History YMMV / OctopathTraveler

** Werner. [[spoiler:Despite being praised for being an effective [[{{Foil}} contrast]] to Olberic, raising the stakes of his story and being [[ThatOneBoss one of the most difficult Chapter 4 bosses]], he has also been criticised for his existence being revealed near the end of Olberic's Chapter 3, leaving him feeling thrown in for the sake of a final chapter and boss. Some fans believe that Olberic's story peaks at Chapter 3 because of this, as his emotional reunion and eventual reconciliation with Erhardt is widely agreed to be one of the best moments in the game. Some fans also believe that Werner should have been swapped chapter-wise to be the second-to-last boss instead.]]

** Olberic's DuelBoss with Erhardt isn't an outright difficult fight, since the game accounts for the fact you are fighting a single enemy with Olberic by making sure Erhardt is closer to a beefed up NPC. However, the player isn't given much warning that the fight will be like this, so the fight can become really hard if the player has not accounted for Olberic having to be alone in the fight, and can potentially become unwinnable due to that. So if the player has invested in Olberic and uses the chance to make sure he is equipped to tackle it, the fight isn't too hard, but if not, it can lock progression for a bit. Also, if you lose the fight with Erhardt, you'll have to fight the Lizardman Chieftain boss again.
** H'aanit's Provoke fight against Alaic is almost entirely dependent on how much the player has used H'aanit's Capture mechanic to get monsters. If the player has maintained a decent variety of captured monsters, the fight is not too bad, but if not, the player will potentially be stuck for a long time with Linde as the only option, and Alaic himself isn't a pushover, so the player will likely have to spend a while catching new monsters specifically aimed at beating him to progress..

* StrawmanHasAPoint: [[spoiler:When Mattias has his third BossBanter with Ophilia, he tells her that Lianna's desire to resurrect her father is more important to her than her and Ophilia's sisterhood, and that Lianna never considered Ophilia family. Ophilia counters that Lianna once helped her recover from the pain of her parents' deaths with her kindness and love. However, some players--particularly those who think Lianna is UnintentionallyUnsympathetic--believe that Mattias makes the stronger argument, even if Ophilia and Lianna are close friends; not only was Lianna willing to drug her adopted sister with a sleeping draught so that she could steal Aelfric's Lanthorn to use in a ritual to the local GodOfEvil for the mere ''chance'' to resurrect her father--which turned out to be a false hope--but after Mattias admits that the ritual's true purpose is to sacrifice his followers to said dark god in exchange for power to TakeOverTheWorld, Lianna admits that she still can't think of anything over than her desire to see her father again, leaving it [[AmbiguouslyEvil uncertain if she would have aided Mattias if he had already told her that the ritual requires sacrifices]]. Japanese culture's views on orphans like Ophilia doesn't help, either.]]

* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: For some, [[spoiler:Lianna]]. While they were in a very vulnerable (and possibly broken) state of mind after [[spoiler:her father, Archbishop Josef, falls seriously ill and eventually dies]], and later becomes TheAtoner, [[NeverLiveItDown some still view them]] as a [[HorribleJudgeOfCharacter naïve]], [[DidntThinkThisThrough impulsive]] idiot for believing that [[spoiler:joining a {{cult}} that worships [[GodOfEvil Galdera]], and incapacitating her adopted sister with a sleeping draught to steal [[GodOfGood Aelfric]]'s Ember, would lead to Josef's resurrection]]. It doesn't help that [[spoiler:Lianna is unable to stop longing for Josef's resurrection [[AmbiguouslyEvil even after Mattias reveals that the ritual's true purpose is to sacrifice his followers to Galdera in exchange for power and that the ritual is powered by her desire to bring back the dead]]]], or that [[spoiler:Mattias' plan depended on Lianna being naïve enough to believe his false promises; if she had rejected his offer, his entire plan would have been foiled right then and there]].

** [[spoiler:Werner]], the main antagonist of Olberic’s route, can claim to have crossed it several times over. Take your pick:

* TrappedByMountainLions: Tressa's story is seen by some players as the weakest, because it doesn't feel like it connects to the background and wider story the game presents in the end. All of the other characters have direct ties to the main story, and their stories setup mysteries or reveals that connect them to it in some way. In comparison, Tressa's story is almost completely self-contained and focused on her being a merchant with very little direct ties to the greater story except for two very weak ties that come as afterthoughts meant to ensure she is connected somehow [[note]]That being the journal found early on being Graham Crossford's, and her fighting Esmeralda, a member of the Obsidians. Both feel like they were thrown in because without them she wouldn't have any real reason to be a main character compared to everyone else[[/note]]. While her story isn't seen as badly written, it can come across as having no real reason for Tressa to exist compared to the other characters, with some feeling you can skip through it and not lose anything for it, which can't be said for the other stories. (And while you have the option to not recruit her, you probably won't, because Merchant is one of the most versatile and practical classes in the game.)

* CheeseStategy: Dreisang and Steorra can be cheesed with a [[GameBreaker Sealtige's Seduction + Reflective Veil]] combo (all their attacks are elemental, meaning that this combo can and will reflect their attacks), and Winnehild with [[MemeticBadass Runelord Tressa]] (all her attacks are physical, so with Transfer Rune, followed by Sidestep, Tressa can nullify all damage).

** The four characters who aren't in your active party are explicitly left behind at the nearest town. As such, there's no LeakedExperience, resulting in ForcedLevelGrinding to get those other four back up to snuff. Because of this, many players tend to use only their four best/favorite members... but this inevitably catches up with them at...

** Ophilia's final boss can unleash a dark flame that disables the party's area magic until being broken, which is especially problematic for healers. Given that it cannot be cured by an apothecary, AND that he is likely to have summoned his two minions who prevent him from being broken, thus forcing you to kill them before you can break him, the attack has the potential of turning a pretty average boss fight into a borderline ThatOneBoss.

** Ophilia's final boss can unleash a dark flame that disables the party's area magic until being broken, which is especially problematic for healers. Given that it cannot be cured by an apothecary, the attack has the potential of turning a pretty average boss fight into a borderline ThatOneBoss.

** There's also a tree-like enemy whose name is "Raging Wood".

** Olberic's DuelBoss with Erhardt isn't an outright difficult fight, since the game accounts for the fact you are fighting a single enemy with Olberic by making sure Erhardt is closer to a beefed up NPC. However, the player isn't given much warning that the fight will be like this, so the fight can become really hard if the player has not accounted for Olberic having to be alone in the fight, and can potentially become unwinnable due to that. So if the player has invested in Olberic and uses the chance to make sure he is equipped to tackle it, the fight isn't too hard, but if not, it can lock progression for a bit.

** Among the playable characters, Tressa receives this treatment the most, especially after becoming a Runelord. There's also the fact she has to deal with everyone else's trauma, yet she stays cheerful through the whole ordeal.

** Olberic also receives this treatment, both out of universe and even in-universe, especially after becoming a Warmaster.

** Primrose is no slouch either, since she's been shipped with pretty much every other traveler. It helps that Primrose loves teasing the other travelers.

* MemeticBadass: Alfyn's chapter 3 boss, [[spoiler:Miguel]], is regarded as completely unstoppable by the fanbase due to his ThatOneBoss status and being able to fight the entire party to a standstill while recovering from mortal wounds. Jokes abound that if he were in his prime, ''nothing'' could stop him, not even the TrueFinalBoss.

* ComplacentGamingSyndrome: Almost everyone has Tressa as a Runelord and Olberic as a Warmaster due to the sheer [[GameBreaker overpowerness]] of these combinations.

** Werner. [[spoiler:Despite being praised for being an effective [[{{Foil}} contrast]] to Olberic, raising the stakes of his story and being [[ThatOneBoss one of the most difficult Chapter 4 bosses]], he has also been criticised for his existence being revealed near the end of Olberic's Chapter 3, leaving him feeling thrown in for the sake of a final chapter and boss. Some fans believe that Olberic's story peaks at Chapter 3 because of this, as his emotional reunion and eventual reconciliation with Erhardt is widely agreed to be one of the best moments in the game, with some feeling that Werner should have been swapped chapter wise to be the second to last boss instead.]]

** Whichever character you pick as your protagonist ''cannot be removed from the party'' until you complete their 4th chapter. While this actually solves the above problem -- just start as Therion -- this is still a problem for completionists who like to keep their whole party at roughly equal levels. Additionally, it feeds into an additional problem where leveling the other characters becomes significantly harder, because only three of your four slots can be adjusted, causing one character to be substantially higher level for a while.
** There's no LeakedExperience in this game, resulting in ForcedLevelGrinding if you want the characters you don't use as much to keep pace with everyone else, especially since the endgame requires all eight party members. Because of this, many players tend to use only their four best/favorite members... but this inevitably catches up with them at...

*** You need ''two parties'' for the TrueFinalBoss of four each; all eight of your characters take the field at the same time. This is an especially rude awakening for people who tend to use one party for most of the game, trading in second-string characters only when their Chapters require them to. Additionally, the two-party situation precludes using your favorite party setup, since if you do, your other group will almost inevitably be sub-optimal.

** When its HP gets low enough, the Ogre Eagle will unleash a poison upon the whole party than cannot be cured and will gradually lower the party's max HP.

** Ophilia, Chapter 3: [[spoiler:the Mystery Man and the Shady Figure, two kidnappers who work for the Savior]]. This is a DualBoss fight between two entities that lack a shared weakness, meaning that they're unlikely to be broken on the same turn without extra effort from the player. Also, their elemental weaknesses get locked out after the first turn so long as both are alive, further narrowing the opportunity. They'll be constantly be barraging the group with whole-party elemental attacks, buff each other, and one will cast a 800 point heal to both of them (at a point in the game where you're likely only powerful enough to just barely hit quad digit damage) if they're able to act during their turn should their health fall low enough. If one dies before the other, they'll either start barraging the party with buffed two-hit spells or spam heavy damage on your debuffed party. Might want to start praying to Sealticge on this one unless you want to grind like crazy.

* TrappedByMountainLions: Tressa's story is seen by some players as the weakest, because it doesn't feel like it connects to the background and wider story the game presents in the end. All of the other characters have direct ties to the main story, and their stories setup mysteries or reveals that connect them to it in some way. In comparison, Tressa's story is almost completely self-contained and focused on her being a merchant with very little direct ties to the greater story except for two very weak ties that come as afterthoughts meant to ensure she is connected somehow [[note]]That being the journal found early on being Graham Crossford's, and her fighting Esmeralda, a member of the Obsidians. Both feel like they were thrown in because without them she wouldn't have any real reason to be a main character compared to everyone else[[/note]]. While her story isn't seen as badly written, it can come across as having no real reason for Tressa to exist compared to the other characters, with some feeling you can skip through it and not lose anything for it, which can't be said for the other stories.

** In the original Japanese, Lianna seems to be the only person Ophilia refers to without honorifics (by comparison, she uses "-san" on her fellow travelers). The closeness Ophilia and Lianna have is conveyed in the English version by having them call each other [[AffectionateNickname "Anna" and "Phili"]].

* {{Narm}}: Alfyn's second boss suddenly reveals they test their harmful "cures" on kittens right before you fight them, making a fairly grounded villain scamming desperate townspeople with sick children out of all their money suddenly cartoonishly evil.

** Whichever character you pick as your protagonist ''cannot be removed from the party'' until you complete their 4th chapter. While this actually solves the above problem -- just start as Therion -- this is still a problem for completionists who like to keep their whole party at roughly equal levels. Additionally, it feeds into a second problem...

* SugarWiki/SuperlativeDubbing: Many people have praised the English dubbing of the game for its casting choices, as well as the actors in question putting enough character into their lines to avoid anything coming off as stilted.

** Werner. [[spoiler:Despite being praised for being an effective [[{{Foil}} contrast]] to Olberic, raising the stakes of his story and being [[ThatOneBoss one of the most difficult Chapter 4 bosses]], he has also been criticised for his existence being revealed near the end of Olberic's Chapter 3, leaving him feeling thrown in for the sake of a final chapter and boss. Some fans believe that Olberic's story peaks at Chapter 3 because of this, as his emotional reunion and eventual reconciliation with Erhardt is widely agreed to be one of the best moments in the game.]]

* TrappedByMountainLions: Tressa's story is seen by some players as the weakest, because it doesn't feel like it connects to the background and wider story the game presents in the end. All of the other characters have direct ties to the main story, and their stories setup mysteries or reveals that connect them to it in some way. In comparison, Tressa's story is almost completely self-contained and focused on her being a merchant with very little direct ties to the greater story except for two very weak ties that come as afterthoughts meant to ensure she is connected somehow [[note]]That being the journal found early on being Graham Crossford's, and her fighting Esmeralda, a member of the Obsidians. Both feel like they were thrown in because without them she wouldn't have any real reason to be a main character compared to everyone else[[/note]]. While her story isn't seen as badly written, it can come across as having no real reason for Tressa to exist compared to the other characters, with some feeling you can skip through it and not lose anything for it.

** There's no LeakedExperience in this game, resulting in ForcedLevelGrinding if you want the characters you don't use as much to keep pace with everyone else, especially since the endgame requires all eight party members. Meanwhile, your designated protagonist will inevitably become several levels ahead of the others, which in turn will cause tougher enemies to appear that are a pain for the lower-leveled characters you're trying to grind in the first place. Because of this, many players tend to use only their four best/favorite members... but this inevitably catches up with them at...

* {{Narm}}:
** The battle against [[spoiler: Werner]] features him riding a horse in his combat sprite. Indoors. Before and after the fight, he does not have a horse with him. It's possible the fight originally took place elsewhere, but as it stands, he now just produces a horse solely for the boss fight and it's kind of silly. May cross into NarmCharm for how good the sprite looks otherwise.
** Similarly, the battles against Helgenish and [[spoiler:Simeon's first phase]] feature them sitting on a chair in their battle sprites. Both times, the chair comes completely out of nowhere and disappears afterwards. In Helgenish's case, he's even holding a glass of wine, which also comes completely out of nowhere and is nowhere to be seen in the battle's aftermath, shattered or otherwise. [[spoiler:Simeon's first phase is a BattleInTheCenterOfTheMind (and takes place in a theater with chairs at least present), somewhat mitigating the Narm.]]
** Handshakes look like fist bumps due to the sprites.
** In Ophilia's Chapter 1, the crying little boy you have to guide to his mother is ''clearly'' voiced by a grown man. Similarly, Therion's backstory involves him and Darius (as youngsters) speaking in their adult voices.
** Alfyn's second boss reveals they test their deadly medicine on kittens right before you fight them, which is almost just comically ''too'' evil, like the audience wouldn't get how evil they were before this.

* ValuesDissonance: Ophilia's relationship with her adoptive father and sister involves significant cultural differences between Japan and the West about adoption.
** Ophilia addresses Josef as "Your/His Excellency". This comes across as oddly formal and distant to a Westerner, especially when the story emphasizes both how proud Josef is to have Ophilia as a daughter, and how Lianna instantly grows attached to Ophilia when they first met. In Japan, orphans have a long history of being in a socially-awkward position, and are encouraged to be constantly deferential to their parental figures, even more than is usually considered appropriate in Japan. Traditionally, taking in an orphan was considered a huge act of charity on the part of the adopting family, and adopted orphans are expected to treat their adoptive parents with almost-reverent gratitude. Ophilia's deferential behavior and language choice is thus in line with how an orphan is expected to act toward their adoptive family from a Japanese perspective.
** Josef and Lianna insist that their kindness toward Ophilia is just what family members do for each other; this is meant to mark them as exceptionally remarkable and loving people in Japan, whereas this would be the expected attitude towards an adopted child in the West, so it comes across as them being CaptainObvious instead.
** When Ophilia is told by a local resident that Josef frequently praises his two daughters, Ophilia is overjoyed, but also surprised, that Josef would even consider her his daughter. This comes across to a Westerner as Ophilia being incredibly naïve. In Japan, adopted orphans being seen as outsiders in the family is the norm, so the average first-time Japanese player would be just as surprised as Ophilia is.
** Japan's views on adoption are reinforced by Lianna's word choice in the beginning of Ophilia's Chapter 1. She refers to Josef, when in conversation with Ophilia, as "My father."[[labelnote:Context]]She does so when mentioning that her father was the one who took on the Kindling years ago, and that she will follow in his footsteps[[/labelnote]] She repeats this, also in conversation with Ophilia, when anguishing over his illness and the effect it has on her. Each time it emphasizes to Ophilia that, while she acknowledges Ophilia as family, there remains some disparity in her mind about her place in their family and Ophilia's place in it. This may be part of the reason why [[spoiler:she believes Ophilia doesn't love Josef as strongly as she does when she steals the ember to try to bring Josef back.]]
** In conclusion, while a Westerner would still see the three of them as a loving family, Ophilia's overtly formal behavior towards her adoptive family would be seen as a bit odd.

* TrappedByMountainLions: Tressa's story is seen by some players as the weakest, because it doesn't feel like it connects to the background and wider story the game presents in the end. All of the other characters have direct ties to the main story, and their stories setup mysteries or reveals that connect them to it in some way. In comparison, Tressa's story is almost completely self-contained and focused on her being a merchant with very little direct ties to the greater story except for two very weak ties that come as afterthoughts meant to ensure she is connected somehow [[note]]That being the journal found early on being Graham Crossford's, and her fighting Esmeralda, a member of the Obsidians. Both feel like they were thrown in because without them she wouldn't have any real to be a main character compared to everyone else.[[/note]]. While her story isn't seen as badly written, it can come across as having no real reason for Tressa to exist compared to the other characters, with some feeling you can skip through it and not lose anything for it.

** Therion is more commonly shipped with Ophilia or with Alfyn than with [[spoiler:Cordelia Ravus]], his love interest suggested in the post-game, at least on Tumblr.
*** Oh, and Cordelia is lucky since at least there are people who ship Therion and her (and not just Noa Wyndham, who is an in-universe example). Almost nobody ships Primrose with Jan Forsythe, her post-game-suggested love interest; instead, Primrose is shipped with another one of the travelers.

*** [[spoiler:Somewhat softened upon the completion of the TrueFinalBoss, wherein Kit does manage to speak with his father's spirit and attain closure.]]
*** The party banters between H'aanit and Alfyn, in which they talk about the people they look up to (Z'aanta and the man who saved Alfyn's life), [[spoiler: become more somber if you consider that Graham, the man Alfyn looks up to, is Redeye, the beast H'aanit must save Z'aanta from.]]

*** [[spoiler:Yvon]] himself seemingly crossed it when [[spoiler:he orchestrated the plot to kill Cyrus [[HeKnowsTooMuch for finding out too much]] about ''From the Far Reaches of Hell'', by having Lucia [[LuredIntoATrap lure him into a trap]]]]. However, lore in TheVeryDefinitelyFinalDungeon reveals that he actually crossed it years before the plot even began, when he [[spoiler:murdered the then-headmaster of the Royal Academy of Atlasdam [[KlingonPromotion to usurp the position]] and gain access to ''From the Far Reaches of Hell'', [[EntitledBastard believing himself to be more deserving of the position and its privileges]]]].

*** Similarly, the battles against Helgenish and [[spoiler:Simeon's first phase]] feature them sitting on a chair in their battle sprites. Both times, the chair comes completely out of nowhere and disappears afterwards. In Helgenish's case, he's even holding a glass of wine, which also comes completely out of nowhere and is nowhere to be seen in the battle's aftermath, shattered or otherwise. [[spoiler:Simeon's first phase is a BattleInTheCenterOfTheMind (and takes place in a theater with chairs at least present), somewhat mitigating the Narm.]]

*** Granted, it's otherwise an easy boss fight, and if you're constantly applying pressure, [[spoiler:Darius]] will really never get a chance to use it, but God help you if you let [[spoiler:Darius]] get off his super attack; [[spoiler:he ''steals every party member except [[FragileSpeedster Therion]]'', (if Therion is dead when this happens, enjoy a TotalPartyKill instead) which is ''really bad'' because Darius attacks three times a round, more than enough to knock Therion on his ass. Mercifully, [[AntiFrustrationFeatures while Darius constantly swaps his weaknesses, he'll always retain a weakness for daggers, a weapon Therion will always have on him, and the party members are returned if he's broken.]] What's ''not'' so merciful is that Darius has access to Unconsciousness attacks; if Therion is alone, Unconscious, and Darius has more than 2 points remaining until he breaks, you've functionally already lost.]]

* GoddamnedBoss: [[spoiler:Simeon]], Primrose's FinalBoss, doesn't hit as hard as other bosses. The main difficulty of the fight is the fact that the boss has the extremely annoying habit of constantly using an area attack that causes silence, crippling your party unless you have accessories that protect you from it. Also, he will obscure the turn interface towards the middle of the fight, so you will not know when your characters will act. Overall, it is a boss that is way more annoying than hard.

* AntiClimaxBoss: [[ZigZaggingTrope Zig-zagged]] with [[spoiler:Mattias]], the ArcVillain of Ophilia's story. The battle against him can be turned into a complete joke if the player uses the [[CheeseStrategy Sealticge's Seduction + Reflective Veil]] combo, due to the boss' reliance on magic attacks and inability to summon minions or [[AntiMagic seal your multi-target magic skills]] before his first Break. Cast Sealticge's Seduction on Ophilia[[note]]or anyone with the Cleric secondary job, but you have to bring Ophilia along for the fight anyway[[/note]], cast a MAX boosted Reflective Veil, and sit back and laugh as [[spoiler:Mattias]] damages himself with his own magic [[ArtificialStupidity over and over again]]. That said, if you battle [[spoiler:Mattias]] the traditional way, the fight can be legitimately difficult, as the boss later gains the ability to summon minions to seal his weaknesses, [[ThatOneAttack seal your multi-target magic skills]] (though Sealticge's Seduction can be used to bypass this), and his charged attack after he TurnsRed can inflict the Unconsciousness status on your entire party.

* ObviousJudas: Zig-zagged in Ophilia's route. [[spoiler:Lianna's betrayal is genuinely shocking, even though her motive -- her grief over her father's death and her desire to bring him back -- was established well enough to ensure that it doesn't come out of nowhere. Mattias, on the other hand, is shown suspiciously standing there after Ophilia hears of her father's collapse, and later expresses his doubts in the Sacred Flame after seeing much suffering in his life, making it much easier to guess that he's up to no good]].

** [[spoiler: Similarly, is unanimously agreed that [[GodOfEvil Galdera]] and [[DaddysLittleVillain Lyblac]] are monsters for what they did, but ''[[VideoGame/OctopathTravelerChampionsOfTheContinent Champions of the Continent]]'' reveals that the crime on the top of the list of accusations against Galdera, the death of his mother Orsa, was not his, but rather an accident. And with Galdera's father Finis wanting to ressurect Orsa and being willing to [[OffingTheOffspring kill some of his children to do so]], some people believe that Galdera's "betrayal" was an attempt to get back at his abusive father, only to fail due to Aelfric's interference, and that Galdera underwent SanitySlippage and MotiveDecay while sealed behind [[TheVeryDefinitelyFinalDungeon the Gate of Finis]], as an explanation to why he is the monster he is today.]]