History Main / GrapplingWithGrapplingRules

* ''{{Exalted}}'' too.

*** If you ''do'' understand the grappling rules, you get the [[GoodBadBugs grapple ball of speed]] [[http://www.giantitp.com/forums/archive/index.php?t-117648.html (explained in detail about 2/3 of the way down here)]], where the player characters can take turns pulling each other by intentionally failing their checks.

Contrast to regular combat, where the only relevant things are "Did I hit?" and "How much damage did I do?"[[hottip:*:Maybe, if you're really fancy, "Where did I hit?" or "[[DamageTyping What kind of damage did I do]]?"]], and you'll begin to understand why grappling is considered such a frightening topic.

* ''{{Exalted}}'' too.

** Third Edition has changed the grappling system to reduce the ludicrous levels of Grapple bonus and to make it easier for dextrous characters to avoid or break out of grapples.

** Applied to any RPG by Palladium. It's not that the rules were particularly complex or anything, but Palladium's rulebooks were so insanely organised that you would have to look in at least five places to find the rules covering anything. To crown it all, Palladium rulebooks usually didn't have indexes.

* ''DwarfFortress'', in this as in so many other things, is so beautifully detailed as to be nearly worthless. You can grab any visible body part of the opponent with any of your grasping limbs. Theoretically you can snap bones and break necks if you perform the proper sequence of operations, but mostly you'll end up awkwardly grasping and releasing the enemy's elbow several times.

** It's gotten a huge step up in comprehensibility with version .31.17, as instead of selecting from a single list containing ''every'' move possible, wrestling and the newly implemented aimed attacks let you select a target body part and limb used on separate menus.

*** In the 40d Fortress mode, having skill wrestlers was terrifyingly effective... they'd wade in against squads of enemies and soon there would be [[LudicrousJibs limbs ripped off and bodies flying frankly improbable distances]]. Been [[{{Nerf}} toned down a bit]] in the newer version of the game, mind you, and trying to wrestle a guy with an axe doesn't often end well.

** New [=WoD=] has a comparatively simple grappling system- and one that integrates well into the core rules. First, roll Strength plus Brawl minus Opponent's Defense to engage. Succeed, and you're grappling. The Grappling dice pool is Strength plus Brawl minus Opponent's Strength. If you get any successes, you can do stuff like hold your opponent down, damage them, or break free. If you don't, you can't. Damage is determined by the number of successes you have; any other actions forego damage. Breaking a hold requires you to beat their success pool, over and above getting a simple success. If you have a weapon, its dice add to your pool. Size doesn't come into it. Multiple opponents just add 1 to the effective Opponent's Strength pool for each extra combatant. Sure, it's more complex than simple combat, but it fits into one paragraph.

* Sort of averted in the ''HeroSystem'', in that the grappling rules aren't significantly more complicated than the rest of the combat system. Note, however, that Hero System is notorious for its {{Doorstopper}} rulebook.
* Completely averted in Evil Hat's TheDresdenFiles RPG. The system uses a simple "block" mechanic where you use an action to set a difficulty target that the opponent must overcome to do something you don't want them to. This simple mechanic works for protecting an ally with a magic shield, for laying down suppressive fire, for distracting a cop from noticing your friend sneaking away by fast-talking him, etc. Grappling is just a special case of making a Might-based block with the added option of being able to move the victim or do a little free damage to them for a -1 penalty to the Might check.
* ProfessionalWrestling games try to find some way of adapting, for the obvious reason. Most settle for defining particular manoeuvres (suplex, powerbomb, et cetera) as attacks. Depending on the game, moving a wrestler to another part of the arena could be a special action, a result of prior moves, or just a special effect that can be added on.

'''Anakin''': What? Aren't there rules for grappling in this game? [[RandomNumberGod Why is everyone covering their dice]]?

*** If you ''do'' understand the grappling rules, you get the [[GoodBadBugs grapple ball of speed]], where the player characters can take turns pulling each other by intentionally failing their checks.

** Has gotten a huge step in comprehensibility in version .31.17, as instead of selecting from a single list containing ''every'' move possible, wrestling and the newly implemented aimed attacks let you select a target body part and limb used on separate menus.

** Wrestling seems to be getting a huge step in comprehensibility in the next update, as instead of selecting from a single list containing ''every'' move possible, wrestling and the newly implemented aimed attacks let you select a target body part then choose an action to take in a separated menu.

** And you can too, [[DifficultButAwesome if you can find out the (admittedly insane) way to break bones, etc. every time.]]

* Completely averted in Evil Hat's TheDresdenFiles RPG. The system uses a simple "block" mechanic where you use up an action to set a difficulty target that the opponent must overcome to do something you wish to prevent. The same simple block mechanic works for protecting an ally with a magic shield, laying down suppressive fire, or distracting a cop from noticing your friend sneaking away by fast-talking him. Grappling is just a special case of using Might as a block with the added bonus of being able to move the victim or do a little free damage to them for -1 penalty to the Might check.

** 3rd Edition fell prey to this in an interesting way. [[http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering---final/combat---final#TOC-Grapple Flowcharts]] are required to figure out what's going on in {{Pathfinder}}, and that's an incredibly cleaned up version of 3rd Edition's grappling rules. The original mechanics for grappling were ''worse''.

** And you can too, if you can find out the (admittedly insane) way to break bones, etc. every time.

** In the latest edition, performing a "pinch" as a coup-de-gras on an unconscious opponent ''[[OffWithHisHead causes their head to pop off and fly several meters]]''.

If you're wondering why so few VideoGames have anything to do with grappling (besides pure [[FightingGame FightingGames]]), well, now you know.

** That said, NPC wresters can [[GameBreaker wrestle anything to death]].

** In the latest edition, performing a NervePinch as a coup-de-gras on an unconscious opponent ''[[BloodyHilarious causes their head to pop off and fly several meters]]''.

<<|TabletopGames|>>

** This is primarily a reference to 3rd ed. DnD, which allowed dozens of tiny creatures to gang up on large ones, each one gaining a significant bonus for every other combatant. Or at least, allowing sixteen grapple rolls, one of which will inevitably be a CriticalHit.

* ''{{Rifts}}'' has about as straightforward, non functioning grappling rules as every other game.

* ''MutantsAndMasterminds'' uses a mildly tweaked version of the d20 grappling system with all of the attendant problems and difficulties. But the combination of a PointBuildSystem and SuperStrength (or {{Telekinesis}}) means that a grapple-oriented character with the right feats can easily break the system if the GM allows them to.