We Are All Pokemon Trainers Discussion

Re: Tera Types, those "special encounters" really shouldn't be too difficult to justify occurring, since they're more or less randomly distributed anyway. Existing Pokemon from outside of Paldea, though, should probably default to one of their standard types like usual.

Of course, there is canonically a way to change Tera Types anyway! And it's not even a super secret thing, it's just got the (absurdly high) 50 Tera Shard requirement. Tbh, for narrative convenience I'd even suggest cutting that limit down some vague amount.

The Delta thing, though, is a very interesting point! Holon has similar crystals, after all, which are theorized to be responsible for type changes too. I think it would be cool if they were in fact related phenomena — obviously we can't say they're the same type of crystals since we don't know what DLC might hold, but either way, I feel like there's a reasonable case for Delta Species Tera Types to be randomly distributed.

So broadly speaking, I would be fine with occasionally allowing alternate default Tera types in a similar system to how we handle shinies like a "long as it's not too often, go ahead" way, but one aspect makes me not totally sure: The fact that alternate tera types are always shown in the wild as a result of the Pokemon Terastalizing. If we don't think that's significant I don't think it's a problem but if we do then maybe it should be limited to those defaults. But also since it is possible to change Tera Types you can always make use of that.

For deltas, I figure since we tend to go with that being an inherent thing that it should just be one of their types As a delta in most cases.

Four Perils

I'm kinda feeling like multiple Treasures of Ruin turning to mons might be a better way to go.

Dudunsparce

Gotta think about that one, we might end up running into issues if next thing you know Dunsparce has always been known to have an evolution, which is how the game seems to treat it.

Space Lizards

Well, with the strong implications from the post-postgame that the Paradox Mons might actually be not actually from the past or future but are instead birthed from the CU with the help of the mysterious disc legendary, it might be doable, the Great Crater is approximately one million years old after all.

Paradox Mons

Going with UB treatment.

Terastallization

I figure like what we did with Gigantamax capable mons it's up to you, or what Crow said.

Though I kinda feel like we're getting a little lost in the reeds here and should be focusing more on what Paldea's going to look like in the immediate future rather than on things that aren't going to be directly relevant for a while.

I really don't like the idea of multiple Treasures of Ruin. It feels contrary to the concept, and then we would have to explain why they're not causing disasters constantly. There's not much point in sealing one set of Treasures away if it's easily replicable, and then the stakes are meaningless anyway.

Unless I am completely misinterpreting what you mean? In which case, some further elaboration is probably necessary.

To the end of "What's Paldea going to look like in the immediate future", what sort of stuff do you mean? Like, the state of the Academy? The Gyms? The Titans? Team Star? What we're establishing is the basic knowledge of what happened with the story? What sort of stuff do we want to do for the arc plot? Whether people are signing up for the academy or doing their own thing? Whether the Treasure Hunt Independent Study is going on again? Some other stuff I'm missing?

Edited by CorvusAtrox on Dec 18th 2022 at 9:26:13 AM

I'll answer that one later.

Cyclizar

I was gonna suggest that they might have something similar to how Ride Pokémon work in Alola with Cyclizar if we don't want to go traveling down the road to Levinica to catch them. Canonically they work basically the same as the -raidons except they lack the ability to glide and possibly can't jump as high.

Paldea Arc Proper

So the questions and my tentative answers thus far:

1) What makes the J-Team as a group head to Paldea?

Like, I already have my personal plan being RP!Tagg accepting an offer to be a research fellow/guest lecturer at the Academy to strengthen ties between the Paldea League and the PEFE since when your PC has around 12 Hall of Fames on his belt there's probably not much they'd be able to teach him at this point.

But that leaves everyone else. My tentative idea is since the School is what brought the J-Team to Sinnoh, it's most likely School activity that causes them as a group to head to Paldea.

2) We've brought up how getting mons with alternate Tera Types might work, but how are we getting Tera Orbs in characters hands to begin with? How simple or complex do we want that to be?

Since Tera Orbs are given primarily to Academy faculty, League employees, and students doing advanced classes (Nemona has the clout to get you one early), I think we can probably finagle them as something given to Academy students who wish to do the Gym challenge (I figure we can just say the J-Team arrives shortly before they begin that year's Treasure Hunt), though that does lead to another question...

3) Do we want to railroad our Victory Road track PCs into getting involved with the Academy since it's so enmeshed with the League?

If so another way we can get there could be Geeta inviting the J-Team over since she's constantly trying to make the Paldea League stronger and who else would be better suited for something like that than the J-Team who isn't already a resident of the region?

Basically making the jokes about the J-Team being unofficial League stress testers canon.

3a) The uniforms. Are we gonna stick to our Academy-attending PCs having to wear the uniform no matter what? Only on campus? They've relaxed the rules enough that as long as you have some article of orange or purple clothing plus the Academy's symbol that counts?

4) The Titans. Is fighting them going to be an Academy sanctioned thing, or something PCs just do on their own? Will it be possible to earn Titan Badges? Are we sticking to solely the canon Titans or will they be others?

5) Team Star? Canonically Team Star gets folded into the League as the Star Training Centers or STCs. Since you can rematch the Star Bosses and do raids and it's basically a mini-Gym challenge onto itself, do we want to have Penny/Cassiopeia as potentially an in-universe (Possibly optional) secret boss for anyone who manages to clear all five Star bases? Has Ortega fixed the Starmobiles in time for J-Teamers to battle them?

Dudunsparce

I assume that's what would happen in the games, yeah. In this case I would be asking to ignore a bit of game canon in favor of the Dunsparce expert discovering something new about the species.

Dududunsparce

The simplest way to do that without worrying about it getting retconned later would probably be Pef being the one behind the recent study mentioned in the Violet Dudunsparce entry for Three-Section Dudunsparce that figured out that it's genetics that determines what form of Dudunsparce a Dunsparce evolved into, but if we want to go with something spicier, combined with an idea I already had in mind for explaining why we'd yet to encounter Dudunsparce onscreen before we have:

As we know, Dunsparce evolves via level up after learning Hyper Drill. I'd imagine that to a lot of people it's hard to tell the difference between Hyper Drill and Drill Run at a glance so there may have been controversy until relatively recently over how one evolves Dunsparce into Dudunsparce until Pef settled things once and for all.

Why didn't we encounter Dudunsparce before? I was gonna go with Dunsparce knowing Hyper Drill to be super common in Paldea (and presumably future regions), but extremely rare in the other previous regions visited where Dunsparce can be caught, though recently Dunsparce in pre-Gen IX regions are starting to exhibit the ability to use Hyper Drill more often as well.

Also, Dudunsparce can literally drill through solid bedrock, and as such live very deep underground, with the only place you find wild ones being the very bottom level of Area Zero, which is a giant hole in the earth.

Paldea

So, as Tagg mentioned, one thing that could potentially bring the J-Team to Paldea is School activity there, which begs the question of what exactly that activity would be aside from standard evil.

This is just a thought, but what if the School were after the Treasures of Ruin, having recently heard about them. Whether or not they actually get them is irrelevant for now, and the answer would likely be no, but it would give their efforts there a tangible goal. It also works since the classic evil team fair is getting a legendary, and since Paldea doesn't really have one the School could easily fill that gap.

Again, just a thought and if people hate it that's fair.

The School having an interest in the Treasures of Ruin would actually work really well with the reason I was interested in one of Chi-Yu's beads in particular (or, really, any single piece of a Treasure of Ruin, the beads just felt most thematically fitting). The most pertinent information is that a School character will be shown to have already obtained the one (1) piece; I can divulge specifics if necessary, though if possible I would prefer to keep it to D Ms with anyone especially concerned, so that the full surprise factor isn't lost.

I think I could spare Gabriel for that, he's very much a "can I turn this into a weapon for the School" kind of person so item hunting would be up his alley.

I am fine with The School being the reason they head there and helping as League Stress Testers along with that being a reason they get Tera Orbs. I will say that Dune was talking about similar stuff with Battle Academy and Geeta so bringing that up here so we're all on the same page would be helpful.

I am personally in full support of Team Star-style Uniform Anarchy but considering they got reprimanded for that I'd lean something like... "You're expected to wear the uniform on campus but you're generally not going to get reprimanded as long as you wear at least a little orange/purple corresponding with your house."

Personally I'd recommend treating the three different tracks like... The Gym Challenge is the "official" track, the way to get Champ Ranking, the typical badge system and all and what the J-Team is helping stress test.

The Star Training Centers are an "unofficial" but still school sponsored track at this point. You can take them on for an alternative way to show your strength and/or to get to know Team Star better, the J-Team would also probably help stress test them.

I would say that with Team Star I'd be in favor of like... "If you beat all five then they're like 'hey, you've beaten all five of us, maybe you could try challenging Big Boss Penny' but I don't think that flavor wise it should be as necessarily strongly obligated to do so in the way that the league challenge encourages more distinct steps. Ortega getting the Starmobiles up again sounds fun for those who wanna do that, though. J-Team stress testing those could also be helpful.

The Titans... I'm 50/50 on to what extent they should count as a Track... Let me get into that...

So I'm not exactly sure how to describe what I see Fighting the Titans as... Like, if we're talking as a stress-testing sort of thing I guess it feels like it would fit more as a thing that our P Cs do that's at most Regulated by the Academy. The Academy might help make sure the Titans don't get upended or too winded/disturbed by a bunch of trainers wanting to battle them. I think Arven would still be in charge of handing out badges if you wanna go that route but I think it'd probably just be like a "walk up to him and tell him you did it" kind of thing.

That said, the Titans as a result of this could also form sort of a loose network among themselves and decide "hey, you want my herbs, you gotta prove yourself in a challenge" and them also making sure that the herbs are still fine and people don't take too many.

Though the fact you Asked about additional Titans and I want to play a bit with the "making sure too many herbs aren't taken, I actually wanted to ask about that: Would we be fine with an additional Titan being Created as a result of someone collecting enough Herba Mystica? I am not sure if they will permanently be such and am fine working out details of How that gets handled but would like to keep exactly who/what I have in mind for that under wraps for now.

Edited by CorvusAtrox on Dec 19th 2022 at 12:02:54 PM

Dudududunsparce

Oh I'm <em>very</em> much down for Pef being the one to discover the evolution wholesale.

To get nitpicky, they do only seem to exist in the Area Zero crater in the wild? And something tells me documenting the local fauna wasn't the game's professor's top priority, even if they weren't a bedrock-burrowing species. 😛

But even if that weren't the case, it's just fun for the local Dunsparce expert to strut her Dunsparce expertise. Whether people knew about it beforehand vs. people having found out because of her seems a fairly minor consideration, in the face of that. o3o

Treasures of Ruin

Bitty: Oooh, the phylactery in multiple fragments is a neat aesthetic. As for why said fragments might be floating about, personally I think it'd be kinda funny if some of the pins came...pre-pulled, as it were; the condition of needing a pure heart seems poorly-thought-out in a Region that gathers Pokémon enthusiasts of all ages and scatters them to the winds, telling them to find a Special Thing to characterize their journey and the nature of their bonds. :P

Tera Types

Oooh, the direct connection to Holon is a neat one.

As far as how you find Pokémon with divergent types, or alter them once you've identified them, it doesn't seem like a particularly heroic effort? They are just walking about, and while the method for changing said Type is obtuse, it's fairly easily accomplished if you know the right folk.

Tagg's earlier comments had me thinking, and I do like the idea of teaching new generations. So officially Silas will be there as a sort of educator, part of a Asimov outreach program to teach the young generation about Pokemon from space.

What do you mean this may actively tie him into the Paradox stuff and the futuremons? I have no idea what you're talking about.

Gabi will be there and will hopefully be more of my focus since Silas is gonna be more of a background detail.

rrrrrrrruined

Oh, I've been thinking of the same "a few pins pre-pulled" thing, and I'm very fond of it. I imagine some of the easier-to-reach stakes have had something between a Thor's Hammer challenge and a hazing ritual associated with them, where kids have been dared to go and pull the things up. :P

I've also been thinking about how both the stakes and the errant pieces can come into play — and I actually might have a solution that hits everything.

Let's say that half of each Treasure is sealed in the shrines. Two beads shut away at the top of a waterfall, the hilt of a sword trapped in a mountainside, a broken cauldron buried in a hill, an incomplete script of tablets within a cliff face. And, so they never cross paths with their other halves, the rest are scattered throughout the world — museums, black markets, or even left alone in the most desolate areas to be forgotten. Surely that would render them useless, right?

But it's never that easy.

The free pieces are still mingling with humanity, so humanity still feeds them. Though the blade of Chien-Pao may have no hilt, it has been crafted into other weapons. Though Wo-Chien's tablets have gaps, there is still enough to be pieced together. A single bead may mean less, but it can still be worn. And even a shattered cauldron can sit in a museum, to be observed by the masses. And so they manage to grow still.

So, given enough time, these Fragments of Ruin manage to learn how to take form on their own. They are weak without their other halves — an unbalanced Ting-Lu fawn with its head weighed down on one side, a Chien-Pao kitten with an inconvenient snaggletooth, a pair of half-blind Chi-Yu fries, and small clusters of tablets bound together into feeble Wo-Chien larva. Knocking them out in these forms could set them back weeks or even months, and it's just so    frustrating   .

Within the shrines, though? The other halves are waiting, biding their time. The sealed Ting-Lu has rebuilt its vessel with earth; Chien-Pao has grown a second tooth of ice; Chi-Yu burns bright, with both eyes present and half-lidded; unmarked plant stalks fill the gaps in Wo-Chien's tablet-clad shell. They are formidable, should the seals be broken, but still incomplete. But once the seals are broken, the toothpaste can't be put back in the tube, as it were.

In other words, there are indeed multiple of each Treasure of Ruin, one of each trapped behind obsidian stakes, but there is also only one of each, if given the chance to reunite.

Edited by BittersweetNSour on Dec 19th 2022 at 5:00:57 AM

Dudunsparce

Amendment to my statement on this, I did remember I actually did have a reason for someone in the distant past to have a Dudunsparce, so If Pef discovered it I'd be more if favor of a "classified by science and widely known to the public" than "she is the first person to know Dudunsparce exists at all ever"

Going To Paldea

1. I vote School activity since we haven't reached the endgame for them yet, and am cool with Treasures Of Ruin as a motivation

2. I'm cool with people actually having to do the classes

3. I am also cool with canon stress testers. :P

3a. Vote Team Star Uniform Anarchy

4. Cool with people fighting the Titans

5. Cool with people fighting Team Star and Penny and them getting the starmobiles back

Edited by Umbramatic on Dec 19th 2022 at 6:01:06 AM

School Nurse

Following on from a discussion on the discord, I should like to introduce a new member of the School's faculty - The School Nurse, who is known only as Nurse.

What is she like? Well, she is the one that patches up all of the Schoolkids and Templars when things go wrong in the field, and she does this in such a way that they will never forget those injuries, because she'll make sure that they hurt before they heal. She does this through a false veneer of deeply caring, when truly she deeply despises her charges, hence her treatments being extra painful. She tells them that this pain is necessary for growth.

Her only pokémon is a Tangrowth - this is because her methods are not so much about reducing pain, and so Tangrowth is necessary to hold the patients in place while she does her treatments. Tangrowth is fine with this, as she shares her owner's rather sadistic nature.

In terms of appearance, Nurse wears a modified version of the standard nurse outfit, modified of course to have body armour included for the event that one of her patients gets aggressive. She has the appearance of a rather vain woman in her late forties to early fifties, who has obviously had some work done. Her hair, similarly, has not been allowed to go grey and has been aggressively dyed blonde.

Here are a few miscellaneous Gen IX things on my end, the second half of that "more later"

A Class In Crystal

Given what's been said about Tera Orbs and the necessary classes, but ALSO given violent brainworms I'm having, is it OK if I have someone obtain a Tera Orb and THEN when found to have it be forced to take the classes? Kind of backwards but I have an idea.

The Cast Herd G R O W S

Here are some NPC (minor) characters I'd like to introduce over the course of this arc! They may be promoted to PC (major) depending on how much I enjoy writing them, as per usual.

Because I Made A Shitpost About A Grass Gym Leader And Got Attached

Name: Bromelia

Age: 21

Gender: Female

Ethnicity: White Spanish

Appearance: pic!◊

Organization Ties: Paldea Leauge

Region of origin: Paldea

Backstory: Bromelia is an energetic, competitive sort who is in training with the Paldea Leauge so she can be assigned as a gym leader somewhere, somehow. She aspires to be a Grass gym leader and trains entirely Grass types. She resents Grass types being seen as simple and passive and wants to show the type can have more of an edge.

(I know I already had a Grass specialist technically but she's also technically kind of dead so shhh)

Mons:

Species: Arbolivia (Starter)

Nickname: Olivia

Gender: Female

Ability: Seed Sower

Personality/Bio: Shy, quiet. Gets flustered in battle.

Species: Carnivine

Nickname: Petey

Gender: Male

Ability: Levitate

Personality/Bio: Mischievous, likes to spook people. Helps Bromelia come up with gym puzzles.

Species: Eldegoss

Nickname: Dandy

Gender: Male

Ability: Regenerator

Personality/Bio: Fancy, flamboyant. Hates dirt and grime.

Species: Scovillain

Nickname: Habanero

Gender: Female

Ability: Chlorophyll

Personality/Bio: For obvious reasons, a fiery temper. Antsy and impatient.

Species: Brambleghast

Nickname: Sundown

Gender: Male

Ability: Wind Rider

Personality/Bio: Cowboy-iish type with a mysterious past. Quiet but quick to attack.

Species: Toedscruel

Nickname: Lena

Gender: Female

Ability: Mycellium Might

Personality/Bio: Aspiring evil mushroom queen. Very loyal to Bromelia.

Because I'm Doing A Character That Exists In Every One Of My Universes Somehow And This Is The WAAPT Version

Name: Calabria

Age: 22

Gender: Female

Ethnicity: Greek/Romani

Appearance: pic!◊

Organization Ties: ???

Region of origin: [Greece]

Backstory: Superficially an elegant beauty, Calabria has a rough and tough personality that causes her to roam looking for strong opponents. She seeks revenge against some mysterious foe - all that's clear is it's not The School.

(She has a Scylla motif, so her team trends toward very monster-y and serpent-y mons, or mons evocative of mythology.)

Mons:

Species: Hydreigon (Starter)

Nickname: Takhisis

Gender: Female

Ability: Levitate

Personality/Bio: Maniacal overlady.... That has a soft spot for cute things.

Species: Midday Lycanroc

Nickname: Lang

Gender: Male

Ability: Keen Eye

Personality/Bio: Arrogant type that wants to bring evildoers to justice at any cost.

Species: Paldean Tauros (Aqua Breed)

Nickname: Asterius

Gender: Male

Ability: Intimidate

Personality/Bio: Kind of a shy boy. Very loyal to his teammates.

Species: Orthworm

Nickname: Paul

Gender: Male

Ability: Earth Eater

Personality/Bio: Edgy type. Often spaces out.

Because He's From My Character Backlog And Ooo, Spooky!

Name: Cincinnatus

Age: ???

Gender: Male

Ethnicity: ???

Appearance: pic!◊

Organization Ties: ???

Region of origin: ???

Backstory: Who is this masked, robed, hooded figure? What does he want? Whatever the case he's going to be weird and flamboyant and ~torment~ the J-Team and associates!

(Prefers but is not limited to "cool" or "elegant" mons)

Mons:

Species: Ceruledge (Starter)

Nickname: Ethel

Gender: Female

Ability: Flash Fire

Personality/Bio: Level-headed, steadfast, chill, though her Trainer tests her patience

Species: Shiny Bergmite

Nickname: Pykrete

Gender: Female

Ability: Own Tempo

Personality/Bio: Nervous little girl, tends to hide in Cincinattius' robe to keep it cool

Species: Espathra

Nickname: Tamaki

Gender: Male

Ability: Opportunist

Personality/Bio: Alnmost as flamboyant as his Trainer, but easily flustered

Do note that while I posted their profiles way earlier this is also the arc I wanted to introduce Michelle Macraul and Kuroi Kiri in; the reason being as soon as I saw that Paldea was based off the Iberian peninsula I postponed all my Macraul-related plans until we could go there because it's... closer to home for them.

Edited by Umbramatic on Dec 22nd 2022 at 7:04:46 AM

Umbra: I am all for being roped into classes because someone found out you have a Tera Orb :P

Also, any further thoughts or concerns re: Treasures of Ruin?

Bitty: Not from me

Independent of Paldea stuff...

Origami Army Recruitment

Now that the first chapter of the Origami King media arc is over I'm gonna go ahead and re-open recruitment for participants. Enough people have dropped out that RN It's just me, Tagg, and Pent, and while I COULD feasibly go ahead with it with just us it's better if we have more people. No knowledge of the game is necessary, I streamlined and removed a lot of the mechanics and it's mostly a condensed version of the plot we're following. Time Shenanigans and the episodic nature of the arc means your character won't be trapped forever within via getting involved either.

My Name Is Pavo...

So next on my list of Pavo targets is "JG and/or Zeal" apparently. JG, Zeal, do you have a preference as to who goes first? Or who goes at all?

Edited by Umbramatic on Dec 28th 2022 at 12:31:51 PM

RE: Pavo

This was a long time coming due to various intervening circumstances (a cold, the chores I needed to do, eating and resting) but now that all of that has been properly addressed, I can post my response:

Going by primacy, Zeal was the one to pitch first, but if she's unavailable the next person in line is me.

I am on a laptop now with an Internet connection I can handwave as "stable" as long as it's in the right room for it. I do have chores intervening but that's hardly a difference to business as usual where I must contend with work. That said, my sister is getting hitched the week after New Year's so I will not be available on that weekend.

I would suggest it'd be the person who is available sooner. I cannot speak for Zeal, but if she's available, she goes first.

Edited by MasterJayAM on Dec 29th 2022 at 5:11:39 AM

OK given that and Zeal stating she has no preference in chat I think I'll go with Zeal first

Hey, so! I want to potentially open up upcoming plans for a potential full-scale School attack, since at least one person has already asked about it.

So, the attack that's currently in the queue is Nitrogen's plot to remove at least one or more of Kai, Brie, and Alice from the picture in one way or another. The idea was a "divide and conquer" type of attack, striking the three separately and simultaneously to prevent them from calling for each other's help.

Potentially, if we want to expand this a bit, word could spread amongst the School of this plan, and other similar simultaneous attacks could occur. Something I want to encourage with this is a balance of wins and losses — not necessarily character deaths, of course. Resources thought to be safely in the hands of the J-Team ending up getting taken by the School, team members whose minds have been compromised by encounters with this very heavily Psychic organization, and so on. I think that would go a long way toward making the School feel threatening, rather than simply insurmountable like they've sort of been thus far.

Of course, this will take some setup, some of which is still in the works. So I wanna open this up to the planning stage.

School Assault

I've actually been planning of debuting Angelica for a while, as well as having Tanya get tired of sitting around in a Palace.

Tanya only has one target she cares about, and that's Ludmilla. That's a duel nobody is gonna be able to intervene in.

Angelica, meanwhile, is a whole new kind of monster and I am so excited to show her off if anyone is willing to go up against an opponent I haven't even hinted at the capabilities of.

School Assaults

Yeah, I'm kinda thinking about getting in on this too.

Cesium and Bismuth's blind spots need to be exploited.