for her to be there. You can have complications that arise from her gender, but you're already doing well since she's there for real reasons.

That's a good reason to be afraid of someone. Stop worrying about it.

However, execution matters just as much as concept.

edited 17th Jun '12 2:39:06 PM by Sharysa

@ Mr AHR - I might try posting a paragraph or two of her interactions with Maldren and his Lieutenants, see what you guys think.

@ Sharysa - Thank you :) I do think my mentality of "Oh, I have to write a Female character well now!" is a bit counter-productive. I don't talk to many people about my writing, so it is good to have someone's perspective on this. T

A question on quite a sensitive issue; how should I take the very real possibility of her being captured and sexually assaulted? I have no intention of that happening, mainly because I find the issue quite traumatic to even speak of, but I can't ignore it. Would having her fob it off casually be unrealistic, or would having her be truly afraid be a Broken Aesop?

I think a happy medium is most realistic here. She can be cautious of what she does, who she associates with, and where she goes without being paranoid or careless. That's being smart and keeping yourself out of trouble, not fear.

It wouldn't even be completely unreasonable for her to have a way to fight back and defend herself against men who try to force themselves on her.

edited 17th Jun '12 3:10:23 PM by CrystalGlacia

Regarding rape: No-one fobs something like that off, despite how they might act, though you might want to think of how your character would react to a similar act of violence—being tortured, for example. Then again, even that is a different emotional landscape from surviving sexual violence. The question I think that you would be best to ask yourself is how they would view such an act in general, and then turn it to a personal perspective and see how changing that third person to a first alters the view.

As for the title of this thread, I second what Sharysa said and urge you to read this article by comics writer Greg Rucka.

edited 17th Jun '12 3:10:52 PM by JHM

You could have the reaction that she knows she's a good fighter and outwardly fobs it off, but she nonetheless feels fear—like, she laughs it off with her group-mates, but she starts carrying an emergency weapon or starts locking her rooms more diligently.

Sexual assault seems to be the closest thing to a gender-dominated Primal Fear for humans. Even after the initial assault, a woman potentially has to deal with 1) aborting the potential kid, or 2) knowing that at the very core of the matter, she didn't want her kid and she'll either have to tell them that at some point, or live with that secret for the rest of her life.

It's good that you're thinking about this, because emphasizing femininity where it counts is better than falling into the "LOL WYMYN" trap.

My best advice is to just not worry about it, and write her as you would any other character, only ever bringing up gender if it seems important enough to mention and won't risk getting the plot derailed for a minute. Some people might underestimate her for her gender, considering the time period, or even be disgusted by it. Don't portray her as weak, or end the story on a sour note about gender. She can have doubt and flaws in her fighting due to being a woman in a male-dominated field, but if that does become an issue, she should grow past it, though honestly, I prefer my strong woman to have already gotten past that problem.

Especially if they're already a good fighter. Seems like a problem that would crop up rather early.

Edit: Oh, and don't fall for really annoying tropes like Standard Female Grab Area or excessive nut-shots from her (though considering she's a noble fighter, that shouldn't be an issue). It's extremely bothersome to hear that this character is really tough and powerful, but the second their arm is grabbed from behind, they drop their weapon and lose the will to fight.

edited 17th Jun '12 5:05:48 PM by HeavyDDR

Also that.

I recommend reading this article: http://io9.com/5912366/why-i-write-strong-female-characters.

EDIT: Oops, I got one-upped by another poster. Serves me right for Thread Hopping then.

edited 17th Jun '12 9:08:01 PM by Nightwire

That link was already posted, you got pre-empted!

why isn't this a Kate Beaton thread?

Is there a particular reason we should limit ourselves to just Kate Beaton?

Perhaps just start with a strong character, and then build female onto it from the base.

My current pet character the Retriever is a tough-as-nails transhuman criminal suriving and even thriving money-wise in the cruel technicolor wonderland of the future but at the expense of personal life and mental health.

The Retriever is female, but the core concept could also have been male. Some of her backstory is very female, as she traded sex for services, and has rape to worry about, but I could write a soul-cracking background for a man as well. And the important part is that the core character isnt woman, it isnt gendered, even if the result is.

I advise writing out some key concepts then grafting female on until they merge into one form.

This famous strip parodies the media's take on 'strong female characters' very nicely.

Wait, so guys can't worry about rape, or trade sex for services? Also, Rape as Backstory is a horribly overused cliche for 'humanising' female characters, especially for a ball-busting Action Girl. It's gotten to the point where it seems like a woman can't be competent unless her past involved some nonconsensual dicking. Can't we have a normal, well-adjusted Action Girl for once? Forgive me if I'm wrong, but aren't there some male soldiers in the real world who aren't borderline-psychotics trying to work past their PTSD and daddy issues?

Besides, why would rape be a serious, ever-present concern for a 'tough-as-nails transhuman'? Because she happens to have a vagina? Ugh, so much fail.

What said. The way that you phrased that honestly came off as unbelievably sexist.

Also, that Hark A Vagrant strip is fantastic. Thank you for reminding me of it.

edited 18th Jun '12 4:57:42 AM by JHM

I'm still not sure I see a reason why?

Well, to be fair, the sad fact is that in our present society, rape is a serious threat that women worry about a lot when men don't. Isn't that one of the commonly stated 'male privileges'? You don't worry about being raped (in this case, it's not so much that they will be raped, it's just that society tells us to worry about it).

That's not to say that future 'tough as nails' transhuman women should have to have the same issues as present-day regular women, of course, nor that you should just plunk rape concerns into your female characters because 'that's just what women do' or as a way of making her backstory female.

edited 18th Jun '12 6:37:28 AM by LoniJay

This is part of what I found offensive. The other half of it is the assumption that such things are inherently female problems rather than problems that women experience more than men in our society.

In other news, JHM gets angry at people. How novel.

I have no intention of Moira having been sexually assaulted in her past. Right now, my idea is that she was raised by her father, a Guardsman, who taught her to defend herself because he was away a lot. No getting abused by her relatives, or having a vendetta against men. She's good because her father got her interested and never stopped that interest, and she has a lot of natural talent. I mean, the first conversation has her dealing with a Knight of The North, basically a big bruiser, by shooting him with a crossbow when he challenges her. She's GOOD at this.

I mean, a fair point has been made - I see plenty of characters who "are just good at stuff" but I've seen women who could kick my ass hands-down; why isn't it just acceptable to have her kick ass not because she has some great motivation but because she's handy with a blade? The Lord is head of the Company because he's smart, works well with others, will do whatever it takes to win, and recognises talent. It's a bit far fetched for a Knight or a real Lord to say "A woman fighting is totally acceptable" in the Early Renaissance, but if that Lord is not so much enlightened as really fucking pragmatic, it's a lot more likely.

Thanks for the feedback, I am getting a very good idea of her in my head.

edited 18th Jun '12 6:07:35 AM by Minister

A bit away from the initial concern, but I always interpret "strong female character" as being someone who has agency, someone who gets to make decisions about herself and her life within the constraints of the situations she finds herself. Too often people fall into the "men do, women are" sexist assumption, and make women too passive, too static.

Men Act, Women Are.

One thing to think about is the society you're going for. Is it particularly egalitarian about gender? If it isn't, a woman trying to become a soldier might be a bit unusul, and you'd want to address that. It's worth remembering, though, that women can have power in even the most sexist societies - it's just likely to be more backstage and political, and harder to acquire.

If you do have an egalitarian-ish society, though, odds are she won't be the only female soldier by a long shot, and you'll want to recognise that those others exist as well rather than making her a sole, super-special Exceptional Woman. Maybe some of her squadmates/fellow officers are girls, and/or she was trained by a seasoned veteran aunt back from campaigning? Elizabeth Moon's Deed of Paksenarrion series gives some good pointers, though you probably won't want to emulate the 'mystic awakening through gang-rape' stuff in the third book.

edited 18th Jun '12 6:59:44 AM by Iaculus

Here's a quick list of things you should try/avoid to make a "stronger" female character.

1. Her looks should be a non-issue. If she's combat-based, make her outfit 100% practical with no modifications for beauty. This isn't to say she should be a tomboy, but unless she's a celebrity or saleswoman of some sort, her looks should never define her day job. (Note: I'm not saying she shouldn't care about her appearance. Just that it shouldn't be a predominant factor.)

2. Avoid making her a "reward". If she has a love interest, don't make their relationship a Standard Hero Reward for doing something amazing. For example, Selene from Underworld may be the main character, but her relationship with Michael Corbin is presented as Michael's reward for being badass and special. If she has a relationship with someone, do your best to avoid making the relationship a biproduct of the plot.

3. Emphasize femininity without making her stereotypical. The tricky part is that what is "feminine" is hard to define, since no two women are ever going to be exactly alike. You need to avoid things like Acceptable Feminine Goals, Career Versus Man, I Broke a Nail and other pitfalls of femininity in characters, but at the same time avoid making female readers feel like she's a dude with breasts. It's hard for me to actually recommend something here, because I'm not a girl, and I worry that anything I suggest may be interpreted the wrong way. If all else fails, try embracing stories acclaimed female protagonists.

4. When all else fails, don't sweat it. The best thing you can do is make her a character. All of the "advice" (of dubious usefulness) I just gave notwithstanding, just tell a story about this character and make it good. Don't make her a perfect woman, or an attempt to pioneer female protagonists, because that sort of thing can reek of Positive Discrimination and attempts to cover up too far in the wrong direction.

The best advice I can give, being a person with a lot of experience in writing female characters, is that a character is a character, whether she's a princess or a soldier. Forget gender and focus on making her a 3-dimensional character. Her personality should define her femininity, not the other way around.

edited 18th Jun '12 7:55:10 AM by Tehpillowstar