Great! And maybe she follow in Russi Taylor's foosteps and bring tons of memories to everyone like she did.
Redmess
We've heard plenty of talk about racism in Disney movies, but here
is a blog post talking about all the antisemitic coding going on in Disney movies. Mother Gothel is the main example, but this extends to characters like the witch in Snow White as well.
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Not bad actually. She sounds a lot like Russi.
Edited by Psi001 on Jul 21st 2020 at 12:33:51 PM
So, I found this article that's about discussing how Disney could incorporate LGBTQ main/recurring characters into their animated projects. I'd say they have a better chance with tv given how many LGBTQ characters they've shown in them (mostly one shots, but it's still a few tv shows) compared to the one animated movie (Onward) that had a character like that.
Disasturbator
> is a blog post talking about all the antisemitic coding going on in Disney movies. Mother Gothel is the main example, but this extends to characters like the witch in Snow White as well.
I skim read it and the impression I get is that Mother Gothel is an absurd reach but the witch is probably a valid example
New theme music also a box
Professional Moldy Fig/Curmudgeon
Because she has a big nose?...
I think that says more about the person writing the article than the film.
Edited by Aldo930 on Jul 21st 2020 at 6:20:49 AM
"They say I'm old fashioned, and live in the past, but sometimes I think progress progresses too fast."
Disasturbator
A big hooked nose,it's pretty damn noticeable
New theme music also a box
Professional Moldy Fig/Curmudgeon
"Big hooked nose" does not automatically equal anti-Semitic portrayal of a Jew.
You need more evidence than that to build an argument.
"They say I'm old fashioned, and live in the past, but sometimes I think progress progresses too fast."
Redmess
It was also the black curly hair, the plot about stealing fair haired children, the greediness...
Maybe actually read the post first instead of skim reading and dismissing.
Optimism is a duty.
Disasturbator
Again I think they're gasping at straws
New theme music also a box
Dagded Dujardin
Gothel isn't really greedy, tho. She's more interested in keeping herself young and beautiful than money. And she only kidnapped Rapunzel for her hair. Otherwise she shows no interest in kidnapping fair hated children
"Bingo! If two species hate each other, they will wipe each other out on their own."
Disasturbator
You could argue she's very greedy hoarding someone away so they can live forever
New theme music also a box
Redmess
We should also be careful, as the article notes, to dismiss the comparison from a position of privilege. Just because the stereotype does not seem relevant or obvious to us, does not mean it doesn't feel so for Jewish people.
Optimism is a duty.
She's supposed to be based on Cher.
I've heard arguments that Gothel is coded as an anti-Romani stereotype before. Her being an antisemitic stereotype is news to me, though.
The Camp Crystal Lake Slasher
I thought Gothel's vice was more about vanity than greed. If she was greedy, she'd be killing the king and queen and enjoying their riches, not hoarding the princess to look young forever.
Jason has come back to kill for Mommy.
Dagded Dujardin
Yep. Her sin is more pride than anything. She does not desire more than she already has. She desires to keep her fountain of youth for herself
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
I think stuff about Gothel has merit, as I’ve heard similarly before. I mean, I still like her character and think she’s a good villain, but still, I think the points about her are valid, and it’s something to keep in mind.
Oh God! Natural light!
Redmess
What is also striking is that early designs for Gothel did not have these characteristics. Someone made a conscious choice to give her a crooked nose to make her more "evil". And given that having a crooked nose is an antisemitic stereotype often used to depict witches (see Snow White), yeah, that is a little problematic.
It seems the underlying problem is that we should get rid of that witch sterotype in general, as it seems to often be based on minority stereotypes.
Optimism is a duty.
Professional Moldy Fig/Curmudgeon
I need to reiterate, a character having a crooked nose or a big nose is not automatically anti-Semitic. Read the top comment here for a good idea of why witches popularly have crooked noses.
Edited by Aldo930 on Jul 21st 2020 at 11:09:43 AM
"They say I'm old fashioned, and live in the past, but sometimes I think progress progresses too fast."
Is stealing kids from their beds an anti-semitic stereotype? I feel like I've seen that as a Romani stereotype, but not a Jewish one. I do recall that in the novel of The Hunchback of Notre Dame, Esmeralda herself is in fact a white Frenchwoman who was stolen from her crib by Romani and then raised as one of them.
Professional Moldy Fig/Curmudgeon
No to the former... probably yes to the latter, actually.
"They say I'm old fashioned, and live in the past, but sometimes I think progress progresses too fast."
Redmess
Again, the point was that it is not so on its own, but it is in combination with a lot of other things are are not antisemitic in isolation.
It is the package, not the individual parts, that make it into an anti-semitic stereotype.
I don't know, but if Jews are saying they are out there, I'm willing to take their word for it.
Edited by Redmess on Jul 21st 2020 at 10:29:34 AM
Optimism is a duty.
Hook with a robot arm makes him surprisingly more menacing.
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