Usage doesn't match definition: The Ace

The way The Ace is used throughout the wiki is basically "someone so cool he's awesome". The definition in the article is "a minor character or One-Scene Wonder who is so much better than everyone else, not only do the characters hate and envy him, they feel bad about doing so, because he's just that good".

What should we do with this?

It looks like you were not the only one who noticed this problem.

If the misuse is really that bad, I wonder if the trope's description should be retooled and the original The Ace trope's meaning should be moved to another new trope. I am just wary about trying to fix the usage when there is so much of it, but then again, if someone is willing to do that then I guess we can talk about that too.

I think the place where the usage really does not fit the definition is the One-Scene Wonder part that you mentioned. I am not sure if that should be scraped from the description or examples that do not fit that part should just be scraped though.

Also, if we do decide to change the description to accommodate usage problems, I think we need to make sure that The Ace matches up with Broken Ace.

edited 27th May '11 10:37:24 AM by LouieW

I do agree that the old meaning should be moved somewhere else. Right now the trope is used for someone who is just good at nearly everything they do but not a Mary Sue. (Although its on the Mary Sue Tropes index.)

edited 27th May '11 10:45:57 AM by Raso

I think it works well as "someone really good at what they do", but with an emphasis on combat.

Huh, I could've sworn that there was no TRS link in the article itself when I made this thread...

Anyway. The way people use The Ace is basically someone who's so good at [whatever] that everyone looks up to them. An Ace Pilot is a subtrope about pilots (obviously), but almost any activity can have Aces of its own. The classic Ace is confident, friendly, and gracious (they might have a big ego, but they tend to encourage others to develop their skills rather than putting down their "inferiors"), but nearly any highly-skilled person with fans can count as an Ace. The "has fans" part is really the heart of this trope — if no one acknowledges how awesome they are, then they're not an Ace, even if they're legitimately skilled. Becoming an Ace is the goal of people trying To Be a Master.

I... started getting into article-writing mode instead of casual-description mode at some point in that paragraph. Oh well. Should we make a new False Ace article for someone who has the personality/fanbase, but not the skills?

edited 27th May '11 11:05:47 AM by NativeJovian

Isnt that really close to Ted Baxter? (just with a fanbase)

edited 27th May '11 11:08:20 AM by Raso

A Ted Baxter thinks he's The Ace, but no one else does. The Ace is legitimately skilled and has legions of fans.

I just realized that a False Ace would be a Fake Ultimate Hero. Or at least close enough that I don't think it's splittable.

Ok yeah thats the one.... Adding that as a redirect if ya dont mind.

Getting back on topic, something really needs to be done about this page. A ridiculous amount of links to the ace page refer to a character who is respected and very skilled in their field, and the current definition is a parody OF that type of character, when we don't have a page on the character type itself. The examples on the page seem to be in line with the description, but on other pages people seem to be getting confused as to what this trope actually is.

So, rewrite the page and make sure all the examples fit the new definition, and then move the old definition onto a new page called something like "parody ace" to go with "broken ace"?

edited 14th Jun '11 12:01:25 PM by Ewar

I'd like to add that the current usage of The Ace also includes characters who are not only proficient in implausibly many fields (e.g. due to Improbable Age), they are more or less peerless in-universe in several if not most or all of them.

But yeah, I agree that we should match The Ace's description to Broken Ace. BTW, what makes The Ace different from a Renaissance Man?

PS: Are we sure that "The Ace" is a good title, though? I vaguely remember coming across a few works where there were two or three characters (probably among Loads And Loads Of Characters) who all fit the mold of "ridiculously skilled, often in many fields, but not a Mary Sue".

edited 26th Jun '11 4:47:42 PM by MarqFJA