Needs a cool picture.: Determinator

"No, there SHALL be an image." - d Roy

Is that supposed to be some self-demonstrating example of the trope itself?

A historical, patriotic, inspirational◊ example◊ of some true real life determinators◊.

You can red the history behind the photo/statue here.

Surely something that's a historical example of the trope should satisfy most of us?!

edited 21st Apr '11 12:34:12 PM by marheavenangel89

Added.

Isn't a large part of the determinator trope that the perseverance is against overwhelmingly bad odds? To quote the article:
"They do not understand tact. They do not Know When To Fold Em, and it's a waste of time to tell them the odds."
Here's a quote from the Iwo Jima article:
"The Americans possessed an overwhelming superiority in arms and numbers; this, coupled with the impossibility of Japanese retreat or reinforcement, ensured that there was no plausible scenario in which the U.S. could have lost the battle."

Seems to me like a borderline case of Not An Example, but that might just be a result of my inherent dislike of patriotism.

edited 22nd Apr '11 5:13:53 AM by ArtisticPlatypus

Come to think of it, Rule Of Cautious Editing Judgment might suggest a US-centric example might not be the best one to go for anyway, apart from the ambiguity of its example status.

Again, though, there are probably hundreds of motivational posters related to determination out there. Like I suggested earlier, google searches of words like persistence, perseverance, and determination would be a good way to find them.

Motivational poster with pictures of people climbing or running or doing something athletic is not the best way to look for an example.

edited 22nd Apr '11 8:43:19 AM by marheavenangel89

Why not?

Oh, and those are not the only things used on such motivational posters either.

Just a picture of people climbing, and some of the athletic ones yes are great examples, but not images, because we don't quite see the struggle, ESPECIALLY just the climbing pics, or someone running up stairs, (that one you don't even see the person's face)

At the same time, the commonality of such themes in determination-themed motivational posters should get the theme of the trope across anyway.

EDIT: Also, the difficulty in climbing or something like that is obvious without seeing a facial expression of struggling.

edited 22nd Apr '11 3:32:23 PM by neoYTPism

Not true.

I've climbed a mountain before. Yes it can be hard at some points, but no one ever really tells unless they ACTUALLY see you struggling.

Motivational posters do not make good page images.

What about Sisyphus◊, from Greek mythology?

I might have brought this up before, but I'll bring it up again. This might need a multi part picture, where we see someone getting beat up or knocked down in some way, but they still keep going.

You know, what popped into my mind was the boxing match in Family Guy where Carol Channing would keep getting pummeled by Mike Tyson, but she keeps getting back up. A clear parody of this, but also a clear example.

edited 23rd Apr '11 2:25:45 AM by DragonQuestZ

Liking the Sisyphus picture.

Added it to the crowner.

The "Luffy, climbing up a completely vertical mountain-in freezing weather, with no jacket, carrying two injured people, with his hands bleeding-and won't let go." image does not make clear what is going on in it, though it might have been a good page image if it were.

I vote for the Sisyphus one for now.

My issue with that image is that if it weren't for the overlong description, I would have no idea what was going on.

Sisyphus is much better.

edited 23rd Apr '11 1:26:44 PM by JapaneseTeeth

Weeeell, in terms of image itself and the concept demonstrated, there's no problem. But if you are familiar with the myth, you'll know that he's actually something of a Complete Monster getting a karmic punishment. Sure, you can't tell that in the picture, but still...

Would anyone support Carol Channing standing up to Mike Tyson? If so, I'll make the collage.

Might as well.

Okay, I have two versions up: an 8-panel picture and a 12-panel picture, whichever you feel best shows the trope.

@D Roy... I know he's a Complete Monster, does that matter? According to the page description, villains as well as heroes can be determinators. Not An Example is a perfectly valid reason to disqualify an image, but I think Sisyphus is an example.

edited 24th Apr '11 2:59:13 AM by ArtisticPlatypus

He has no choice. That's not determination, as that is to accomplish a goal, and he doesn't get to complete it.

What he said.

I see your point. This is actually pretty fascinating... The important part here - what actually makes him keep rolling the rock - is something I can't find mentioned. He was, according to wikipedia 'punished by being compelled to roll an immense boulder etcetera'... There is no mentioned punishment for not doing it. He's just supposed to do it, and does.

In any case, it's not a perfectly straight example of the trope. I support the family guy collage.

As far as I am aware, what is relevant is more so whether or not it looks like an example than whether or not it actually is one. If misleading, it is only to those familiar with the context.