General Sonic The Hedgehog thread

Honestly the branching paths idea was fine, but was foolish to tie to a morality system for a character that was going to be heroic in the end anyway.

Star Fox 64 had the right idea in tying that concept to stuff like timing, hidden routes, or manner in defeating bosses. If that had been utilized in Shadow the game would still be flawed, but the gameplay would not have been railroaded into eliminating enemies/collectathon missions and the story could have been better accommodated.

Edited by BorneAgain on Apr 8th 2020 at 7:51:52 AM

Well, it's like people have been saying:

Sonic as a series has been refusing to commit to one direction the moment they receive even a tiny bit of negativity.

I mean, I'm not even sure why they didn't stick with the Adventure style. It was working, but they threw it out for both Heroes and Shadow...and then brought it back for 06, which is probably what did it in.

They just don't seem to want to commit to one idea because they're afraid of any criticism.

Then they got it right with Colors and Generations, made a quirky spinoff, and that game got hammered so bad they made Forces, which somehow managed to screw up the Boost formula.

Sonic Team definitely has a "it's not working! Jettison everything!" mentality, especially for the past decade or so, which sucks given how most of their problems isn't the concepts' faults, it's their execution.

As a result, there's as many problems caused by their constant attempts to take 180's as there is with regular mistakes. More, even. Most of the big stuff people complain about have their roots in them trying to reinvent the wheel.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Apr 8th 2020 at 6:59:16 AM

Man these "Evolution of" videos are fun.

Another problem is that Sonic Team apparently has an unusually high turnover rate. Probably due to mistreatment from Sega.

I'm not even going to say Forces was bad so much as underbaked. If I remember correctly, they spent three years of their four year dev cycle making the engine. Meaning they cobbled together what they had more the game in around a year. If SEGA had shown more confidence in Mania, Forces could have had 6 more months easy.

I've actually heard Sega is one of the more forward thinking game devs. Why do you say it's mistreatment?

Nearly every single Sonic game has had some sort of Troubled Production, even the classic games.

Takashi Iizuka himself lost 22 pounds during the development of Sonic Heroes due to crunch time. Dude almost died.

Edited by Primis on Apr 8th 2020 at 7:36:50 AM

Okay decades of troubled production is a pretty good indication of terrible as shit management.

So I was wrong, I guess. I was gonna say "that's normal for game development" but probably shouldn't normalize unethical and downright barbaric treatment of game devs.

Edited by RodimusMinor on Apr 8th 2020 at 10:36:03 AM

Good grief.

Get your shit together Sega!

I also know from interviews with Big Red Button (Sonic Boom) that SEGA can be very fickle with their demands while offering little input from the devs. The deal with Nintendo for three (?) exclusive titles was made entirely without dev input or foreknowledge. That Crysis Engine co-op focused game you're making for the Xbox and Playstation is now a solo player Wii U exclusive.

With Sonic Heroes, there was also Sega demanding it made a multi-platform game (supposedly because of a deal with Sony) despite Sonic Team only having experience with the Gamecube at the time, leading to the Xbox and especially PS2 versions of the game to have issues.

I've also heard Sega restructured Sonic Team after Generations, having much of its staff now working on the Mario & Sonic Olympics games and filling Sonic Team with new hires. This is why there was such a shift in style and quality for Lost World and Forces.

Dumbass Sega executives + traditional Japanese culture = Hell nah, to the nah, nah, NAH!

Compare this to the Yakuza games, Sega's current golden boy who can constantly launch games with consistent quality & reused assets.

So Sega has no idea on how to handle the franchise that's responsible for them even being around as a publisher? smh.

About Heroes, IIRC, Sony bullied Sega into making the PS 2 version of that game as I think Heroes was gonna be Game Cube and Xbox only, but Sony said that if Sega didn't release Heroes for PS 2, then Sega could not release a game on their platform ever again (and since the PS 2 was trouncing the other two consoles in sales, you could not take this threat lightly).

Well, this is a surprise (to me, at least)!

Anyone remember Sonic Chronicles: The Dark Brotherhood, the Sonic RPG from BioWare that had such promise, but ended up underwhelming and caused Ken Penders to go on a legal rampage?

Apparently, a little indie team decided to reimagine the whole shebang!

(Please God, do not let Ken Penders shut this down...)

You know, as bad as the Sonic fanbase can get, it's projects like this that make me think it's simultaneously one of the best things about the franchise because some of the fan content is really impressive in its quality and passion that went into it.

For all of the issues that Sega has; they're one of the very few companies who actively encourage fan content from the community. And in the best case scenarios, will actually hire them to make a video game

Man there are so many videos of people wremaking & fixing the games like 2006 & Forces. It impresses me honestly to see so many dedicated people & with such talent.

Also to further the Yakuza contrast. Yakuza just released a mainline title that completely shifted the games general gameplay from brawler to full on RPG & from what I hear the change is pretty well polished.

Honestly, if they fix the music and touch up the gameplay, Chronicles would actually be great. I'm hoping penders doesn't kill this one.

Can't say the Sonic fanbase isn't a talented bunch.

Hot damn I love those Chao designs

The Sonic fanbase is capable of the most amazing things and the most horrible things. Look at Sonic Mania and Sonichu.