Super Smash Bros.

Add me into the "annoyed with that mentality" group because it also ignores that the first form of indie representation in Smash was Commander Video from the Bit Trip series in the form of a trophy back in Smash Wii U. Nintendo themselves even made big deal about it seeing that they revealed they were doing that in a Nintendo Direct.

If Nintendo was willing to do that then I'm fairly certain that they are very much open to considering some form of representation from Indie games that aren't Shovel Knight or Undertale.

It's not a matter of putting them up on a pedestal, it's just reality.

Undertale is one of the most popular indie games of all time. It's mainstream in a way that most indie games are not. The game sold millions of copies across multiple platforms. It has a costume in Smash that managed to completely overshadow two new actual characters. The fact of the matter is, there are extremely few other indie games, or even indie game franchises, with the presence or popularity to make it into Smash in some capacity, especially given its closest rivals are either already a spirit (Shantae) or an Assist Trophy (Shovel Knight).

You know, the "Has to be in a nintendo console" rule is technically not broken yet.

So, who could be the one character (videogame only) that could break that rule?

Master Chief?

2B?

Sackboy, perhaps?

@fasoman: That's never been an official rule, though. Just one that we all assume.

Still, to pick one character who has no representation on any Nintendo console... Master Chief seems like the most likely possibility. Sackboy would probably be the most shocking, the one nobody would seriously see coming.

Hmm... part of me wants to look at other fighting games. I mean, we've got Ryu and Terry now; what other ones could make it into Smash? BlazBlue and Guilty Gear have pretty strong and dedicated fanbases (well, kinda the same one - there's a lot of overlap between them), not to mention they did just announce a new game for the latter. I feel like Sol Badguy or Ragna the Bloodedge (probably Sol, if I were to guess) are reasonable possibilities. That said, Namco has long competed for dominance in the genre; Heihachi or Nightmare might make it.

I feel like a Tekken character is the most likely.

I hope they keep the fighting game characters to a minimum.

Yeah we don't need a bunch of Fighting Game characters.

Smash was designed specifically to be more simplistic and easy to pick up than actual Fighting Games, and including a bunch of overly complicated FGCs kind of goes against that.

Like Ryu and Ken are cool and all but they're not fun to play at all because they're too close to what they'd play like in their own games. (Bayonetta also has that problem even if she's not a FGC.)

Edited by Karxrida on Sep 17th 2019 at 1:42:14 AM

I don't think they'd do two fighting game characters in a row. Later we could see some more, but for now I'd expect them to go for another genre with less fan overlap.

Not for you, but if your roster is going to approach a hundred different characters having a tiny handful that aren't as easy to pick up and play as the rest isn't a problem. If you can't play Ryu or Terry just pick... just about anyone else.

You don't even have to do the fighting game inputs for those characters if you don't want to.

Edited by Hashil on Sep 17th 2019 at 2:45:20 AM

eh? Ryu and Ken's traditional inputs are all mapped to the b-button, the only "traditional" aspect they have is that you can also do the actual input for their specials as well.

Edited by EpicBleye on Sep 17th 2019 at 4:48:18 AM

You have to if you want to play them optimally, though, since those inputs give them extra power.

I like the idea of being able to use those inputs as alternatives to just regular B-moves, but I feel like it should just be a cute easter egg, not a mandate of higher play. Doing those inputs in Smash's engine feels really weird and awkward.

I mean my issue with fighting game characters is that they're more than likely just going to be transplanted from their home games into Smash with the same moves and animations and very little in the way of new stuff unlike pretty much every other character in the game.

Edited by LordVatek on Sep 17th 2019 at 4:51:07 AM

if you're looking at playing them "optimally" then this very quickly stops being about being easy to pick up.

most characters in this game have mechanics or tricks to their character that are a lot more complicated than "doing a traditional FG input"

The "new" stuff has mostly been recycled normals from other characters. Joker, Banjo, and Hero's material that isn't heavily inspired by or transplanted from their home games is exactly that.

And so what if you need the inputs for higher level play? Anyone wanting to compete with these characters is going to learn and optimize these inputs, anyway. And anyone who just wants to play casually can press B and a direction like everybody else, and the difference isn't significant enough that they'll have less fun for it.

x4 It's really not that much weirder than doing them normally.

Plus...there's the no turn around thing in Ultimate that's suppose to make it easier.

Edited by randomness4 on Sep 17th 2019 at 1:56:26 AM

It feels like unnecessary "input tax" to me, is the point.

But for them, even the stuff that is taken from their home game is changed enough to be entirely new (I don't know that for a fact about Banjo but I'm assuming it's still the case). Like Hero's Final Smash is new, as are the interpretations of his spells. The command menu is taken straight from the games but since this is a fighting game and not an RPG, it's something unique and interesting.

You take stuff from a fighting game and put it in a different fighting game and it's still just... fighting game stuff.

Edited by LordVatek on Sep 17th 2019 at 5:02:42 AM

Seeing how Ryu, Ken, and Terry's movesets, movement, and capabilities are reinterpreted for a platform fighter is just as interesting as seeing Hero's spells or BK's Wonderwing re-imagined, at least for me, especially when we bring things that we don't typically see into Smash like pressure sensitive normals, armored moves like the Shoto's focus attack, and I'm sure we'll see things like the MAX meter from KOF brought in with Terry.

As far as there being an input tax to perform well with these characters... again, so what? Sometimes you get more complicated characters in a fighting game. Playing around with Duck hunt and Pacman's bizarre tools requires even more practice than anything Ryu or Ken do.

Think they might give him some form of plane switching?

Considering plane switching would be absolutely broken in a game not designed for it... but this is still the team that thought Bayonetta was a good idea... I hope not.

How would they do that?

Maybe for a stage, but not a move.

And if it's more accessible than Jungle Hijinx, that'd be fine.

But that's practically an argument from most characters.

Edited by Ookamikun on Sep 17th 2019 at 5:29:06 PM