Discussion History Main / MagicFloppyDisk

--> \\\'\\\'\\\"And the draft of the spell card rules is from the same time period as the barrier, so it\\\'s pretty likely that some documentation about how the barrier works survived.\\\"\\\'\\\'

Akyuu\\\'s notes in both Reimu\\\'s character page and the Spell Card Rules section of the Unresolved Works seem to imply that they were created with Reimu\\\'s involvement, and that they\\\'re not related to the mock duels and showboating that the youkai did after Gensokyo\\\'s founding. For all we know they\\\'re there to explain how things worked between ZUN\\\'s PC-98 games and Windows games.

While we\\\'re talking about Akyuu, let\\\'s underline the fact she admits she\\\'s an UnreliableNarrator:

\\\"Somehow I know about things that happened during my life as Aichi, and even as Are, but unfortunately my memories of Gensokyo in ancient times are not very clear.\\\"

\\\"I first began compiling the materials for the Gensokyo Chronicles about the time I turned 18 as Aichi, which was over a thousand years ago. Literacy was not as wide-spread in those days, so the Gensokyo Chronicles were more something to be left for later generations than something that was to be read by my contemporaries. It\\\'s hard even for me to read the writing of the Chronicles from that era, so it didn\\\'t serve much use as materials for this compilation.\\\"

If she can\\\'t quite recall what Gensokyo was like in ancient times, and she didn\\\'t use her early Chronicles for materials, how can we be sure she\\\'s correctly telling the history of Gensokyo? Especially since Gensokyo, as she puts it in the foreword, is \\\"a closed world, without any humans that keep historical records\\\" while \\\"youkai remember distorted versions of past events, so Gensokyo could not face the truth particularly well.\\\"

--> \\\'\\\'\\\"And the youkai explicitly need an antagonistic relationship with humans to survive. Is it really hard to believe that people denying that they exist would be a problem? \\\"\\\'\\\'

If there are places where it\\\'s stated that they \\\'\\\'can\\\'t\\\'\\\' survive without eating or attacking humans, then there\\\'s places that contradict those statements where it\\\'s said only their \\\'\\\'powers\\\'\\\' will gradually vanish (see aforementioned spell card rules)--not their \\\'\\\'existence.\\\'\\\'

The \\\'\\\'problem\\\'\\\' here is that a lot of people take it to mean they will cease to exist from denial of their existence. On the other hand, things like \\\'\\\'Perfect Memento\\\'\\\' (ESPECIALLY the stuff not written by Akyuu) instead says that Youkai will grow powerless if they don\\\'t exercise their powers--which isn\\\'t the same thing as vanishing just because a lot of people don\\\'t believe you exist.

Everywhere I\\\'ve listed, the viewpoint of the tropers adding those examples is that the mere existence of Youkai depend on people believing they exist, and if people disbelieve in them, they vanish.

So far, I\\\'ve seen nothing that confirms this viewpoint in ZUN\\\'s stuff. It seems more like part of the {{fanon}} that permeates the fandom.

--> \\\'\\\'\\\"And the draft of the spell card rules is from the same time period as the barrier, so it\\\'s pretty likely that some documentation about how the barrier works survived.\\\"\\\'\\\'

Akyuu\\\'s notes in both Reimu\\\'s character page and the Spell Card Rules section of the Unresolved Works seem to imply that they were created with Reimu\\\'s involvement, and that they\\\'re not related to the mock duels and showboating that the youkai did after Gensokyo\\\'s founding. For all we know they\\\'re there to explain how things worked between ZUN\\\'s PC-98 games and Windows games.

While we\\\'re talking about Akyuu, let\\\'s underline the fact she admits she\\\'s an UnreliableNarrator:

\\\"Somehow I know about things that happened during my life as Aichi, and even as Are, but unfortunately my memories of Gensokyo in ancient times are not very clear.\\\"

\\\"I first began compiling the materials for the Gensokyo Chronicles about the time I turned 18 as Aichi, which was over a thousand years ago. Literacy was not as wide-spread in those days, so the Gensokyo Chronicles were more something to be left for later generations than something that was to be read by my contemporaries. It\\\'s hard even for me to read the writing of the Chronicles from that era, so it didn\\\'t serve much use as materials for this compilation.\\\"

If she can\\\'t quite recall what Gensokyo was like in ancient times, and she didn\\\'t use her early Chronicles for materials, how can we be sure she\\\'s correctly telling the history of Gensokyo? Especially since Gensokyo, as she puts it in the foreword, is \\\"a closed world, without any humans that keep historical records\\\" while \\\"youkai remember distorted versions of past events, so Gensokyo could not face the truth particularly well.\\\"

--> \\\'\\\'\\\"And the youkai explicitly need an antagonistic relationship with humans to survive. Is it really hard to believe that people denying that they exist would be a problem? \\\"\\\'\\\'

If there are places where it\\\'s stated that they \\\'\\\'can\\\'t\\\'\\\' survive without eating or attacking humans, then there\\\'s places that contradict those statements where it\\\'s said only their \\\'\\\'powers\\\'\\\' will gradually vanish (see aforementioned spell card rules)--not their \\\'\\\'existence.\\\'\\\'

The \\\'\\\'problem\\\'\\\' here is that a lot of people take it to mean they will cease to exist from denial of their existence, not that they will grow powerless if they don\\\'t exercise their powers--which isn\\\'t the same thing as vanishing just because a lot of people don\\\'t believe you exist.

Everywhere I\\\'ve listed, the viewpoint of the tropers adding those examples is that the mere existence of Youkai depend on people believing they exist, and if people disbelieve in them, they vanish.

So far, I\\\'ve seen nothing that confirms this viewpoint in ZUN\\\'s stuff. It seems more like part of the {{fanon}} that permeates the fandom.

--> \\\'\\\'\\\"And the draft of the spell card rules is from the same time period as the barrier, so it\\\'s pretty likely that some documentation about how the barrier works survived.\\\"\\\'\\\'

Akyuu\\\'s notes in both Reimu\\\'s character page and the Spell Card Rules section of the Unresolved Works seem to imply that they were created with Reimu\\\'s involvement, and that they\\\'re not related to the mock duels and showboating that the youkai did after Gensokyo\\\'s founding. For all we know they\\\'re there to explain how things worked between ZUN\\\'s PC-98 games and Windows games.

While we\\\'re talking about Akyuu, let\\\'s underline the fact she admits she\\\'s an UnreliableNarrator:

\\\"Somehow I know about things that happened during my life as Aichi, and even as Are, but unfortunately my memories of Gensokyo in ancient times are not very clear.\\\"

\\\"I first began compiling the materials for the Gensokyo Chronicles about the time I turned 18 as Aichi, which was over a thousand years ago. Literacy was not as wide-spread in those days, so the Gensokyo Chronicles were more something to be left for later generations than something that was to be read by my contemporaries. It\\\'s hard even for me to read the writing of the Chronicles from that era, so it didn\\\'t serve much use as materials for this compilation.\\\"

If she can\\\'t quite recall what Gensokyo was like in ancient times, and she didn\\\'t use her early Chronicles for materials, how can we be sure she\\\'s correctly telling the history of Gensokyo? Especially since Gensokyo, as she puts it in the foreword, is \\\"a closed world, without any humans that keep historical records\\\" while \\\"youkai remember distorted versions of past events, so Gensokyo could not face the truth particularly well.\\\"

--> \\\'\\\'\\\"And the youkai explicitly need an antagonistic relationship with humans to survive. Is it really hard to believe that people denying that they exist would be a problem? \\\"\\\'\\\'

Yes, it is a problem. If there are places where it\\\'s stated that they \\\'\\\'can\\\'t\\\'\\\' survive without eating or attacking humans, then there\\\'s places that contradict those statements where it\\\'s said only their \\\'\\\'powers\\\'\\\' will gradually vanish (see aforementioned spell card rules)--not their \\\'\\\'existence.\\\'\\\'

The problem is that a lot of people take it to mean they will cease to exist from denial of their existence, not that they will grow powerless if they don\\\'t exercise their powers--which isn\\\'t the same thing as vanishing just because a lot of people don\\\'t believe you exist.

Everywhere I\\\'ve listed, the viewpoint of the tropers adding those examples is that the mere existence of Youkai depend on people believing they exist, and if people disbelieve in them, they vanish.

So far, I\\\'ve seen nothing that confirms this viewpoint in ZUN\\\'s stuff. It seems more like part of the {{fanon}} that permeates the fandom.

--> \\\'\\\'\\\"And the draft of the spell card rules is from the same time period as the barrier, so it\\\'s pretty likely that some documentation about how the barrier works survived.\\\"\\\'\\\'

Akyuu\\\'s notes in both Reimu\\\'s character page and the Spell Card Rules section of the Unresolved Works seem to imply that they were created with Reimu\\\'s involvement, and that they\\\'re not related to the mock duels and showboating that the youkai did after Gensokyo\\\'s founding. For all we know they\\\'re there to explain how things worked between ZUN\\\'s PC-98 games and Windows games.

While we\\\'re talking about Akyuu, let\\\'s underline the fact she admits she\\\'s an UnreliableNarrator:

\\\"Somehow I know about things that happened during my life as Aichi, and even as Are, but unfortunately my memories of Gensokyo in ancient times are not very clear.\\\"

\\\"I first began compiling the materials for the Gensokyo Chronicles about the time I turned 18 as Aichi, which was over a thousand years ago. Literacy was not as wide-spread in those days, so the Gensokyo Chronicles were more something to be left for later generations than something that was to be read by my contemporaries. It\\\'s hard even for me to read the writing of the Chronicles from that era, so it didn\\\'t serve much use as materials for this compilation.\\\"

If she can\\\'t quite recall what Gensokyo was like in ancient times, and she didn\\\'t use her early Chronicles for materials, how can we be sure she\\\'s correctly telling the history of Gensokyo? Especially since Gensokyo, as she puts it in the foreword, is \\\"a closed world, without any humans that keep historical records\\\" while \\\"youkai remember distorted versions of past events, so Gensokyo could not face the truth particularly well.\\\"

--> \\\'\\\'\\\"And the youkai explicitly need an antagonistic relationship with humans to survive. Is it really hard to believe that people denying that they exist would be a problem? \\\"\\\'\\\'

Yes, it is a problem. If there are places where it\\\'s stated that they \\\'\\\'can\\\'t\\\'\\\' survive without eating or attacking humans, then there\\\'s places that contradict those statements where it\\\'s said only their \\\'\\\'powers\\\'\\\' will gradually vanish (see aforementioned spell card rules)--not their \\\'\\\'existence.\\\'\\\'

The problem is that a lot of people take it to mean they will cease to exist from denial of their existence, not that they will grow powerless if they don\\\'t exercise their powers--which isn\\\'t the same thing.

Everywhere I\\\'ve listed, the viewpoint of the tropers adding those examples is that the mere existence of Youkai depend on people believing they exist, and if people disbelieve in them, they vanish.

So far, I\\\'ve seen nothing that confirms this viewpoint in ZUN\\\'s stuff. It seems more like part of the {{fanon}} that permeates the fandom.

--> \\\'\\\'\\\"And the draft of the spell card rules is from the same time period as the barrier, so it\\\'s pretty likely that some documentation about how the barrier works survived.\\\"\\\'\\\'

Akyuu\\\'s notes in both Reimu\\\'s character page and the Spell Card Rules section of the Unresolved Works seem to imply that they were created with Reimu\\\'s involvement, and that they\\\'re not related to the mock duels and showboating that the youkai did after Gensokyo\\\'s founding. For all we know they\\\'re there to explain how things worked between ZUN\\\'s PC-98 games and Windows games.

While we\\\'re talking about Akyuu, let\\\'s underline the fact she admits she\\\'s an UnreliableNarrator:

\\\"Somehow I know about things that happened during my life as Aichi, and even as Are, but unfortunately my memories of Gensokyo in ancient times are not very clear.\\\"

\\\"I first began compiling the materials for the Gensokyo Chronicles about the time I turned 18 as Aichi, which was over a thousand years ago. Literacy was not as wide-spread in those days, so the Gensokyo Chronicles were more something to be left for later generations than something that was to be read by my contemporaries. It\\\'s hard even for me to read the writing of the Chronicles from that era, so it didn\\\'t serve much use as materials for this compilation.\\\"

If she can\\\'t quite recall what Gensokyo was like in ancient times, and she didn\\\'t use her early Chronicles for materials, how can we be sure she\\\'s correctly telling the history of Gensokyo? Especially since Gensokyo, as she puts it in the foreword, is \\\"a closed world, without any humans that keep historical records\\\" while \\\"youkai remember distorted versions of past events, so Gensokyo could not face the truth particularly well.\\\"

--> \\\'\\\'\\\"And the youkai explicitly need an antagonistic relationship with humans to survive. Is it really hard to believe that people denying that they exist would be a problem? \\\"\\\'\\\'

Yes, it is a problem. If there are places where it\\\'s stated that they \\\'\\\'can\\\'t\\\'\\\' survive without eating or attacking humans, then there\\\'s places that contradict those statements where it\\\'s said only their \\\'\\\'powers\\\'\\\' will gradually vanish (see aforementioned spell card rules)--not their \\\'\\\'existence.\\\'\\\'

The problem is that a lot of people take it to mean they will cease to exist from denial of their existence, not that they will grow powerless if they don\\\'t exercise their powers.

Everywhere I\\\'ve listed, the viewpoint of the tropers adding those examples is that the mere existence of Youkai depend on people believing they exist, and if people disbelieve in them, they vanish.

So far, I\\\'ve seen nothing that confirms this viewpoint in ZUN\\\'s stuff. It seems more like part of the {{fanon}} that permeates the fandom.

I must humbly beg to differ with the article: I was still using floppies in both hacking /and/ cracking contexts until about 2006 (I should add that, while still a hacker, I\\\'m now a /reformed/ cracker. Well, semi-reformed, anyway. Also I never did anything illegal, just youthful japes and hijinks). Some people just really are dumb enough to secure the CD drive but not the floppy drive. (Although, this was a school IT system, and everyone knows school IT departments aren\\\'t exactly a magnet for top talent)